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General/Other - Sub-Zero Sub-Zero General Discussion

Nu-Skoool

Feel the nerf of despair
Does anyone feel like the special cancel window on f4 is bigger? It seems less strict than it did before.
 

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
Thanks for the info. I'm very good with that variation, but I don't think I could go too far with it. If normal ice hammer had faster startup and recovery things would be a lot better..i mained sub for a while but I think it's time to move on. I'm not interested in grandmaster..u mainly have to depend on corner game.
Yeah but how 'bout now tho :3

Go figure, they gave us both better start up and recovery. Not to mention all the other insane damage buffs through new combo routes that should bring you back around.
 

True

From Scrubs to Pros
Yeah but how 'bout now tho :3

Go figure, they gave us both better start up and recovery. Not to mention all the other insane damage buffs through new combo routes that should bring you back around.
Lol yeah I'm back in with Sub. NRS done us well.
 

Creepy00

Kombatant
Is it just me or Did RC bug make B2, RC, B12~Iceball harder to land? I can barely even do it now. Also, B2, RC, F42~Iceball leaves the opponent closer to the ground. It seems like there is a delay before you run after B2.
 

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
I don't think b2 cancels into a run. If anything, it's more like a run link. But nah, it doesn't feel that much harder. What's this bug you mentioned?
 

Creepy00

Kombatant
B2, B12~EX Iceball NJP, JIP, RC, 123 Slide does 33% midscreen. It is there as an option convert damage from a raw B2. You can do the same with B2, F42~Ex Iceball but it only does 30%, 3% less.

The reason I brought it up was because I'm having trouble landing B2, B12 Ex Iceball, which I could do before the latest patch. So I was wondering whether my timing is off, or if there is something to it.
 

Lokheit

Warrior
@Creepy00 man, now that you mentioned it... I can't land raw b2> b12 either. I can only hit it when preceded by a jip.
It looks harder now, not sure if it's because of the new change/bug with the run mechanic releasing slower now. I didn't have much problems with that because the variation that I use the most (Cryo) no longer needs B12 after B2 in any scenario, but toying with GM and UB it feels harder. Even 123slide feels harder to connect after the b2.
 

Creepy00

Kombatant
See I was right. I was going crazy earlier this morning as to why I couldn't do a simple run combo lol

As I said earlier, there seems to be a slight delay before you can run after B2. Before, you could run immediately after b2.
 

zoofs

bless
there is a slight delay with all run cancels in the game still, not sure why it exists but I guess its never going away. I actually occasionally drop ex ice bomb run f42 which never once happened before, it's pretty awful

oh and rip me ever touching a run cancel char again because I'm not going to readjust
 

Lokheit

Warrior
See I was right. I was going crazy earlier this morning as to why I couldn't do a simple run combo lol

As I said earlier, there seems to be a slight delay before you can run after B2. Before, you could run immediately after b2.
Yes with the big patch most "special move into run cancel" based characters were ruined, a hot fix helped with that but the run still seems to be releasing slower (my Warlock Quan Chi midscreen combos with a very fast run at the end can't connect if I juggle too much).

It's rumored that it could be a consequence to a nerf to either Tanya's teleport or Liu Kang RC extending to everyone but I'm not sure.
 

loogie

Kombatant
any tips fighting vs Jacqui? what are your experiences in this mathcup.
specifically GM vs Full Auto
 

STK

Beso de Muerte + Fantasía Oscura
not sure if this has been brought up but SZ d1 and d3 have been nerfed right? 9f? Where they not faster before the patch?
 

-narshkajke-

klone enthusiast
any tips fighting vs Jacqui? what are your experiences in this mathcup.
specifically GM vs Full Auto
neutral duck is your friend habibi, remember to block high on his ex machine gun. klone is not that good against machine gun.
you also can slide under machine gun.
 

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
So..........

I have been frantically wandering the forums, lost, in search of a new main to bring me back to MKX, A game that had all but abandoned for SFIV.. After a painfully long search and a lot of confusion, see-sawing and general whining on my part, I believe i have settled on Sub-Zero. I like what Cryo seems to be, and GM has the setups and general fun-sauce that is Ice Clone. I'll probably learn some Cryo first then begin learning GM alongside it. Cryo strikes me as easier to play effectively for a newb, simply because the clone requires setups and specific set-play to really blossom.

Now.. Why should you call care? I cant imagine you would, and I have no reason for you to do so.

HOWEVER! I am wondering if a.. I dunno, coach? sensei? trainer? is out there somewhere on PC? Someone interested in taking a relatively new player on and teaching him the ropes of MKX and Sub in general? I started with fighting games for the first time WITH MKX, so Im a newb to the whole genre. I vastly prefer having people I know to play with, rather than mindless ranked or online play. Its a lot more interesting with people to help you learn and to help you quantify your progress.

Any way, if anyone that plays on PC is interested, hit me up. In the meantime I think I'll take Cryo to the lab and tinkering some.
 

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
I don't think random online matches are mindless. And they totally quantify your progress, based on the amount of times your opponent y'know, brutally murders you.

If you can't find someone to level up with, save some matches and post them to the match footage page asking for advice.
 

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
I seee what you're saying and I do agree, but in my experience with random online matches I typically have to wade through 6-8 worthless fights to find one or two real fights. I don't know if its just bad luck on my part or what, but if I sit down.to play , say, 10 matches I'll get 6-8 that fall between too laggy to do anything at all, lagg tactic abuse (FA Jaqui or spamming in so much lagg its just gibberish) to the teleport/online abuse in general play that's just.. Random. I can't tell you how many Scorpions and Ermacs I've come across that LITERALLY just teleport, over and over and over, with too much delay to punish. I had an Ermac last.night that could teleport, I could block, and try to punish, but he could teleport punish my.punish to.his teleport. Dafuq? Lol. I do fine against most cheese tactics, I'll just cheese.back or turtle up and play patient, etc but I'm not really playing MKX in those situations and its not very fun.

I will have those couple of real matches (i always lose real matches lol) but having to slog through so much BS to find them has made me VASTLY prefer to find training partners and 'real' people to play sets against. Sometimes the connection womt allow.it, but once in a while.it does. Sadly I've lost the handful of folks I used to play against.

Again, II totally.understand what you're saying, I'm just explaining my reasons for looking for specific people and why random fights, I find, are difficult to learn from.

A quick note on my connection: I'm I'm Lexington, ky. 50mbs dwn / 15mbs up. Hardwired. At launch I didn't have much trouble, then it got almost impossible.. After some changes and patches it got a lot better, then it became a total crap shoot. I can't connect to and play a buddy who lives 2 miles a way but I played a guy from Kansas and a guy from NY the other day that were VERY solid. It's just random shrug.
 

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
Does anyone know of any high level cryo players I can hunt up on YouTube or the like? I'd like to see the variation in action in competent hands.

I do know from the very limited time spent tinkering, that I really like this character/variation.

With the changes and various patches, how accurate is the guide posted by Brady? I'm going to do some reading tonight, but wasn't sure if anything specific had been changed that I should know about beforehand.
 

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
Not sure if Cryo has surfaced in a competitive setting just yet, but look in the match footage thread. Find some footage you like, most of it is pretty decent (start from the latest post and work your way back).

For the most part, the guides are a little out of date... But the Cryo guide was barren to begin with anyway. The most significant change you should be aware of is the ability to 2 in 1 cancel the cold blooded string into special moves, extending combos and boosting damage. 111, f122 strings are better, air/ ground hammer are faster/ safer respectively. Check the Cryo section of our stickied combo thread as well to get some ideas about the current combo route.
 

Samsara

Resident Cynic
Can someone help offer some advice on linking a 123 and B12 after a B2? Sometimes the link feels effortless and sometimes I can never stick it. Is it simply execution or is the link inconsistent to begin with?

Help appreciated please understand I'm trying to assess the viability of using said links in his combos as opposed to F42xxBF4

NVR mind, it appears the topic has already been discussed.
 

Samsara

Resident Cynic
The reason B2 RC B12 and B2 RC 123xxBF4 are so hard to execute now is because of character height. Any character smaller than Kotal Kahn, Jason, Goro, or Ermac is immune to this run combo. It is incredibly difficult to perform on any other character. Video soon.

@Ree301 @zoofs can you confirm this as well. It only seems to work consistently on those four characters