General/Other - Alien Should Alien get the Tanya treatment?

[GAV]

He isn't in this magical tier of his own. Kano, Mileena, Takeda, Cage, Sonya, and Ermac are as good as Alien. Why in your opinion does Kano with plus/neutral meterless 50/50s, that are plus when you spend meter for a shitload of damage, a -5 half screen mid, fast projectile, super sonic speed backdash, very good kid string, great meterbuilding capability, and safe armor. What in your opinion makes Acidic Alien so much dumber than this that it puts him in is his own tier entirely?

Alien is like Demolition with better range, easier execution, more tools, and better defensive options - and THAT is looking at his variations that are not Acidic.

Acidic is just stoo-ped, stupid bro-ken.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Alien is like Demolition with better range, easier execution, more tools, and better defensive options - and THAT is looking at his variations that are not Acidic.

Acidic is just stoo-ped, stupid bro-ken.

How is he like demolition? He's potato as hell, but I don't see it. Easy execution doesn't affect tier position.

 

[Tweedy]

Alien is like Demolition with better range, easier execution, more tools, and better defensive options - and THAT is looking at his variations that are not Acidic.

Acidic is just stoo-ped, stupid bro-ken.

Well, you threw an opinion out that wasn't vague(less vague than "I think X character is in this tier", or "I think this character should get nerfed"), and now we know how much you know about the character(s).

This is especially weird coming from a Kotal player. I'm gonna assume that you just don't understand what Demolition does, vs what Alien does. You just see 50/50s and it's all the same thing. Don't take this as me downplaying, again, because i'm not. Alien does have better neutral than Sonya. I'm just arguing against Alien being "like Demolition".

Go into practice mode with any variation of Kotal, do B332 xx close stun grenade, without detonating, and try to punish it with any Kotal variation. You'll quickly discover that you really can't unless the Sonya player messes up. To add to that, in order to escape a follow up 50/50 or take your turn, you must make another read after already blocking a 50/50. This is a lot different than being able to instantly punish no matter what. It's like the tap-tap vs the brush-brush. See what i'm saying?

In the case of Acidic Alien, to ever launch off of a 50/50, he must use meter, that in most cases, he cannot hit confirm. He is never safe either, when trying to launch. So when comparing their offense, you have one character that has 50/50s with mind games after they're blocked, at least in most matches(you see Scar use Covert Ops vs characters like Jax and Mileena that have better tools to avoid them). With Alien you have a character that is always unsafe and using meter when going for a launching 50/50. Again, not saying Alien is worse than Demolition, i'm just comparing the two characters. Alien's neutral is obviously better.

You have one character with a ridiculous neutral game, versus one character that thrives on mix ups that lead into mind games once blocked. If you made a pie chart that represents their strengths, it would not say that "Alien is demolition with better range", or whatever.

 

[Tweedy]

Let me clarify once more. Me saying that Alien's neutral is better, is not me somehow downplaying, because TYM randoms say that neutral does not matter.

If you look at the top characters, Alien, Mileena and Takeda, you'll see that they thrive in the neutral, more than anything. Look at their risk/reward and resource use when doing their 50/50s, and you'll quickly find this to be true. Neutral means a lot on this game, especially when you have really dumb neutral tools like the aforementioned characters.

 

[GAV]

How is he like demolition? He's potato as hell, but I don't see it. Easy execution doesn't affect tier position.

Acidic is even more potato.

 

[errormacro7]

lol
S Alien, Johnny, Mileena, D'Vorah, Takeda
A+ Kotal Khan, Kano, Sonya, Jax, Ermac, Cassie, Kung Jin.

any of those characters have the tools and means to deal with the s tier characters

Bruh, stooooop. Kano and Sonya aren't A+, they're S.

 

[YoloRoll1stHit]

Bruh, stooooop. Kano and Sonya aren't A+, they're S.

On a side note, do you think Mileena is balanced if her B1 damage is reduced from 5% to 3%, and low sai damage is reduced to 5% (the predator treatment)?

 

[JesterSMX]

Make alien's and Mileena's forward mid a high. Sonya and takeda less plus on braindead string enders. Make dvorah's puddle less plus on meaty. Combo scale Kano's ex buff combos slightly. Make njp's more negative.

There you go NRS QA... You're welcome

Edit: Make Johnny's specials legit punishable

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Acidic is even more potato.

You're missing the entire fucking point, you're being more potato than acidic.

 

[MadeOfMetal]

Bruh, stooooop. Kano and Sonya aren't A+, they're S.

sorry about that, forgot to add that A+: some of the characters can either go one tier up, or one tier down.

but what do you mean bruh stooop? are we over dramatizing what a said a bit much here. maybe you actually misunderstood. anyways in case you arte making a legit rude post because it offends you that much, ill add to that post that they can go one up or one down. the whole point about that post was to gav, i was telling him kotal and all of those can deal with any S tier character because S and A+ are not that far apart they have the tools. and many misunderstand S for god tier, when its not.

and yes i would agree that even Sonya and Kano could quite possibly be better than alien. but just because Kano CT and Sonya are basic(not input heavy) lack for better word braindead, doesn't really make them better than anyone, but Kano really is probably number 1. but thats neither here or there.

those tier list always change on public opinion as time passes anyways. and if another nerf wave comes, new characters will replace those as S tiers. and some on here will complaine about htos as well. imo

 

[MadeOfMetal]

Love this idea. But there's no reason to leave that acid crap the way it is.

i think the Acid blood is fine, its not even a vortex anymore. you can armor its only plus 2 in corner. cant be more than plus 5. either way you can jump out, armor and backdash, in corner depending on what they do you can armor or jump out.

 

[thlityoursloat]

I just hope Injustice 2 doesn't have the same sort of hype-killing bullshit NRS' last two games have had. I don't even care if Alien's overpowered or not, I care about these games ending up with <300 participants at Evo because everyone who tunes in has to watch the kid from Jerry Maguire spamming rekkas over and over with Tanya and Alien or Superman laser and f23 his way to victory. Games live or die by their hype and this sort of shit is a nail in the coffin.

Real talk, I'm not homosexual but I think Dragon is cute as hell.

 

[MK_Al]

i think the Acid blood is fine, its not even a vortex anymore. you can armor its only plus 2 in corner. cant be more than plus 5. either way you can jump out, armor and backdash, in corner depending on what they do you can armor or jump out.

i respect your opinion but to me the acid is not ok because there's hardly a way to avoid geting hit by it, and it deals very good dmg on block and stacks - thats way op. imo it should either deal no dmg on block or leave no puddle.

 

[ismael4790]

Alien needs a touch, but would be sad if he was completely destroyed.

By the way, does Mileena deserve the fisticuffs cage treatment? #B12boyz

 

[GAV]

You're missing the entire fucking point, you're being more potato than acidic.

Acidic is every bit as broken as Kobu Jutsu and Hunter ever were...

 

[GAV]

i think the Acid blood is fine, its not even a vortex anymore. you can armor its only plus 2 in corner. cant be more than plus 5. either way you can jump out, armor and backdash, in corner depending on what they do you can armor or jump out.

Translation - Please don't nerf Acidic.

 

[MK_Al]

Just to be clear, its not about destroying the char, rather about fair balancing (so no tanya treatment)

 

[M.D.]

I don't put anyone in Alien's tier. Mileena is below him, but in my mind - her Piercing variation also stands alone.

I used to put A-List 3rd, but like I said - I'm not even really sure of that anymore.

Ah, I'm sorry my comment was not directed at you, but as a general remark to all MKX players.
Now that I look at it it surely seems I was directing it at you, sorry about that.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Acidic is every bit as broken as Kobu Jutsu and Hunter ever were...

Yet another non answer. Maybe Sonic Fox is just that good. Alien is top tier but not in his own tier. And noooooo,
Do you even remember what CEO 2015 Tanya could do? In no way, shape, or form does Alien match that. Hunter Predator? HQT was always the superior variation anyways, but I'll humor you. He is better than the September version of Predator, but not when he first came out. You don't understand Alien. Ease of use doesn't affect tier position.

 

[GAV]

Yet another non answer. Maybe Sonic Fox is just that good. Alien is top tier but not in his own tier. And noooooo,
Do you even remember what CEO 2015 Tanya could do? In no way, shape, or form does Alien match that. Hunter Predator? HQT was always the superior variation anyways, but I'll humor you. He is better than the September version of Predator, but not when he first came out. You don't understand Alien. Ease of use doesn't affect tier position.

What you don't understand is that I understand completely.

Now, (get ready for a run-on) I don't know if you do, but I really hope you don't because if you do, you're being completely disingenuous.

Your dog in this race is Alien.

My dog in this race is balance.

Once you're through belittling my knowledge and insight - you have only left what is...

...and that is one completely overpowered character and an even more overpowered variation.

 

[Tweedy]

No one has a dog in the race. That's just another vague argument that you're using, since you have nothing substantial to say.

From what I understand Dankster plays Sub Zero. I main Kotal Khan and play more Ronin than Alien these days. We're just trying to inform you, mr. tap-tap.

 

[GAV]

No one has a dog in the race. That's just another vague argument that you're using, since you have nothing substantial to say.

From what I understand Dankster plays Sub Zero. I main Kotal Khan and play more Ronin than Alien these days. We're just trying to inform you, mr. tap-tap.

You, MM, and DM all play Alien. Lets just stop with all the false pretenses.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

What you don't understand is that I understand completely.

Now, (get ready for a run-on) I don't know if you do, but I really hope you don't because if you do, you're being completely disingenuous.

Your dog in this race is Alien.

My dog in this race is balance.

Once you're through belittling my knowledge and insight - you have only left what is...

...and that is one completely overpowered character and an even more overpowered variation.

I MAIN SUB-ZERO, ALIEN HAS A FULL SCREEN TAIL THAT GOES THROUGH THE ICE KLONE. I HATE ALIEN.

But that doesn't mean he deserves to get nerfed anymore than demo, a-list, cutthroat, piercing, spectral, etc... Iv even said in this thread that Alien should be toned down, but your suggestion of removing armor off of ex flip is horrible. That wouldn't do hardly anything to Tarkatan as well. Me screwing around with Tarkatan for literally a day doesn't mean Alien is my "dog in this race". He is a dumb character but there are several just as good as him. He is top tier but not in his own tier. That's more what I'm saying.

Also: I don't mean to belittle anything, I'm sorry if I came off as condescending, im not intentionally a dick.

 

[GAV]

I MAIN SUB-ZERO, ALIEN HAS A FULL SCREEN TAIL THAT GOES THROUGH THE ICE KLONE. I HATE ALIEN.

But that doesn't mean he deserves to get nerfed anymore than demo, a-list, cutthroat, piercing, spectral, etc... Iv even said in this thread that Alien should be toned down, but your suggestion of removing armor off of ex flip is horrible. That wouldn't do hardly anything to Tarkatan as well. Me screwing around with Tarkatan for literally a day doesn't mean Alien is my "dog in this race". He is a dumb character but there are several just as good as him. He is top tier but not in his own tier. That's more what I'm saying.

Also: I don't mean to belittle anything, I'm sorry if I came off as condescending, im not intentionally a dick.

I'm just trying to convey the truth. I'm beyond discerning it. You said you enjoy playing Alien in a previous post.

We have a big difference of opinion. As long as we can discuss without getting angry or personal, then I have no worries.

You'll never hear me say, "no offense, but" because I'm not here to attack anyone, but if I see someone trying to cloud the truth - then I speak up - and usually loudly.

The truth is Alien is S+ - way overpowered. Acidic goes beyond that into the realm of the almost completely broken. That's the truth.

Don't compare him to characters from other games. He only plays in this one.

I don't want Alien nuked, but I don't want things left as they are either. How they did Predator would be just fine.

 

[Tweedy]

You, MM, and DM all play Alien. Lets just stop with all the false pretenses.

But you fail to point out actual bias. You just act like there is bias.

You keep arguing without a real argument. What does "you, mm, and dm all play Alien" say? I've only said truth about Alien. You can't dispute anything that I've said. You claim that I downplay, I give you the thread that has the bulk of my Alien related posts, yet you post a dozen times without following up on that. I even debunked another vague statement you made, comparing Alien to Demolition.

You've posted so much in this thread without really saying anything. Anytime you attempted to cross the bridge of vague statements and actually saying something, you've said stuff like "no armor on EX flip will make Alien a pure poking character", or "Alien is like Demolition", etc.