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Scorpion Sucks, Scorpion Rules - Lets Complain Here

Should NRS buff Scorpion, even a little bit???


  • Total voters
    90
There's no way you can fuzzy guard Scorp's mix-up. b2 and f+4 are a difference of 1 frame. You gotta be pretty godlike to fuzzy guard to the frame. Mere human error as the aggressor putting the mix-up on can screw up a fuzzy guard that tight.
Same thing i said
 

Sasuga

Kombatant
It's a matter of professionalism. How would you feel if you worked as a furniture maker and some random guy off the street comes in and starts telling you that he knows better than you how to make furniture because he owns a couch and sits on it all day?
I lol'd at this. This isn't really what's going on but it's funny anyway.

I can understand people who want their character to get buffed. A friend of mine plays Scorpion and nothing else. He complains about him all the time but he insists on playing Scorpion. Why not try using another character? Maybe scorpions game doesn't fit your playstyle. If you're not a bad player but you don't do well with Scorpion, I'm sure you will with someone else.
 

ADR Napalm

Apprentice
In this case the OP just sucks, because trust me. . . . . . If you played Slips Scorpion you be crying for nerfs.
 

Farpafraf

Apprentice
i'm not a good mk player but in my(noob) opinion scorpion doesn't need a buff at all are other broken characters who should be nerfed.
 

rev0lver

Come On Die Young
Moreover, undeniable facts and logical conclusions are apparently an ‘empty crap’ by your definition.
Are you still trying to claim that the lack of high-level scorpion players makes scorpion a bad character as an undeniable fact? Whenever someone doesn't make top 8 with a character we are supposed to think the character sucks? Did you ever stop to consider the importance of the player's skills rather than the character's?
 

quandaghost

kung lao swag walker
as a scorpion player i can honestly say scorpion doesn't suck to play him well you have to know what moves are gonna beat what pay attention to your opponents habits and punish everything as heavily as possible scorpion is character that depends on meter management not of his but of his opponents as long as your opponent has breaker you need to fear them cause A they can break a game winning combo or b pull bs. there is never a time when your opponent should have three bars, cause you should always be pressuring switching up blockstrings using the reset disrespecting options (yeah i said it disrespecting options) switching between pressuring wake up and dash block to push whiffs or blocked ports or spins. he isn't bad he is just difficult to play with for anyone. Yes i think he need buffs i mean lets face it he needs atleast one safe option but, nothing as fool hardy as taking away the safe jump then the lao matchup would be ten times worse and it wouldn't be as threatening. scorpion in my opinion has tools to counter everything he may have to work for it but he can work around it with patience.
 

OutworldKeith

Champion
The MK9 Scorpion Community wont be happy until we get this :)
*MK4 Scorpion*


Scorpion Guide
Rank: 2 Jump to Videos

This was the first time that the yellow ninja was in the god tier of an MK game (not counting after 2002 Mks) and he deserve this place because of his many damage options and his deadly specials. The only character that can give him troubles is Tanya but she has to fight hard also to acomplish this. Before people complain about what are they going to read here and then say "hey but Scorp is better than anyone if this is all true! Why he isnt #1?", its because the top 3 in MK4 can be a random tossup and it will depend more of the ability of the players, so he has far more advantages and options than Tanya and Rept against the rest of the characters. He can be a master turtler (not as good as Sub or Tanya) but also a beast rushing down. His main strenght however is that he is a yellow version of UMK3 Human Smoke and that means: easy +40% at his disposal from virtually every attack he has and dont matter where you are on the screen. His Lp throw is normal and his Lk throw is good if you follow it with a jump and do an Lk at the top to get a glitch blocked cross up and attempt to throw again.

Scorp ability to combo is UNPARALLELED. His standing Hp is the highest priority attack in the game. If two characters are close for example Fujin and Scorp and the 2 attempt to combo, Scorp will always have the upper hand. if you manage to land a simple Hp or Hk knee starter is an easy 50% damage combo from there. Aa Hp are excellent for Juggling and have good priority. From an aaHp you can get easy 48%. His Lk is good as a poking move but has medium range. His Hk is good for aa and can be followed by a aaTeleport for an easy 46%. His Rh and Swep are slow like most of the characters. His Jumping attacks are good. His Jump HpHk combo is good as a starter and you can get 49% easily from there. His JHK ist that good bit if you manage to get one and cancel it with a teleport done on reaction, you can get easily 47% from there.

His Spear is his trademark move. I think i will need no explanation on how this move works aside that it helps to extend the damage done and it has a 3 hit limit and a 2-3 seconds time limit. Can be used twice in a combo. the spear alone is slow and scoutable. If blocked, the recovery is long so his best use is in combos exclusively or at full screen distance for some zoning for example after a Max Dam break. If you manage to get an Spear alone as a first hit, its an easy 47% from there. To do 2 spears in a combo, you must connect the first spear and then let like half a second the stun go then hit Hk then delay either d + Hp or d + Hk and in the last moment the foe is falling to the ground get the another spear. This is very fancy but not too useful. In older mk games using Spear as a wakeup is after jab/knee pressure do teleport escape and drop a spear, this dont work in MK4 because the teleport will always appear on the other side of the opponent and will lead you into punishment mode if he blocks. The strat after ducked fireballs works but not from too far distance.

The Air Throw is good. It has the best range of all air throws but does medium damage. Its excellent to finish long Juggles and does 1% more damage than the combos normally ending in Jump HpHk (depending on the combo too). You can use it as an anti crossup too or basic air throw tactics like H Smoke in UMK3.

The Fire Breath is an almost useless move used on ground chains. Its juggle tactics are good and it helps to extend Juggles too. It does lots of damage too. If blocked it has long recovery. You can add in aa mid screen Juggles & teleport or in corner even a spear. It has no hit limit or time limit. There is an infinite using this move when both characters are in short area (using step out) but its completely unpossible to happen in a vs match.

The teleport is another classic Scorp special move. Here it has a main disvantage: It travels TOO much distance so you have to be VERY carefull when trying to play runaway games because it can be easily blocked. its very fast and excellent for combos even having a 2 hit limit. From a single teleport you can get easy 47% combos. The main use of the teleport is in combos but is a deadly tool in Scorp arsenal because NO ONE can jump backwards anymore. Sub cannot get his Ice clone safely anymore. You might want to be on the look out and force your foe to jump back to gain distance and then do an aaTeleport followed by one or two aaLp/Hp depending on the height. If you are facing the corner but arent in corner dash distance, when you do a teleport it will come out twice as fast and will hit the foe from the other side so you will end again out of the corner, be wary of this for not missing the subsecuents aa attacks or spears. This happens in ground or air situations and it can be blocked too. The older strategies from UMK3/MK2 with early jump attacks and escaping with teleport then run and jab/knee pressure/throw scenarios works here too, but they are not so safely now.

Scorpion weapon is a nasty one. It might seem slow at first but once you get accustomed you will fight with very good. B + Hp is a overhead and very slow attack that has a lot of start up BUT recovers fast and can be followed by some rushing or even some turtle! Standing Hp and Lp are a downward and upward slash respectively in wich both serves as aa and can be followed by a teleport for easy 48% combos. B + Lp is an upward slash that actually doesnt pop up the foe but it does send them to the ground. It has some startup and recovery but its excellent to finish long combos and rushes. Down + Lp is an unique attack, it makes Scorp spin in a crouched position and allows him to score 3 hits by holding the button. If you hold the Lp buton you can keep spinning and move at the same time. Its useles in Juggles but excellent at rushings because you can fake it out by only tapping the button. Scorpion's weapon is also the most damaging one in the game.

Scorpion has two infinites, both of them NOT useable in a competetive games. The first one is already said and can be viewed in MKGold Vol.2 - in close corner window its just aaHP, Fire Breathe, repeat. The second Scorpion's infinite is using Jax or Reiko Weapon with Maximum Damage enabled. It can be viewed in the same video, and its completely useless so i will not go deep into it.

Turning Off The Maximum Damage with Scorpion will lead you into the real carnage of MK4. If he has a guaranteed 40%+ combo with Maximum Damage On now he has a guaranteed 50%+ sometimes even 60%+ or more. He would be unstopable.

Basic Juggles:

1. HK, HK, Spear, HP, HP, HK, B+HK (7 Hits, 42%)
2. HP, HK, D+HP, Spear, HP, HP, HK, D+HP, aaHP, Jump HK, Air Throw (10 Hits, 43%)
3. HK, HK, Spear, HP, HP, HK, HK, Weapon Draw (8 Hits, 45%)
4. aaHp, JHK, Tlpt, Spear, Hp, HP, Hk, d+Hp, aaHp, Jump HpHk (11 Hits, 48%)
5. (With Weapon) HK, HK, Spear, HK, D+HP, B+HP, B+LP (7 Hits, 45%)

Advanced Juggles:

1. HK, HK, Spear, SUJK, HP, HP, HK, B+HK (9 Hits, 50%)
2. aaJump HpHk, Tlpt, Hp, RH (6 Hits, 49%)
3. (With Weapon) aaB + Hp, Tlpt, Spear, HK, B+HK (5 Hits, 51%)
4. (With Weapon) Hk, Hk, Spear, SUJK, Hk D+Hp, Jump HK, Jump LP (8 Hits, 51%)

*HP, HK, HK, Spear, SUJK, HP, HP, HK, B+HK is 50% too and its more useful if your opponent blocks the first hits so you can react before droping the Spear.

Punishers:

1. aaHPx2, Jump HK, Air Throw (4 Hits, 22%)
2. aaHPx2, Teleport Punch, SUJK, HP, HP, HK, B+HK (9 Hits, 45%)
3. SUJK, HK, Teleport Punch, Spear, HP, RH (6 Hits, 48%)
3. SUJK, Fire Breathe, Tplt, Spear, RH (5 Hits, 50%)
4. aaHp, JHK, Tlpt, Spear, Hp, HP, Hk, d+Hp, aaHp, Jump HpHk (11 Hits, 48%)
5. (With Weapon) SUJK, B+HP, Teleport Punch (3 Hits, 42%)

*Maximum Damage x 2: Yep its possible. Throwing weapon/stone then Teleport Punch, (aaHP sometimes) Spear is the most knowing way, indeed its possible to happen in a vs match. Another Maximum Damage x 2 combo is using his weapon B+HP x 2, then Spear, the Maximum Damage message will appear, wait a second (for the time limit) and SUJK, HK, D+HP, Spear again, from there there are many variations like HK, D+HP, B+HP, B+LP and etc. Its working perfectly for punishers that are far enough from you (Like Cage SHadow Uppercut, Raiden's Torpedo and etc).
 

King

Sig Maker
The only thing I'd like to see Scorpion get is a safer wake up option; EX teleport gets stuffed like non other. Maybe make his F4 more hit confirmable into spear?
 

truendymion

Apprentice
Yes completely agree Scorpion is a crappy character. Don't understand how people can say a character with no safe options and non-existent wake-up is a 'solid' character. On top of that his only strong tactic (mixups off of safe-jumps) is completely neutralized by fuzzy guard.

Hey Slips I dont understand why you are so defensive about buffing Scorp. JC, NW, and LK recieved buffs (armor on EX specials) and they were already very strong, definitely stronger than Scorp. Subs getting freaking buffs and he was already top tier. Why not Scorp?!?!
 

Pagan

Mortal
I like your post K.O.E

Really puts things into perspective :p

I certainly don't want a top tier Scorpion because then everyone and their god will be playing him. Of all the MK1 characters though, I feel like he got the least amount of attention by NRS.
 

Kwon

---->----
Slips Scorpion is the greatest Scorpion i've seen!

Great skill, showing the people how powerful Scorpion can be in the right hands.
 

Slips

Feared by dragons. Desired by virgins.
Yes completely agree Scorpion is a crappy character. Don't understand how people can say a character with no safe options and non-existent wake-up is a 'solid' character. On top of that his only strong tactic (mixups off of safe-jumps) is completely neutralized by fuzzy guard.

Hey Slips I dont understand why you are so defensive about buffing Scorp. JC, NW, and LK recieved buffs (armor on EX specials) and they were already very strong, definitely stronger than Scorp. Subs getting freaking buffs and he was already top tier. Why not Scorp?!?!
#1 Scorp does have safe options. Sweep and f+3 is a safe mix-up.

#2 You can't fuzzy guard b+2 and f+4

#3 I never said Scorp doesn't need a buff. He needs his takedown to be safe and better recovery on a whiffed spear.

I agree I think its stupid some characters are getting buffs while Scorp gets passed over. He's the only character in the game that doesn't have a safe special move on block. Ridiculous.
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
I've been playing a lot of scorpion lately and really he's extremely solid. He does have some bad match ups like lao and kitana but so do other good characters.
 

OutworldKeith

Champion
If Scorpion gets any of these buffs you will see an influx of new Scorpion players

1. Safe specials
2. better wake ups
3. Bigger spear confirm window on F+4

If i could choose I would take either the safe specials or safe wak up options
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
Would takedown be a good wakeup if it was safe on block or could it just be stuffed by a late meaty attack? That would give scorpion some more 50/50 for sure. I think being able to confirm off of f+4 might be a little much though.

With that said, scorpion does need a little something.
 

truendymion

Apprentice
#1 Scorp does have safe options. Sweep and f+3 is a safe mix-up.

#2 You can't fuzzy guard b+2 and f+4

#3 I never said Scorp doesn't need a buff. He needs his takedown to be safe and better recovery on a whiffed spear.

I agree I think its stupid some characters are getting buffs while Scorp gets passed over. He's the only character in the game that doesn't have a safe special move on block. Ridiculous.
Well I was hoping for something OP like Kangs or Smokes safe strings that lead to juggle. Or at least like Sub ending a string with an Iceclone to build some meter and pressure opponent safely.
Giving Scorp a safe takedown would be perfect. Better recovery on Spear would help a lot, you won't get raped so hard when you whiff a spear at full screen or whiff a spear during a combo.
I noticed you didn't say anything about Scorps wakeup :)

As far as the fuzzy guard thing goes I'm confused. At Wednesday Night Fights I heard that you could fuzzy guard Scorps mixups and it appeared to be the case during the tournament. Maybe opp was guessing right every single time?

I had a few ideas about buffing Scorp a bit

1. Fake teleport. Can be used for additional mind games. Doesn't change the timing of the TP just makes it so he doesn't appear on the other side. You can still hit him as he's vanishing. Imagine doing a fake TP, opp blocks in anticipation so you do a hellfire lol. Might be OP but IDC lots of characters have OP shit in this game.

2. Armor on EX TP. The armor is only active on the start up of TP, still vulnerable when he reappears on the other side. So you can still uppercut him on reaction but at least he has a better wakeup option.
 

OutworldKeith

Champion
Even his mix up is unsafe, I try to not go for the B+2 & F+4 so much. Better options would be to hit confirm jip for throw attempt & if you get the throw hellfire to make your opponent jump in & punish him w/ 3~teleport or use the F+3 overhead it causes safe jump on hit & its safe on block. So the bigger spear window on confirmed F+4 would probably be a tad much.

I just really hoped NRS would've 2 kept things from the MK vs DCU Scorpion & they are the Hellfire that can be linked into strings & his Inner Flames GTFO move....Im sure all Scorpion players would agree
 

OutworldKeith

Champion
Well I was hoping for something OP like Kangs or Smokes safe strings that lead to juggle. Or at least like Sub ending a string with an Iceclone to build some meter and pressure opponent safely.
Giving Scorp a safe takedown would be perfect. Better recovery on Spear would help a lot, you won't get raped so hard when you whiff a spear at full screen or whiff a spear during a combo.
I noticed you didn't say anything about Scorps wakeup :)

As far as the fuzzy guard thing goes I'm confused. At Wednesday Night Fights I heard that you could fuzzy guard Scorps mixups and it appeared to be the case during the tournament. Maybe opp was guessing right every single time?

I had a few ideas about buffing Scorp a bit

1. Fake teleport. Can be used for additional mind games. Doesn't change the timing of the TP just makes it so he doesn't appear on the other side. You can still hit him as he's vanishing. Imagine doing a fake TP, opp blocks in anticipation so you do a hellfire lol. Might be OP but IDC lots of characters have OP shit in this game.

2. Armor on EX TP. The armor is only active on the start up of TP, still vulnerable when he reappears on the other side. So you can still uppercut him on reaction but at least he has a better wakeup option.



Whoa! A teleport that you could dash cancel or navigate like Quan Chi's or Sheeva's would be great but :en Teleport is fine IMO
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
Scorpion had linkable hellfire in the demo...it gave him guaranteed hellfire setups off of blocking shit.

Inner flames shoulda stayed, agreed.

You can fuzzy guard his 50/50, but it's not easy, and being slightly off = you get hit.
 

OutworldKeith

Champion
I never had the pleasure of playing the demo but I heard he was broken lol
But whts the use of trying to fuzzy guard it? the recovery for any of his blocked 50/50 except for F+3 are easily punished not to mention a wiffed spear is like the equivalent of being frozen by Subz
 

Slips

Feared by dragons. Desired by virgins.
Well I was hoping for something OP like Kangs or Smokes safe strings that lead to juggle. Or at least like Sub ending a string with an Iceclone to build some meter and pressure opponent safely.
Giving Scorp a safe takedown would be perfect. Better recovery on Spear would help a lot, you won't get raped so hard when you whiff a spear at full screen or whiff a spear during a combo.
I noticed you didn't say anything about Scorps wakeup :)

As far as the fuzzy guard thing goes I'm confused. At Wednesday Night Fights I heard that you could fuzzy guard Scorps mixups and it appeared to be the case during the tournament. Maybe opp was guessing right every single time?

I had a few ideas about buffing Scorp a bit

1. Fake teleport. Can be used for additional mind games. Doesn't change the timing of the TP just makes it so he doesn't appear on the other side. You can still hit him as he's vanishing. Imagine doing a fake TP, opp blocks in anticipation so you do a hellfire lol. Might be OP but IDC lots of characters have OP shit in this game.

2. Armor on EX TP. The armor is only active on the start up of TP, still vulnerable when he reappears on the other side. So you can still uppercut him on reaction but at least he has a better wakeup option.
If your talkin about a safe string Scorp's got a really good one with 111 actually. I was talking about a safe mix-up.

I honestly think making his takedown safe will make is wake-up options better. I can get people to respect TP enough that they'll just block. If I get hit out of TP its usually just a small float or something. However, being trapped in the corner is quite the pain in the ass, but I think its a weakness I can tolerate if I had a safe takedown. A safe takedown is such a small change but such a huge impact from making a character average to good. It would give him a safe option to chase an opponent down and improve his wake-up game. I hope NRS reads.

You can't fuzzy guard his 50/50, anyone who says otherwise is preaching too much impracticality. There is a difference of ONE frame between the two moves. I think b+2 is like 18 and f+4 is 17. So its LITERALLY a just frame to fuzzy guard. Its just not practical. People keep blocking your mix-up, your being too predictable.

A fake TP would be nice, prolly a little overboard tho. =P

Armor on EX TP would be nice.
 
dude those poll options are the doucheiest thing ive ever seen ever. Either way you say he sucks lol. Are you just trolling or did you seriously think those are the only 2 valid options? Someone is just salty i think. And yeah scorpion is awesome. His safe jump to mixup is epic and if its not winning you matches, then you need to learn to read better.
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
Anyone else here have ex spear whiff on a standing opponent at point blank range? I use it to stop kabals up close mixup and it whiffed completely.