Her b2 1+3 getting no damage doesn't negate that it's a mix up. Usually mixups aren't supposed to be super damaging and since she has a plethora of options in neutral it's fine as it is. Black Canary has godlike damage off mixups but her neutral doesn't come close to Supergirls and that's the trade off for it
Image is broken for me as well, is this a real chart with Adam's actual trait cancel frame data? Would be pretty useful to have.
Damn right it's broken
Ok I am revising this:
I mean, there are just several characters with better mixup and pressure games who are on a whole different level than Bane. His plus frames might as well be non existent, since +2 means nothing when your fastest normal is a 9f high. And sure he has overheads and lows, but they are what, 21 and 17 frames respectively? The only reason to ever block high on Bane is when he is level 3, otherwise f2d is liable to get poked pretty frequently. You can't tell me that he hangs in the same bracket as Atrocitus, Batman, Scarecrow, and Deadshot in the pressure/mixup department; those are the ones who should get 5/5 in that category.
Banes conditioning with grab means you are not blocking these everytime, not even close. Even without using the overhead and low aspects of his moves when F2D catches you jumping out of a command grab situation that is still a mix up. He absolutely hangs with and is better than those characters in terms of pressure and mix ups point blank. Dont forget they gave him dash cancels too lol. He gets big damage (even without venom) off any confirm into mb b3, low B23 starter, or just raw mb B3/F3 and unclashable damage he gets has to be worked into his score somewhere because its rediculous.
Wetdoba is correct about those things when Bane has Venom. Half the time Bane is insane. Half the time he is shit. His mixups are crazy good. Every knockdown is a guess....when he has Venom. His pressure is good... when he has Venom. His damage is insane... when he has Venom. When in debuff he becomes bottom 1. His normals are trash tier. Absolutely awful. He's unsafe on almost every single thing he does.
Yeah. I don't think he has no options or anything like that, but I certainly don't think he has top tier pressure or mixups. Wetdoba tries to get info out there on the forums and get people to believe in Bane, and I respect that, but I simply don't think Bane is as good in practice as he makes him sound on paper. I don't think he's bottom, but all around I keep seeing people drop Bane, move him to secondary, and generally get punked while playing him, and I don't see any of that changing in the near future.
Unless they pull an IGAU Bane again lol
I understand your point but other character with strong neutrals have decent pressure or mix ups look at black Adam, catwoman, scarecrow just as an example.
Lbsh igau bane players werent known for their nuetral (which he has to play now), they were known for doing 8 armored double punches and mb venom uppers in a row on block and then grabbing. Bane cant do that now, so therefor he must be bad. I dont believe that at all. Everything except 3 moves are safe, yet they keep committing to those unsafe moves because bad habits die hard
But this isn't about them it's about her. Supergirl can't have everything bud. She has to have a weakness. The top tiers all are very strong but they all have a certain weakness besides Catwoman honestly. Supergirl with super fast mixups that are safe and doing 400 damage all at once on top of what she already has would make her easily the best character in the game free. She was the best character in the beta week 1 and she did the exact same damage as she does now and that beta had this version of Batman. She was plus on everything and she was a nightmare. Gotta be careful how you deal with this character for changes
think your uplaying supergirls strengths a little bit too much. what does she have that you can say that is so exceptional where she need all these weaknesses of being minus or unsafe on almost everything. Has gaps in her strings and when she tries to cancel it to make it safe. One of the lowest if not the lowest damage in the game. Lack of range on normal and strings. Yes she has an above average neutral and anti zoning but their are a decent amount of characters in those categories that does it better. for example a good neutral character is scarecrow his strengths are neutral, mix-ups, damage what his weaknesses zoning and anti zoning. Darkseid an anti zoning character he has mix-ups damage, zoning and anti-zoning, great wake-up and 6f d1 but his neutral is poor. Look at this 2 character that are strong in categories that supergirl is strong in but have more strengths and less weaknesses. This was just my opinion I feel that her strengths are not on the level for have her so many flaws. I never even brought up the fact she needs mix-ups or damage those are her weakness and b1 into d1 or overhead in my opinion is just a gimmick like all he other so called pressure and if the person knows the match up wont get caught buy in. on top of that b2 mix up is only 1 mix up which doesn't give her are raise in point in my opinion. Super girl strengths are not good enough for her multitude of weaknesses. If you say im downplaying I'm truly not in my opinion Supergirl is mid tier, not high tier, not low, just mid.
Memeing is fun, sure, but a chart like this would be particularly useful, especially considering what @Tweedy said doesn't paint the whole picture regarding his trait cancel.Damn right it's broken
This has literally been my first post in this thread, I haven't downplayed once.
That happens when you set the AI to block low and reversal charge. Try recording f12xx4 b12 and crouch the f1, stand the 2, then reversal.
Supergirl has a lot of weaknesses though. She still feels way overnerfed to me.
