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Mortal Kombat 11 Gameplay/Mechanics Discussion

This is a speculative thread to discuss new/returning game-play mechanics that people would like have included or not included in the returning title.

As I fully expect MK11 to be more of an in your face game, I am being realistic with things that are probably 100% confirmed such as running, block button, 50/50/standing resets et cetera, toned down zoning.

If I could pick one thing I would like improved from previous NRS titles it is to tone down jump in attacks such as MKX sub zero, I2 robin, pre-patch batman I2, or I2 flash to give a few examples. If there are going to be fast low arc jumping attacks please give characters the tools to anti ait them if their reactions earn them an AA. I also hope the trip guard/recovery window is a bit bigger on things like MKX sonya divekick and other jump arc changing moves that already make people second guess anti airing with situational moves.

Concerning the epic zoning vs rushdown war. MKX should have been the game where something like low gunshots or pre-patch dead shot existed in as @General M2Dave said a few times. I just hope there are characters with the defensive tools to deal with some of the craziness we are sure to see such as a shinnok d4 hellsparks or predator type zoning.


Confirmed MK11 Mechanics:

- Virtual Reality component? Possibly for the mobile version of the game which we won't care about? (https://twitter.com/noobde/status/1072938410845880321)

- Krushing blows (https://testyourmight.com/threads/nrs-email-leak-alleged-new-mk11-details-cover-art-community-reveal-plans.67573/)

-Supers (https://testyourmight.com/threads/nrs-email-leak-alleged-new-mk11-details-cover-art-community-reveal-plans.67573/)
back story to why i love this game aside, i want a lot of MKXL to come back in 11, after all we got the game people seemed to have wanted MKX to be in the form of Injustice 2; No run, Heavy zoning and more defensive options and fewer mixups, And what happened ?! the game died. and it wasn't much fun.
so what i want and the reason i want them are:

Run/Run cancelling: it helps with combo variety, creates a skill gap that's satisfying to cover if you do, and it's a great options to Zoning. sure it had it's problems but it made the game so much fun, not to mentions it's a legacy mechanic. i don't mind it being toned down even though i think the way it is in the current patch of MKXL is perfect. But i'd be sad if it left.

AirDash: not like an anime fighter or anything like that, i would just like the combo possibility it would prvide to characters that can fly, or a sense of mobility. it sounds weird i know but it would be fun.

One bar push block & invincible wakeups: the first one doesn't need justification but the latter, i think Armour are great but a lot of characters in MKXL had the short end of the stick in regards to that. being super unsafe like Scorpion or Sub, only had 1 hit like Ermac OR was so damn slow like Takeda ( regardless of what you think of the characters, they deserved better armor ) in comparison to someone like Liu who had safe armor or Kenshin that could combo off his teleport. Invincible wakeups are just more efficient to me.

No 50/50s: it's part of the game but plus just take it out. or make it super punishable. like i'm able to get a Jump in punish each time i block right.

Toasty and other weird old school noises maybe even a taunt: why? for the fun of it
 

Zhidoreptiloid

Watcher from the sky
First of all
1) No idiotic different blockstans - when you block some move and pressing buttons to punish it, but nothing happens - because on this move is specail blockstan - and you need to learn it's length and press buttons frame in frame, or opponent -20 on block on this move will turned in zero or even plus. ALL BLOCKSTANS MUST BE EQUAL ON TIMING. That is bug, not feature.
Even more - for normal defence, when you can punish all of blocked moves you must learn ALL different blockstans in the game to punish consistantly. That makes defensive game on low and middle skill-level even more weaker (that in MKX, where is attack playstile >>> defence playstile) and on low and mid skill-level your choise is determinated - you attack and you win, you defence without knowledge of all different blockstans in all cast in all moves - and you in great minus and going to loose.
2) buffering normals and pokes in blockstan. That is stupid. You must press your punish frame in frame, but if you
a) playing not offline
b) playing with laggy monitor/tv
you cannot punish -8 on block with 7-frame startup move.
Instead of buffering normal in blockstan and fokus your energy on mindgames, you must fokus on stupid mechanic and press poke or normak frame-in-frame or, what happens often - just mash poke/normal buttons. From this situation, you cann punish enemy with normal cancelled in special, or, for example, you punishing string is 123 and when you trying to punish -8 with 7-frame move, you just mash 1 1 1 1 1 1 and you cannot press 123 consistantly. Bufferining normals and pokes in blockstan will solve that problem. Even more - that buffering is very good for online battles - with current frame-to-frame system -8 on block can be -6 or less. With buffering normals on blockstan you can punish -8 with 7-frane startup move consistanly.

That is two mail things - without them game will be mashing slasher again.
Of course, we have other problem - MKX run is killing footsier, NJP is killing footise, air in NRS games in absolutely overpowered and hi-reward low-risk mechanic, spam-abusable mechanic even for pro scene (b1 kotal when mid, f23, trident rush evo etc.), but that two is most important.

Sorry for my english
 
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Normals used for anti airs def should have priority over jump in attacks. Since MK9, mk has always had great gameplay. Just needs a little more space control to check wild people just mindlessly coming in.
 

Zhidoreptiloid

Watcher from the sky
after all we got the game people seemed to have wanted MKX to be in the form of Injustice 2; No run, Heavy zoning and more defensive options and fewer mixups, And what happened ?! the game died. and it wasn't much fun.
You are wrong about reasons of death of injustice 2: not general mechanic kill that game - general mechanic in injustice 2 was best of the best in all NRS games - general mechanic give some parity between defensive and offensive playstiles, for examlpe, MBroll was offensive new mechanic.
The reason of death of I2 was bad characters, not general mechanics - characters, that killing fun in casual play and making pro-scene is super boring: pew-pew deadshot and fate and, laters broken starfire, f23 sups, trident rush EVO etc. - that is all bad design spam 1-2 moves characters, no one wanna see or loose agaisnt character, who designed with 1 OP move, which can win win even major tournaments.
And, if You ask - yes, I think, general mechanics from I2 (not characters with bad design) is very good idea for MK11
 

Barrogh

Meta saltmine
dash cancel mechanic of mk9
Free, safe, optimal, always available way to move on the ground without downsides is called "walking" an should be considered basic function available with basic input.

If uneven pacing is important, you can always make walking have it (see: Parasoul from Skullgirls), bonus points for actually having decent animations played while you move instead of that atrocity from MK9.

If initial burst on speed is important, you can always do what was done in I2 where your first step in a walking sequence was much faster than the rest.

If you want different kinds of movement, they must be meaningfully different. Say, walking may be slow-ish, dashes may be unsafe, run may require resources. "Mashing controller harder for a strictly better effect" is not meaningful.

Same goes to other superfluous inputs like fbf or dbf on characters with free bf and db bindings, or like MKX run input.

Oh, and that waste of a button called "change stance". Fuck it.

as long at it is high risk i think that would be awesome for taunts to do something.
What is the difference between taunts and "legit moves" if both categories have some effect?

Running should be implemented in a game like injustice where the distance between opponents can be so large. Not in mk
In the end meaningful distance in FGs is how fast situation can change due to movement, how hard is to react to it and how many reads you can make/enforce before you enter box-to-box contact with your opponent.

Nevermind that you don't need a special movement type to ensure arena is crossed in certain amount of time. Pretty sure that running up from full screen with F/T in MKX was taking roughly the same time as walking up from fullscreen in I2, at least for some characters.

Make run not as prominent, remove stamina
I mean, if you remove stamina, run ceases to have any downsides at all compared to walking. Like I said above, at that point you might as well remove one of those methods of movement entirely and bind the remaining one to "f". Not sure how that is supposed to make it less prominent though :p

That is, unless you want run to become something fundamentally different, like it usually is in many other FGs with running.

OH! And please for the love of GOD, don't have a stage with lightning as blinding as what we had on Sky Temple. I swear, I'm getting closer and closer to cataracts every time I fight on that stage.
For the record, I played MKX on PC and it wasn't as ridiculous there. Something tells me it was actually a technical issue. Not sure if they ever resolved it.

Almost every character in MKX had good antiairs, the problem were the completely busted jump ins.
Quality of anti-airs is measured by their reliability against air attacks. If they don't beat jump-ins reliably enough (and if you get a full combo off a jump-in, they need to be super-reliable to compete in risk/reward department), they are bad. The rest is semantics.

I mean no more "50/50 to the corner in your face" MK.
To be fair, no modern FG can afford allowing passive defense to become a winning strategy. If you want less pressure and 50/50, you can expect the game to make up for that in offensive department somehow... And how would you do that without back to block?
I personally don't like this thought that defensive gameplay in newer FGs is doomed, but I fear that's a reality for us.

being able to cancel your dashes or runs kinda makes the neutral game stupid, i really think they should keep dashes like SF or Injustice
Eh... I don't think it does. Like I said, it just makes it a walking with few extra inputs. Completely unnecessary.

Also I second the opinion that I2 had the best fundamental mechanics of all NRS game. It's just... there were so many characters that could opt out of playing that fundamental game so easily.
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
@Barrogh not true, every character would have to play neutral at some point, whether they're zoning was strong or not, it all depends on if the person playing is good enough to get into that range. and a lot of characters do have to play good neutral against rushdown characters too, especially flash
 
My MK11 Gameplay list is simple
( I’ll use examples also)

- No run/ stamina concept go back to dash block

- anti airs should be from specials not s1
• example is sub zero ice burst ( ex ) will have head invulnerable frames and launch but won’t have armor ( hints no armored launchers ) so anti air should be from specials that have head invulnerability

- wakeup shouldn’t be launchers
• example sub zero icy slide will be his wakeup with 1/2 hits of armor ( 3 hit armor should be removed )

- push block/ block breaker should be 1 bar of meter not 2
• example is sub zero corner game in mkx if I block his over I should be able to push block and get out of the situation ( tones down offense corner traps, increases defensive options )

- pokes into specials shouldn’t jail
• Kitana D1, Uplift is a good example because usually Kitana D1 is -9 on block but now you add in a D1, Uplift you can start up pressure? That is so lame to me imo.

- block breakers shouldn’t knock down the aggressor ?
• when your attacking you shouldn’t be knocked down but left standing pushed back to round start distance?

- 50/50 toned down
• example sub zero has a overhead and low launcher his B2 should splat and stay a overhead and his B33 should combo into ice ball the difference now is he doesn’t have a launcher from both options and one option is punishable.
• Cassie cage F3 is overhead / DF1 is low her F33/F34 shouldn’t be special cancelled but can stay relatively safe while her DF1 can launch still but be punishable
This change will tone down the 50/50 craziness that we had and with block breakers being 1 bar you can guess right and get them off you

- Chip damage
• no chip damage on Normals/strings only on specials / ex special / x rays / and moves alike
• example - pre patch Kung Lao 112124, ex hat, 112124, ex hat, 112124, ex hat, 112124, ex hat, 112124, hat toss, all did chip with my change you’ll get your + frames and offense won’t be reductive but you won’t do nearly as much chip damage



These are my changes
 
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ImperatrixSindel

Too bad YOU... will DIE!
Y'all they are not going back to MK9 dash cancels lmao. Those made the game absolutely bizarre for spectators -- NRS cares too much about eSports hype to have the game looking that rickety. Whether or not you prefer them, it simply isn't happening.

I think some changes to run are in order -- it should be more situational, for one thing, and it needs a dedicated button -- but I'd be very surprised if it didn't come back.
 

Chernyy Volk

Wolf lord, footsie bully, chronic corner abuser.
Ok, I'm gonna offer my two cents.

I do NOT object to how mix heavy MKX is in essence. The problem is is the existence of the mix+chip damage and chip death. So, basically, this is what I think.

1: Remove chip from AT LEAST normals, if not period.

2: Remove chip death

3: Institute a Tekken-esque punish Hierarchy, full combos are only achievable at certain - points, strings/certain kinds of normals have to be used for lesser punishes.

4: Reduce the ease of access of meterless damage across the board. S1's giving everybody almost access to full combos, especially without meter, shouldn't exist IMO.
5: One bar pushblocks

6: Keep stamina, remove the backdash penalty

7: I like individual jump ins, so I'd kinda like seeing NjP's and NjK's removed, replaced with unique normals.

8: I feel like we need non-special cancelable unbreakable strings, just to prevent total freeze outs of pressing your advantage because someone has meter.

9: A lot of people may object to this, but I want staggers to be OS mashable. MKX was insane with how many -1 to 3 staggers you had to hypothetically respect due to followups, basically making them plus when people respected the staggers appropriately.

10: Invincible, not armored wakeup attacks.
 

Chernyy Volk

Wolf lord, footsie bully, chronic corner abuser.
Oh yeah, and UNIVERSALIZED frame data on base universal tools. I'm ok with 1 to 2 frame differentials like inj2, but definitely squish the frame data on d1's, s1's, d2',s etc.
 

ismael4790

Stay focused or get Caged
Y'all they are not going back to MK9 dash cancels lmao. Those made the game absolutely bizarre for spectators -- NRS cares too much about eSports hype to have the game looking that rickety. Whether or not you prefer them, it simply isn't happening.

I think some changes to run are in order -- it should be more situational, for one thing, and it needs a dedicated button -- but I'd be very surprised if it didn't come back.
There is no run in mk11. Unless they add it these months, which I doubt a lot.
 
Reactions: JDM

Barrogh

Meta saltmine
not true, every character would have to play neutral at some point, whether they're zoning was strong or not, it all depends on if the person playing is good enough to get into that range. and a lot of characters do have to play good neutral against rushdown characters too, especially flash
It's not just about pure zoning, although that's most noticeable point. Dumb stuff such as up batarang MB (coupled with good meter gain), mechanical bats (at least before nerf when they were basically always up), Starfire's trait cancels, Fate's lack of respect with cross cancels - that kind of dumb to-go options is what I'm referring to as well.

In the end neutral was still relevant, but more often than not sidelined by some "answer to everything" moves.

There is no run in mk11
Did I miss some new info?
 

Solid

The Longbow Hunter.
Well why not add mine too to the mix.
- No 50/50 combo starters. A character having a low string and an overhead is fine but both shouldn't lead to combos into knockdown into death.
- No run.
- 1 bar push block but if there are no 50/50's then this can be omitted.
- Invincible backdashes just like many other fighting games.
- Tone down jumping attacks.
- Better reward for poking. For example kounter hits on pokes giving large advantage that can't be jumped out.
- Maybe add guard crushing which leads to a combo to add something new to the series..
- Better walk speeds.
- Wall splats or wall stuns. This is optional. I love MK corners already.
 

Marlow

Premium Supporter
Premium Supporter
Removing chip death would be nice. Especially in a game where it seems like there's so many automatic chip situations. It's just a bit more satisfying to see the match end on at least some kind of hit.

I actually kind of like the run/stamina system from MKX. I thought it added a nice layer of resource management and execution for some characters. I'd like to see the backdash cost removed, but otherwise I think it's mostly fine. Letting players spend one bar of meter as a push block would help balance out the pressure.

My concern about replacing run with something like dash cancels, tied to no resource, would simply mean that dash cancelling becomes the de facto movement option for the entire cast. I like that dashes are somewhat a risk/reward. If people want a safer movement option that should be what walk is for. I'm hoping they handle the dashes similar to what they did in Injustice 2.
 

Cobainevermind87

Mid-match beer sipper
Removing chip death would be nice. Especially in a game where it seems like there's so many automatic chip situations. It's just a bit more satisfying to see the match end on at least some kind of hit.

I actually kind of like the run/stamina system from MKX. I thought it added a nice layer of resource management and execution for some characters. I'd like to see the backdash cost removed, but otherwise I think it's mostly fine. Letting players spend one bar of meter as a push block would help balance out the pressure.

My concern about replacing run with something like dash cancels, tied to no resource, would simply mean that dash cancelling becomes the de facto movement option for the entire cast. I like that dashes are somewhat a risk/reward. If people want a safer movement option that should be what walk is for. I'm hoping they handle the dashes similar to what they did in Injustice 2.
The only thing that needs to be changed is how it ties in with breakers. It seems to happen to me all the time. I'll open my opponent up, they'll use their breaker which depletes my stamina as well, and then they'll just throw out some yoloass teleport and I'm stuck eating their combo because I still can't break. Losing a round or the match because of that is just BS.
 

Marlow

Premium Supporter
Premium Supporter
With regards to launching 50/50s (or 50/50s which lead to high damage combos), I like how a game like Virtua Fighter 5 handles things. Most characters in VF5 have some type of launcher or stagger that can lead to big damage, but they're generally unsafe, or at the very least you clearly lose your turn if blocked. You can always choose to go with a throw or with some safer string/option for a lesser gauranteed damage, or go with a string that leads to some lesser pressure, but if you get a good read or condition the opponent you can go for your launcher and get rewarded with big damage. Just a quick thought, I could easily be wrong on how I'm interpretting this.
 

SonicNinja3532

The Wannabe Prodigy
1: Remove chip from AT LEAST normals, if not period.
3: Institute a Tekken-esque punish Hierarchy, full combos are only achievable at certain - points, strings/certain kinds of normals have to be used for lesser punishes
9: A lot of people may object to this, but I want staggers to be OS mashable. MKX was insane with how many -1 to 3 staggers you had to hypothetically respect due to followups, basically making them plus when people respected the staggers appropriately.
In order of quoted:

- I personally think they should take a page out of SFV's book and use grey health instead of chip instead, that way chip is recoverable but still useful. I don't mind them taking it out though.

- This actually isn't too bad an idea. Off the top of my head all of the prominent fighters in the scene follow a pattern like this; Street Fighter makes light punishes only link into another light ordinarily, on top of scaling heavier, and DBFZ simply scales light moves down heavily, and obviously you know how Tekken works.

In saying that however, I don't think they should follow the exact pattern of Tekken due to the differences in the core gameplay (special cancels, less hit states) so instead I think they should kind of use a system a bit more like DBFZ where a fast starter scales more to stop overly high damage on punishes. Considering the general pace of MK games this would slow them down in a fun way imo

- I don't see how this could work without a back to block system. The mashing staggers OS works because you can mash buttons while blocking so as soon as blockstun ends you can have it ready while still being able to block, whereas having to hold a button would mean you have to unblock to press something.
 
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