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Discussion MKXL Buffs And Nerfs That We Need

ismael4790

Stay focused or get Caged
A SAFE high that is almost near impossible to punish even when ducked unless you go for a straight uppercut.
Ex kick is a clear full combo punish if you neutral duck it. With Kenshi, s1 does the job.
The move is completely fine as is now.

Only changes Cage needs are: Stunt double gets his htb removed (in a way the variation doesn't get destroyed), and A-List loses f3 cancelable on whiff, and maybe cancels less plus ONLY if rest of cancel chars get the same treatment. Fisticuffs obviously needs buffs.
 
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Sonya
Fix hitbox issues with 1,1,1 (where third punch is whiffs) and 1,2,1 (where is second punch whiffs). Make true mid bf4. Decrease damage scalling on He-grenade.
 

SHAOLIN

内部冲突
If we are getting another patch for MKXL,( I doubt it) it needs to be about universal stuff ( whiffing issues, bugs/glitch, etc) & little to no buffs/nerfs to characters only.

NRS was on the right track, when they changes things to the universal mechanics in The MKXL Patch.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
Why nerf good characters? Buff the bad ones.

Tanya: make her EX Air and EX ground stuff + on block so she can spend meter for pressure, give her old teleport back, fix her normals, she'll immediately be good.
F4 should cancel into specials,
Meterburn on her overhead to give it armor.
Kobu: Make EX rekkas all have armor once you spent 1 bar at the start.
Pyro: Dust restands, EX Dust +8 on block.
Draginata: b1 and b2 chargeable, full charge blockbreaks and launches. +10% damage adjustment.

This will put her where top tier is right now. Still unsafe as fuck without meter, still not a top tier, but viable again.

Kitana: +10% damage adjustment.
Royal: Reflect starts up faster.
Assassin: Sharpen makes fans overhead.
Mournful: Staff normals instead of fan normals. Proper blockstun on EX glaives.
 
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RyuKazuya

Jesus is my Lord and Savior!
Idk about cage damage nerf but he shouldn't be able to cancel whiffed f3s IMO.
I think Sonya only needs for grenades to not be detonated on hit and for her divekick to be more punishable.
Aliens tail should have a hurtbox
Raiden's shocker should be a mid
I agree with Mileena changes
I'd fix Kung Lao's whiffing issues and give him a bit better start up on his back walk speed
In buzzsaw I'd make it so ex spin doesn't launch until the last hit for less gravity scaling, helping for better combos.




Unbreakable sub needs iceball run cancels :DOGE
I just gotta say, that it is really not a big deal that alist can cancel his f3 on whiff, since he can still be whiffpunished.^^

But that iceball cancel though .... :eek:
 

ando1184

Noob
@OP, when it comes to Kano, CT just needs the CT stuff addressed. Ex Upball doesn't need to be more punishable bc it already gives up his turn and on whiff it grants a full combo punish. The move is so easily low profiled it can be baited on wakeup or read. Lab it, that move in itself is not an issue. Let it be that safe on block and let it rock, it's all cyber has as a "relatively" safe wakeup option.

Edit: nerfing airball is unnecessary as well. It's a high risk low reward move to begin with. Let the low stay
 
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Wigy

There it is...
Nerfing exforceballs is pointless, you can backdash everywhere but in the corner and u can poke if you have a 7 frame poke and he doesnt even recovery enough stamina from the forceball to do another cancel if hes done two cancels.

Only time i use it is ending a pressure string with f3 ex forceball f3 exforceball then go into f3 rc pressure. Spending two bars to pressure someone providing they're in the corner and dont have a 7f poke is hardly OP.

Nerfing his damage is a dodgy one he doesnt get much midscreen, not sure there though.
 
Why nerf good characters? Buff the bad ones.

Tanya: make her EX Air and EX ground stuff + on block so she can spend meter for pressure, give her old teleport back, fix her normals, she'll immediately be good.
F4 should cancel into specials,
Meterburn on her overhead to give it armor.
Kobu: Make EX rekkas all have armor once you spent 1 bar at the start.
Pyro: Dust restands, EX Dust +8 on block.
Draginata: b1 and b2 chargeable, full charge blockbreaks and launches. +10% damage adjustment.

This will put her where top tier is right now. Still unsafe as fuck without meter, still not a top tier, but viable again.

Kitana: +10% damage adjustment.
Royal: Reflect starts up faster.
Assassin: Sharpen makes fans overhead.
Mournful: Staff normals instead of fan normals. Proper blockstun on EX glaives.
What do you mean by +10% damage adjustments?
No armor on rekka, she shouldn't have it.
Her teleport shouldn't be reverted back completely to pre patch. I would recommend recovery frames removed and invincibility is given on ground teleports for one stamina bar. If you don't have enough stamina you just don't get invincibility. I like the meterburn overhead idea. Dragon Naginata doesn't need that. What I suggested would be perfect.
 

MadeOfMetal

Kenshi Srubtastic,Cyrax, Special Forces Mains
this is like the 30th buff threaqd, but ill say whats needed, Buff: Balanced Kenshi, Jacqui High Tech, Reptile Noxious, Goro all var's, Cyrax, CSZ, Sub Zero Unbreakable, Predator Warrior, Mileena Ethreal and small adjustment buff for Ravenous, Johnny Fisty Cuffs, Bo Rai Cho all variations (maybe make his mids a bit faster or wiff less recovery), Liu Kang Duelist, Tremor Metallic, Cassie Spec ops, D'Vorah Brood Mother, Kung Lao Hat Trick, Kung Jin Ancestral, Raiden Master Of Stroms, Scorpion Inferno (the other two variations give no reason to be inferno).

many characters need a small lift and i know some think some characters are to strong or irritate them and they want them brang down a notch, but i rather like the idea of bring everyone else up a few notches, not making characters op, just giving them better tools or refining the ones they have to make them better equiped to handle the matchups at hand, like some characters can't deal with Alien or KAno CT but if you make some small adjustments on the characters that are a bit behind you can make them go from low-mid to bottom top tier, and they could very well have a small range adjustment with one move that helps in that alien matchup or a double hitting move to eat through CT's armored pressure.

Like i said we can make all of them great in thier own way, so the later part of this game that some will play even after all the evos and tournaments die down, anyone can have fun with there favorite character, even if its a Cyber Sub Zero Main, or a Kenshi balanced lover or even a sonya special forces. everyone should have the option of picking what ever variation and playing that against most of the cast. I myself liked alot of variations that when the game first came out where unfavorable variations: Master Of Storms, Demo (yes at the start she was great but everyone was on the CO bandwagon), Cassie Brawler (back then noone saw her potential) Predator Warrior (explains itsself) Kenshi Balanced, Mileena Piercing (was my first pick at day one and she was placed close to bottom in yomis tier list back then), and we all know what happened to Cyber Sub and Cyrax after 3-29, and i have stuck with them to the end. they are horrible and suck balls now but they are my favs reguardless.

Cyber Sub needs small adjustments that affect him in a huge way,

his ice ball/freeze (BF1) needs -5 startup and +5 frames of recovery (I have been saying this since the 3-29 patch, taking off 5 frames on startup would revert what they did to him on 3-29-2016 patch and give him back his B1 into BF1, and his 1/11/F13/B3 into normal freeze. as of nopw we all know on hit you can block the freeze after the first string or single hit except with his 111 string the dreaded short hitting high to langer reach mid mid. and then we could put 5 frames added to his recovery on his normal freeze so he can still not machine gun that freeze which does out trade. honestly thats all i think he needs to be decent again.


Cyrax: needs many but i can shorten it into a few simple ones. his Net needs to hold just a bit longer id say about 15 frames longer considering its risk for the small reward he gets for a landed one. His EX Shrapnel port (Teleport) needs to launch again but still keep its armor, as of now you would be dumb to use it as it only gives 11% on hit and launches them away and on the ground ending your turn for a bar. and with all the bs normal tweaks they added to his normals and bomb limitations only 3-4 high and 3-4 low in one combo and with the enormous scaling he has as well as he can't use a net after a bomb connects which is any combo he uses kind of stung alot, we need ata least metered Net after bomb connect or net having pushback to be safe close up on block or DB1 to be -6 or-7 on block. he also has some wiffing issues with B1-2+4/F13/F4 and a huge problem with recovery bug on his teleport being used in combo some times he is locked there unable to move for longer than 50 frames extra.
 

MadeOfMetal

Kenshi Srubtastic,Cyrax, Special Forces Mains
Why would Noxious Reptile need buffs?

Even without a variation Reptile is fine, and people are sleeping on what you can do with meterless gas activation. It's his best variation IMO.
its not, nimble and deceptive are worlds better than noxious, the only thing noxious offers is dd3 and well dd3 lol. and if you use that on me or use it with puddle an idiot could get out in an instant, and considering what deceptive offers, reversal on any armored move or normal with armored stealth/unseable mixups. or what nimble offers, higher damage, green zone combos, corner cary from anywhere on the map, confusion, rep goes faster while opponet is almost unable to punish or get out or even block during.

its a no brainer my brother uses Reptile since day one, cuz he loved Rep from mk2 and 9, and i have learned all 3 variations and i don't think that one move that noxious offers is justified in picking him over the other two options with many perks for each of those other two variations.

But i can respect your opinion. maybe you know something the reptile players don't? its possible, maybe pm me and show me some cool shit.


maybe i should have been clear on that a little more. what he needs is more moves or tools in that variation to make it more relevant. not to say Noxious can't be good, all reptile vars are capable of being good, they are just not Alien or CT or Mileena good, and i feel all characters should have that option. especially when the tournaments are dead and gone.

there will be no excuses then to not buff other characters and test the waters. there won't be fear that someone can lose money for a buff or adjustment they make.
 

Tweedy

Noob
its not, nimble and deceptive are worlds better than noxious, the only thing noxious offers is dd3 and well dd3 lol. and if you use that on me or use it with puddle an idiot could get out in an instant, and considering what deceptive offers, reversal on any armored move or normal with armored stealth/unseable mixups. or what nimble offers, higher damage, green zone combos, corner cary from anywhere on the map, confusion, rep goes faster while opponet is almost unable to punish or get out or even block during.

its a no brainer my brother uses Reptile since day one, cuz he loved Rep from mk2 and 9, and i have learned all 3 variations and i don't think that one move that noxious offers is justified in picking him over the other two options with many perks for each of those other two variations.

But i can respect your opinion. maybe you know something the reptile players don't? its possible, maybe pm me and show me some cool shit.


maybe i should have been clear on that a little more. what he needs is more moves or tools in that variation to make it more relevant. not to say Noxious can't be good, all reptile vars are capable of being good, they are just not Alien or CT or Mileena good, and i feel all characters should have that option. especially when the tournaments are dead and gone.

there will be no excuses then to not buff other characters and test the waters. there won't be fear that someone can lose money for a buff or adjustment they make.
Deceptive and Nimble require meter for almost all of their practical uses.

Using 34 xx gas, as a 40% midscreen punish, or just using the gas in general, does not.

Reptile as a character uses a lot of meter, for armor traps and extra damage. That's why Aura prefers Noxious > the other two. Noxious, while having the lesser of the three perks, requires no extra meter.

You see some Reptile's, like Pig, go entire matches without using the invis, because he's too busy using meter on damage and armor. A lot of the time Deceptive and Nimble are just a waste.
 

MadeOfMetal

Kenshi Srubtastic,Cyrax, Special Forces Mains
Deceptive and Nimble require meter for almost all of their practical uses.

Using 34 xx gas, as a 40% midscreen punish, or just using the gas in general, does not.

Reptile as a character uses a lot of meter, for armor traps and extra damage. That's why Aura prefers Noxious > the other two. Noxious, while having the lesser of the three perks, requires no extra meter.

You see some Reptile's, like Pig, go entire matches without using the invis, because he's too busy using meter on damage and armor. A lot of the time Deceptive and Nimble are just a waste.
well to be fair, reptile has no problem building meter back.


can you give me an example of this 34 gas combo, do you mean 34 xx dd3? or 34 xx DF3? and maybe can you show me the entire combo. cuz reguardless i wanna use this combo. i have been playing with so many characters i havent actually used this one with noxious.

if you don't mind sharing knowledge?
 

Dankster Morgan

It is better this way
this is like the 30th buff threaqd, but ill say whats needed, Buff: Balanced Kenshi, Jacqui High Tech, Reptile Noxious, Goro all var's, Cyrax, CSZ, Sub Zero Unbreakable, Predator Warrior, Mileena Ethreal and small adjustment buff for Ravenous, Johnny Fisty Cuffs, Bo Rai Cho all variations (maybe make his mids a bit faster or wiff less recovery), Liu Kang Duelist, Tremor Metallic, Cassie Spec ops, D'Vorah Brood Mother, Kung Lao Hat Trick, Kung Jin Ancestral, Raiden Master Of Stroms, Scorpion Inferno (the other two variations give no reason to be inferno).

many characters need a small lift and i know some think some characters are to strong or irritate them and they want them brang down a notch, but i rather like the idea of bring everyone else up a few notches, not making characters op, just giving them better tools or refining the ones they have to make them better equiped to handle the matchups at hand, like some characters can't deal with Alien or KAno CT but if you make some small adjustments on the characters that are a bit behind you can make them go from low-mid to bottom top tier, and they could very well have a small range adjustment with one move that helps in that alien matchup or a double hitting move to eat through CT's armored pressure.

Like i said we can make all of them great in thier own way, so the later part of this game that some will play even after all the evos and tournaments die down, anyone can have fun with there favorite character, even if its a Cyber Sub Zero Main, or a Kenshi balanced lover or even a sonya special forces. everyone should have the option of picking what ever variation and playing that against most of the cast. I myself liked alot of variations that when the game first came out where unfavorable variations: Master Of Storms, Demo (yes at the start she was great but everyone was on the CO bandwagon), Cassie Brawler (back then noone saw her potential) Predator Warrior (explains itsself) Kenshi Balanced, Mileena Piercing (was my first pick at day one and she was placed close to bottom in yomis tier list back then), and we all know what happened to Cyber Sub and Cyrax after 3-29, and i have stuck with them to the end. they are horrible and suck balls now but they are my favs reguardless.

Cyber Sub needs small adjustments that affect him in a huge way,

his ice ball/freeze (BF1) needs -5 startup and +5 frames of recovery (I have been saying this since the 3-29 patch, taking off 5 frames on startup would revert what they did to him on 3-29-2016 patch and give him back his B1 into BF1, and his 1/11/F13/B3 into normal freeze. as of nopw we all know on hit you can block the freeze after the first string or single hit except with his 111 string the dreaded short hitting high to langer reach mid mid. and then we could put 5 frames added to his recovery on his normal freeze so he can still not machine gun that freeze which does out trade. honestly thats all i think he needs to be decent again.


Cyrax: needs many but i can shorten it into a few simple ones. his Net needs to hold just a bit longer id say about 15 frames longer considering its risk for the small reward he gets for a landed one. His EX Shrapnel port (Teleport) needs to launch again but still keep its armor, as of now you would be dumb to use it as it only gives 11% on hit and launches them away and on the ground ending your turn for a bar. and with all the bs normal tweaks they added to his normals and bomb limitations only 3-4 high and 3-4 low in one combo and with the enormous scaling he has as well as he can't use a net after a bomb connects which is any combo he uses kind of stung alot, we need ata least metered Net after bomb connect or net having pushback to be safe close up on block or DB1 to be -6 or-7 on block. he also has some wiffing issues with B1-2+4/F13/F4 and a huge problem with recovery bug on his teleport being used in combo some times he is locked there unable to move for longer than 50 frames extra.
Buffing Ethereal or Ravenous Mileena is a bad idea.
 

Blonde_Huntress

Edenian Witch <3
Going against the grain, I think Mileena is actually fine as she is. Mileena is pure rush down, high risk high reward. Buff others, but she's fine as is. Maybe a few extra frames to allow for punish on blocked roll for meaty responses.

Tanya needs some buffs! I still think she got nerfed too harshly. Pyro fireballs should be quicker and with slightly less recovery. Bring back her f43 cancels. Give KJ a tighter gap in rekka. Buff. Her. Damage! Slightly increase meter gain as well so she be be decently viable.
 

Apex Kano

Kano Commando main MKX
CT don't need nerfs. He is good up close but can be beat. His safe strings just makes it so he can block or backdash afterward. EX buff better be plus, since I have to waste a meter. Leave Kano alone please.

Buff Cyber knive damage and make Commando grab on strings without meter like the beta. Thats all Kano needs to make him perfect.