MKX: The 3 to 6 Month Rule

[Compbros]

I agree about Superman's breath needing a priority fix but that's part of the problem, one issue is so highlighted so early that it overshines issues with other chracaters that are played less and are still not fully known that then stay under the radar till the patch season ends, escaping the nerf slap. Then we get stuck with characters that never got fixed and become the cheating cards of the game for the rest of the remaining years like MK9's Kenshi, Sonya, Johnny Cage, Cyrax, Kabal and Kung Lao. Even Sindel who was an under-played and rarely used character slipped under the radar because not many players used her and those who did down played her brokenness.

Then waiting six months is not what you want if you agree that some things need fixing before hand. What you're arguing is that nerfing a character may bring another, worse character to light later or may not be discovered in time to be patched and that's a bad reason to wait as there will AL WAYS be really strong characters and really weak ones. A Capcom producer said once that creating a game with perfect balance is easy, just make it a game that only has one character. Speaking of Capcom they've been patching yearly with little fixes here and there since 2009 and there's STILL really strong characters and really weak ones so, again, why wait 6 months for balance when you have a Superman that clearly needs work now?

 

[NY-Shadow]

Then waiting six months is not what you want if you agree that some things need fixing before hand. What you're arguing is that nerfing a character may bring another, worse character to light later or may not be discovered in time to be patched and that's a bad reason to wait as there will AL WAYS be really strong characters and really weak ones. A Capcom producer said once that creating a game with perfect balance is easy, just make it a game that only has one character. Speaking of Capcom they've been patching yearly with little fixes here and there since 2009 and there's STILL really strong characters and really weak ones so, again, why wait 6 months for balance when you have a Superman that clearly needs work now?

Well if the problem with patching and balancing is so difficult like you say Capcom admits too and offers the retarded solution of making a game with one character, then how do you explain a game like MK9 that even though has way too many weak characters still manages to have 5-6 characters that though are entirely different from each other, play style and move set wise, are able to face off against each other on almost equal matchup grounds like Sonya vs Cage, Kenshi vs Kabal, Kung Lao vs Cyrax ect. That just clearly shows NRS focuses more on 5-6 characters by giving them great dynamic mixup pressure options and specials and then they just slap the rest of the roster with weak mixups moves then try to make up for it by giving those weak characters 3-5% more damage output on one or two specials move and xray and call it a day.

 

[JDM]

Well if the problem with patching and balancing is so difficult like you say Capcom admits too and offers the retarded solution of making a game with one character, then how do you explain a game like MK9 that even though has way too many weak characters still manages to have 5-6 characters that though are entirely different from each other, play style and move set wise, are able to face off against each other on almost equal matchup grounds like Sonya vs Cage, Kenshi vs Kabal, Kung Lao vs Cyrax ect. That just clearly shows NRS focuses more on 5-6 characters by giving them great dynamic mixup/specials and then they just slap the rest of the roster with weak mixups moves and just give them specials that have 3-5% more damage output and call it a day.

Mk9 was their first attempt at creating a legit fighter. Of course there were a lot of shit characters

Look at injustice though, much better balance. Mkx will just improve on that.

 

[Compbros]

Well if the problem with patching and balancing is so difficult like you say Capcom admits too and offers the retarded solution of making a game with one character, then how do you explain a game like MK9 that even though has way too many weak characters still manages to have 5-6 characters that though are entirely different from each other, play style and move set wise, are able to face off against each other on almost equal matchup grounds like Sonya vs Cage, Kenshi vs Kabal, Kung Lao vs Cyrax ect. That just clearly shows NRS focuses more on 5-6 characters by giving them great dynamic mixup/specials and then they just slap the rest of the roster with weak mixups moves and just give them specials that have 3-5% more damage output and call it a day.

Say what now? I don't even know what you're arguing anymore but, sure, let's go with it. MK9's tiers were really disjointed in that the area between high and mid-town was substantial. Anyone outside of the top, like, 12 characters were almost pointless to use. And low tier? Forget that, there wasn't even a chance for some characters.

For IGAU more of the roster is viable than not and even people in the lower tier have done well in tournaments like Shazam. IGAU is balanced in its bullshit because every has dumb shit. IGAU is vastly ore balanced than MK9 while following a similar patching schedule.

 

[NY-Shadow]

Just look at Scorpion in MK9. How much better of a character he would have been if they would have allowed his Forward,4,3 to connect into a spear, and made his hell fire less telegraphic and his teleport faster on startup like smoke's teleport. See what I mean, how 2-3 simple option moves can make the world of a difference in making a character equally competitive.

 

[FinalBoss_FGC]

Fix infinites and stuff that can be deemed "breaking the game" like Scorpion's tele pre-patch.

Other than that, don't worry about shit until about the 6 month mark.

 

[NY-Shadow]

Say what now? I don't even know what you're arguing anymore but, sure, let's go with it. MK9's tiers were really disjointed in that the area between high and mid-town was substantial. Anyone outside of the top, like, 12 characters were almost pointless to use. And low tier? Forget that, there wasn't even a chance for some characters.

For IGAU more of the roster is viable than not and even people in the lower tier have done well in tournaments like Shazam. IGAU is balanced in its bullshit because every has dumb shit. IGAU is vastly ore balanced than MK9 while following a similar patching schedule.

I agree that Injustice was a game that they tried harder to balance and did a much better job that they did with MK9. But still, how do you explain Batgirl, MMH? The thing with Shazam winning by the way is like the logo on his chest, lighting strikes the same place only once. lol Where are the Batman champs?

 

[Compbros]

Just look at Scorpion in MK9. How much better of a character he would have been if they would have allowed his Forward,4,3 to connect into a spear, and made his hell fire less telegraphic and his teleport faster on startup like smoke's teleport. See what I mean, how 2-3 simple option moves can make the world of a difference in making a character equally competitive.

And in that time look how awful Kung Lao would've been with his nonsense. You're only saying the better balance for lower tiered characters with your 6 month wait while forgetting all the bullshit we'd have to deal with in the meantime that's sire to turn players off of the game.

 

[Compbros]

I agree that Injustice was a game that they tried harder to balance and did a much better job that they did with MK9. But still, how do you explain Batgirl, MMH? The thing with Shazam winning by the way, it like the logo on his chest, lighting strikes only once. lol

I explain those by saying "there'll always be stronger characters". How do explain Rose in Ultra after 6 years of balance or Yun/Yang in AE after 4?

 

[Compbros]

Fix infinites and stuff that can be deemed "breaking the game" like Scorpion's tele pre-patch.

Other than that, don't worry about shit until about the 6 month mark.

Am I gonna have to quote myself AGAIN?

 

[NY-Shadow]

I explain those by saying "there'll always be stronger characters". How do explain Rose in Ultra after 6 years of balance or Yun/Yang in AE after 4?

Would you be happy if went out to buy a bag of chips and found m&ms, raisins and dried fruit in the bag?

 

[TopTierHarley]

Would you be happy if went out to buy a bag of chips and found m&ms, raisins and dried fruit in the bag?

Yes...
Also, what kind of an analogy is that?

 

[THTB]

Some of the people saying wait 6 months (or even a year) reeeeeally love to see your games burned to the ground.

You guys do realize games have gone down this route before, only to have lost almost all interest in the game by the time the patch came out due to all the issues. And, had NRS waited that long to actually do adjustments, the exact same thing would have happened.

This isn't 1992 anymore. It's 2015. Developers are much more capable of patching and fixing things at a quicker rate. And consumers know this. Yes, MOBAs run under a F2P model, but they are a clear example of what developers of competition-based games should be doing with their games post-release, whether the game is F2P or not. Continuous and frequent support. It doesn't have to be as frequent, but at least frequent enough to show they're still caring about how their game plays.

 

[NY-Shadow]

Yes...
Also, what kind of an analogy is that?

Exactly, it's an analogy similar to what NRS has when they make characters.

 

[FinalBoss_FGC]

Am I gonna have to quote myself AGAIN?

Well since you are the king of balance issues or whatever.

I think IGAU started off RELATIVELY balanced minus the broken shit like Cyborg's infinite and stuff. First month, patch the shitty hella broken infinites and Scorpion's tele then let the game play out for a little. Don't just instantly nerf somebody because tech is found every damn day, really. Because if you nerf something and somebody finds tech that is hella broken and the only way to deal with it or take away that option is that tech that they nerfed...we have problems.

 

[NY-Shadow]

Some of the people saying wait 6 months (or even a year) reeeeeally love to see your games burned to the ground.

You guys do realize games have gone down this route before, only to have lost almost all interest in the game by the time the patch came out due to all the issues. And, had NRS waited that long to actually do adjustments, the exact same thing would have happened.

This isn't 1992 anymore. It's 2015. Developers are much more capable of patching and fixing things at a quicker rate. And consumers know this. Yes, MOBAs run under a F2P model, but they are a clear example of what developers of competition-based games should be doing with their games post-release, whether the game is F2P or not. Continuous and frequent support. It doesn't have to be as frequent, but at least frequent enough to show they're still caring about how their game plays.

But what happens when so many patches are sent out so early after the game's release when all of the characters have not been fully used and studied which usually takes almost a year to do. What happens is you end up having NRS cop the attitude of "well, we've spent enough hours making over 7-8 patches over the past 3 months, so even though we don't know what other characters are falling short of, to bad, we're done".

 

[NY-Shadow]

Well since you are the king of balance issues or whatever.

I think IGAU started off RELATIVELY balanced minus the broken shit like Cyborg's infinite and stuff. First month, patch the shitty hella broken infinites and Scorpion's tele then let the game play out for a little. Don't just instantly nerf somebody because tech is found every damn day, really. Because if you nerf something and somebody finds tech that is hella broken and the only way to deal with it or take away that option is that tech that they nerfed...we have problems.

You know, I really feel like the new MK game is going to be really good visually and gameplay wise, but will suffer tremendous balance issues now that this new three variation per character thing is in play. Just think about it, if NRS have difficulty balancing MK9 and injustice, both games that basically had only 28-30 characters, just imagine the chaos in balancing a game with 3 variations per character in the end making it a game with 30 x 3 characters! That's 90 FREAKIN CHARACTERS TO BALANCE!!!!! OMG!

 

[OnlineRon91]

But what happens when so many patches are sent out so early after the game's release when all of the characters have not been fully used and studied which usually takes almost a year to do. What happens is you end up having NRS cop the attitude of "well, we've spent enough hours making over 7-8 patches over the past 3 months, so even though we don't know what other characters are falling short of, to bad, we're done".

No one is going to figure out whose the best in 6 months, yet NRS only has enough time to patch for that amount of time.

Sure it would be nice to having "x" amount of hours of patching be conserved for a year's time, but is that how this works? If the last 2 entries were any indication, seems to me that projects have a schedule, then its off to the next project with no in between to revisit past games.

The model sucks, but it is what it is.

 

[NY-Shadow]

On another note. Why on earth would NRS use competitive tournament players to help balance a game! Let's be honest here. No disrespect to 16 BIT at all, let's just use him as an example. Can you really believe that say, 16 BIT will objectively scrutinize Kitana when that is his favorite character and the character he plans on using to compete with? The answer is of course not! He will find things that could be used as an advantage and keep his mouth shut all the way to his first attempted tournament win, and after that everyone will all see the issues and she will be nerfed. At least he will attempt to get at least one win before Kitana's problems and glitches are exposed main stream. That's another type of problem we have to deal with.

 

[NY-Shadow]

No one is going to figure out whose the best in 6 months, yet NRS only has enough time to patch for that amount of time.

Sure it would be nice to having "x" amount of hours of patching be conserved for a year's time, but is that how this works? If the last 2 entries were any indication, seems to me that projects have a schedule, then its off to the next project with no in between to revisit past games.

The model sucks, but it is what it is.

I'm afraid and sad that you are right. It just bothers me that a company (NRS) pretends to care about a community that takes the company's game so seriously as a competitive digital art form that they treat us this way. They think by throwing packs of skins and DLC characters to its costumers all is well.

 

[Euphoric]

Some of you think that NRS just sits around waiting to patch the game. There's usually a post support team and that's it. They work on other projects.

 

[Compbros]

Well since you are the king of balance issues or whatever.

I think IGAU started off RELATIVELY balanced minus the broken shit like Cyborg's infinite and stuff. First month, patch the shitty hella broken infinites and Scorpion's tele then let the game play out for a little. Don't just instantly nerf somebody because tech is found every damn day, really. Because if you nerf something and somebody finds tech that is hella broken and the only way to deal with it or take away that option is that tech that they nerfed...we have problems.

I'm at work right now so I can't give a huge response so I'll just say this: No company is king of balance, let alone some schmuck online. However, what people are asking for is crazy. NO balance for 6 months no matter what? No matter what? If you're saying "well some things may need to be changed for balance" then you're just asking NRS to do what they've been doing so people are asking for no balance regardless of how blatantly strong or weak a character is. I find it an insane thing to ask and I'll expand on why when I get home in a few hours.

 

[FinalBoss_FGC]

I'm at work right now so I can't give a huge response so I'll just say this: No company is king of balance, let alone some schmuck online. However, what people are asking for is crazy. NO balance for 6 months no matter what? No matter what? If you're saying "well some things may need to be changed for balance" then you're just asking NRS to do what they've been doing so people are asking for no balance regardless of how blatantly strong or weak a character is. I find it an insane thing to ask and I'll expand on why when I get home in a few hours.

I was being sarcastic about the king of balance comment.

 

[NY-Shadow]

I was being sarcastic about the king of balance comment.

Oh I though he was qualified in that area. You should say what you mean then.

 

[Compbros]

I was being sarcastic about the king of balance comment.

Of course you were, I didn't honestly belive you thought I was the king of balance or anything. You probably barely even seen me in the forum let alone in threads about balance lol.