MKII Tier List Discussion

[dubson]

Your "theory fighter" is so flawed seriously. Like Scorpion is just playing like a dumbass, throwing out unsafe teleports and spears and such. Ridiculous. A great scorpion player may not even get touched. His punishers to Mileena especially can whop out massive damage. What about her unsafe air sais and blocked rolls that result in huge damage? Ridiculous.

Jason thinks he knows who the best person is with each character.

 

[mortal_jason]

lmfao

1- Don't speak for Mike

2- Quit tooting your own horn

3 - Mike is one of the best , You are not. You are above average, though! Plus, being one of the best these days doesn't account for much! Nothing like OG days when you were Garbage or, heck, even the Arcade days? lmao

Sorry Pal!

Vegeta, Jason thinks his words are set in stone, thinks he is one of the best, he is stubborn, salty that he got good in a game well past its prime, and thinks he knows everything about MK2 15+ years after it came out, you will have to forgive someone as naive as him.

Also, I looooove how on your matches posted on YouTube that you state there is no lag and perfect connections, like with Scorpangel. Dude, anyone watching it can tell it was a huge lag fest!

Ray Charles could see how full of shit and yourself you are!

lmao, I'm sorry, I can't take this guy. He brought this on himself….

Mike agrees with me, we talk often about MK2. I don't speak for him unless I know he agrees with me.
My video w scorpangel was lag free on og. If you think that's laggy, you need glasses.

I'm not even responding to the rest of your bullshit.
Though I do believe it counts as major trolling, @MKillBill ?

 

[Sub0's-Icy-Balls]

DONT FEED THE TROLL!

this fucking guy! Bill, PLEASE issue a warning to this hack!

 

[MKB]

Alright, @dubson. I've been pretty lenient with your posting as of late because you've been a member and a big-time contributor since the old days, but it's starting to get out of hand in this thread now. You're crossing the line and moving into troll territory. I don't like issuing warnings (or worse) against longtime vets in the MK2 crew, but I've done it before and I'm not afraid to do it again.

Clearly you have an issue with Jason calling himself one of the best in the world. It seems like there is one simple solution - play him in a series and record it.

 

[MKK hanzo]

I think Scorp (offline) can take on Mileena all day if played RIGHT but still not an easy fight. Jax is another history. Remember that in this match, male ninjas CANactually apply close up pressure with LP on blocking Jax.

No character can sweep twice in a row the ninjas in this game also, Mileena can beat this with a quick Roll through Scorp sweep but again that bould be mileena guessing, and if she does wrong, is aaHPx2, Spear Uppercut free combo. Air Throw REALLY gurts mileena escape plans and even punish her close Air Sai (extremely dangerous and you need to read very well your opponent). She CANT throw ground Sai at some distances cuse scorp can cath her with crouched spear, and also she CANT sweep outside range because its another free spear on her recovery ( at 01:36 extremely hard to do and to space right)

ALL female ninjas sweeps can be punished with uppercutts while blocking after a deep jump so they need to have those aaHK really well spaced.

IMO:

5.5 - 4.5 Mileena

6-4 vs Jax

Two cents: bad thing to gauge top players on this game online. Its a VERY different game offline.

This is a long set (ft15) me Scorp vs the best Mileena player here in my state. Im NOT good at MKII btw but just play with scorp for fun. (I change to mileena mirror halfway hahahahah)

NINJA EDIT: Quoting @ded

Scorpion can be very dangerious in corner, thanks to his spear. He is one of the biggest threats to god tier mileena.

 

[vegeta]

Chill out guys c'mon. I was just having a legit discussion. I've been playing MK since 1 and I'm going by info and tactics that worked for years back then and even now when I play it occasionally. Everyone has their views. I just played turtle scorpion and via my own experience simply didn't agree with him being bad vs mileena and jax. He's always been known to myself and others to be able to beat the top 2 but nobody else (generalizing) Nonetheless I digress. These days it doesn't matter I suppose. I'm just totally nostalgic.

 

[vegeta]

*note* I'm also going by arcade days or offline play. Online changes things slightly with any lag. Either way I'm not salty or contributing to any trolling, just talkin ^_^

 

[dubson]

Jason is the one who saw me disagree with him in match-up discussion between Scorpion and co and insecurely mentioned that he is the best player in the world, along Mike… (instigation, can't handle the heat, get out the kitchen) That wouldn't make his words set in stone or his opinion the only opinion even if it was true. All I can say is thank you to Hanzo for speaking up and stating his opinion. I wish more vets/great players would on the subject, or the community risks only hearing and seeing Jason's posts. If keeping it 100% real in here is going to get me warned or worse, I am prepared, but I am no troll. But I don't see a point in being over sensitive. This is all out of keeping MK2 alive at the end of the day isn't it? It's not like I can't or won't be friends with Jason, we've known each other a while now. Just disagree with how he carries himself at times.

I have an issue with him dubbing HIMSELF and saying he is best player in the world. NOT one of the best. I do agree he is currently one of the best online. He may have got some shout outs as one of the best, but we all have, if we were a top player at any given point in this games time. Also have an issue with him thinking that if he is one of the best now, with a much less populated kommunity, that he can discredit previous top players who don't play as much as he does now. Also have an issue with him speaking for Mike. Don't speak for him, especially in Tier list discussion. That's ridiculous, speak for yourself. He disregards all the data collected before him and thinks his opinions are what is valid now, its naive.

This is tier list discussion. That's what we are doing… This is good discussion. Scorpion is a super solid character in MK2, very middle of the road.

He stated that Scorpion is one of the WORST picks against Mileena and Jax (I agree against Liu). I disagree, and many would. I do agree he obviously isn't favored, but it isn't near as bad as you state. For example, just off the top of my head, I can state 5 WORSE picks (IMO) against Jax and Mileena than Scorpion, that says a lot in itself as to whether Scorpion is one of the worst against them:

Mileena:
Reptile
Baraka
Johnny Cage
Sub-Zero
Kitana

Jax:
Sub-Zero
Reptile
Baraka
Raiden
Kitana

 

[dubson]

I think Scorp (offline) can take on Mileena all day if played RIGHT but still not an easy fight. Jax is another history. Remember that in this match, male ninjas CANactually apply close up pressure with LP on blocking Jax.

No character can sweep twice in a row the ninjas in this game also, Mileena can beat this with a quick Roll through Scorp sweep but again that bould be mileena guessing, and if she does wrong, is aaHPx2, Spear Uppercut free combo. Air Throw REALLY gurts mileena escape plans and even punish her close Air Sai (extremely dangerous and you need to read very well your opponent). She CANT throw ground Sai at some distances cuse scorp can cath her with crouched spear, and also she CANT sweep outside range because its another free spear on her recovery ( at 01:36 extremely hard to do and to space right)

ALL female ninjas sweeps can be punished with uppercutts while blocking after a deep jump so they need to have those aaHK really well spaced.

IMO:

5.5 - 4.5 Mileena

6-4 vs Jax

Two cents: bad thing to gauge top players on this game online. Its a VERY different game offline.

This is a long set (ft15) me Scorp vs the best Mileena player here in my state. Im NOT good at MKII btw but just play with scorp for fun. (I change to mileena mirror halfway hahahahah)

NINJA EDIT: Quoting @ded

Great post, and great quote by ded_

 

[dubson]

Mileena loses to nobody overall. She beats Scorpion at least 6-4. Also, keep in mind that tier lists are based on the characters being played to their fullest potential.

Old post from Mike. Says nothing about agreeing with Jason or Mileena DESTROYING Scorpion, mentions around 6-4

 

[Konqrr]

Great post @MKK hanzo. I agree that Scorpion does well against both Mileena and Jax and only loses 6-4 for the reasons mentioned.

Against Mileena, he can't let her in or get cornered and against a truly great (and patient) Scorpion this is extremely difficult to do. Sweep punishes as Hanzo pointed out are great in the footsie game and she can't mindlessly throw sais which allows Scorpion to move around freely to position his teleports to get in range for sweeps and chip damage. One blocked roll with Scorpion's back to the edge of the screen nets him an aaHPHP, JP, delayed TP, Spear, Uppercut combo for HUGE damage and is typically a round ender. Any other roll means aaHPHP, Spear, Uppercut for around 40%.

 

[mortal_jason]

I talked to Mike and I was mistaken.
He said he believes Mileena beats Scorp 8-2, and that the post dubson is quoting is old.

Anyway, you guys can believe what you like. Take your Scorpions and face the greatest Mileenas.
Versus elite Mileenas, Scorpion would be lucky to win 1 match out of 10.
It's a very difficult match. And I am happy to play anyone a 10 set to prove it
@vegeta are you on ps3? I can show you why Scorp is a bad pick vs her.

@dubson I am ONE of the best in the world. I understand every match up in the game better than most.
I didn't say I was THE best, despite yes, many people telling me that.
There are a lot of variables in the game especially online where lots of bullshit happens.

 

[mortal_jason]

I think Scorp (offline) can take on Mileena all day if played RIGHT but still not an easy fight. Jax is another history. Remember that in this match, male ninjas CANactually apply close up pressure with LP on blocking Jax.

No character can sweep twice in a row the ninjas in this game also, Mileena can beat this with a quick Roll through Scorp sweep but again that bould be mileena guessing, and if she does wrong, is aaHPx2, Spear Uppercut free combo. Air Throw REALLY gurts mileena escape plans and even punish her close Air Sai (extremely dangerous and you need to read very well your opponent). She CANT throw ground Sai at some distances cuse scorp can cath her with crouched spear, and also she CANT sweep outside range because its another free spear on her recovery ( at 01:36 extremely hard to do and to space right)

ALL female ninjas sweeps can be punished with uppercutts while blocking after a deep jump so they need to have those aaHK really well spaced.

IMO:

5.5 - 4.5 Mileena

6-4 vs Jax

Two cents: bad thing to gauge top players on this game online. Its a VERY different game offline.

This is a long set (ft15) me Scorp vs the best Mileena player here in my state. Im NOT good at MKII btw but just play with scorp for fun. (I change to mileena mirror halfway hahahahah)

NINJA EDIT: Quoting @ded

Yes Scorpion can beat average Mileenas regularly.
But versus a Mileena like Caldwell's or InsaneBoss's, Scorpion is screwed.

 

[MKK hanzo]

There are a lot of variables in the game especially online where lots of bullshit happens.

No offense but then we should disregard like 70% of yout tier/matchup info? Offline is the ONLY envuroment where a TRUE competitive tier list should be made.

I hate when ppl say "when online and JAX CAN ACTUALLY WALK"............. then I stop reading. Seriously?

How do you gauge your skill or a tier list/matchup having RANDOM VARIABLES and worse: not even facing other players on EQUAL footing?

I have seen your vids ans yes they are good for being ONLINE, but thats it. No offense again and dont take it wrong, but if you want to prove all this theory fighter, you should ride to a nearby tourney where actually TOP players are in.

I would PAY to play against I consider personally the greatest MKII player ever: KanoMKII

Big hug to everyone.

 

[MKB]

Jason is the one who saw me disagree with him in match-up discussion between Scorpion and co and insecurely mentioned that he is the best player in the world, along Mike… (instigation, can't handle the heat, get out the kitchen) That wouldn't make his words set in stone or his opinion the only opinion even if it was true. All I can say is thank you to Hanzo for speaking up and stating his opinion. I wish more vets/great players would on the subject, or the community risks only hearing and seeing Jason's posts. If keeping it 100% real in here is going to get me warned or worse, I am prepared, but I am no troll. But I don't see a point in being over sensitive. This is all out of keeping MK2 alive at the end of the day isn't it? It's not like I can't or won't be friends with Jason, we've known each other a while now. Just disagree with how he carries himself at times.

I have an issue with him dubbing HIMSELF and saying he is best player in the world. NOT one of the best. I do agree he is currently one of the best online. He may have got some shout outs as one of the best, but we all have, if we were a top player at any given point in this games time. Also have an issue with him thinking that if he is one of the best now, with a much less populated kommunity, that he can discredit previous top players who don't play as much as he does now. Also have an issue with him speaking for Mike. Don't speak for him, especially in Tier list discussion. That's ridiculous, speak for yourself. He disregards all the data collected before him and thinks his opinions are what is valid now, its naive.

This is tier list discussion. That's what we are doing… This is good discussion. Scorpion is a super solid character in MK2, very middle of the road.

He stated that Scorpion is one of the WORST picks against Mileena and Jax (I agree against Liu). I disagree, and many would. I do agree he obviously isn't favored, but it isn't near as bad as you state. For example, just off the top of my head, I can state 5 WORSE picks (IMO) against Jax and Mileena than Scorpion, that says a lot in itself as to whether Scorpion is one of the worst against them:

Mileena:
Reptile
Baraka
Johnny Cage
Sub-Zero
Kitana

Jax:
Sub-Zero
Reptile
Baraka
Raiden
Kitana

To an extent, I can agree with your assessment. A community is made up of more than one or two people and it is best if multiple people contribute. A high skill level does not automatically make someone's opinion the gospel; but it certainly does make it worthy of heavy consideration. As far as the online VS offline argument that @MKK hanzo is making goes.... look, we've been down this road with other offliners in the past. Online players such as myself, @btbb99, DavidGEM, and BillyBats have all gone to offline majors and either won or placed top 2 (my day in the sun will come soon enough.) Writing off online as completely irrelevant is hogwash and the performances of those mentioned proves it. ALTHOUGH... I will agree that any game, in its purest form, is best evaluated offline.

 

[Konqrr]

No offense but then we should disregard like 70% of yout tier/matchup info? Offline is the ONLY envuroment where a TRUE competitive tier list should be made.

I hate when ppl say "when online and JAX CAN ACTUALLY WALK"............. then I stop reading. Seriously?

How do you gauge your skill or a tier list/matchup having RANDOM VARIABLES and worse: not even facing other players on EQUAL footing?

I have seen your vids ans yes they are good for being ONLINE, but thats it. No offense again and dont take it wrong, but if you want to prove all this theory fighter, you should ride to a nearby tourney where actually TOP players are in.

I would PAY to play against I consider personally the greatest MKII player ever: KanoMKII

Big hug to everyone.

KanoMKII is one of the best I've ever played... the things he can do ONLINE are ridiculous. That guy is amazing.

 

[mortal_jason]

No offense but then we should disregard like 70% of yout tier/matchup info? Offline is the ONLY envuroment where a TRUE competitive tier list should be made.

I hate when ppl say "when online and JAX CAN ACTUALLY WALK"............. then I stop reading. Seriously?

How do you gauge your skill or a tier list/matchup having RANDOM VARIABLES and worse: not even facing other players on EQUAL footing?

I have seen your vids ans yes they are good for being ONLINE, but thats it. No offense again and dont take it wrong, but if you want to prove all this theory fighter, you should ride to a nearby tourney where actually TOP players are in.

I would PAY to play against I consider personally the greatest MKII player ever: KanoMKII

Big hug to everyone.

I played KanoMK2 on Mame a few times. His name is Angel, he is a cool guy. Just too bad he doesn't live in the USA.
I remember the last set vs him I won about 35-15 in randoms, and he said I was one of the best he'd ever played.
I didn't put too much stock in it however because it was laggy for us both. But it was obvious he was elite level.
His Lao was the sickest I've ever seen. We had some epic matches!

Like @MKillBill said, online skills give you a good estimation of offline. I guarantee you every elite player is even better offline (except probably splendour).
And when an offline tournament comes to my State, I'll be there. Don't see any MK2 majors floating around these days.
My friend Kevin592c once said "If MK2 were a sport, you'd be a millionaire". How I wish there were MK2 offline tournaments every week and I could quit my job

BTW, the tier list is written assuming that the game connection is perfect.

 

[dubson]

I talked to Mike and I was mistaken.
He said he believes Mileena beats Scorp 8-2, and that the post dubson is quoting is old.

Again, please do not speak for Mike. No offense, but we just cannot trust that it is coming from him, and that you are not leading him on to agree with you. Stop, seriously. The post is old?? Granted it is from 2013, but this game came out 15+ years ago. Your telling me that within a year he went from thinking the match-up was closer to even to total domination? Your telling me that You and Him found information that changed a match-up that drastically within a year, 15+ years after its prime that none else could figure out? You see where I am going here? Anyone time anyone disagrees with you on match-up related information, you get defensive and think your opinion is the truth and everyone else is wrong or misinformed. You think you know more than people have for a very long time. Its ridiculous

Anyway, you guys can believe what you like. Take your Scorpions and face the greatest Mileenas.
Versus elite Mileenas, Scorpion would be lucky to win 1 match out of 10.

What about Elite Scorpions? This is where it is a serious problem with you making Tier lists and people listening to you. You have no experience or business making a tier list. Plain and simple. You don't understand the mechanics and to be point blank, your tier list is awful. Look at the amount of 9-1 and 8-2 match-ups. Are you serious? Do you have any idea how bad a game/character/match-up has to be to be 8-2, let alone 9-1? Look at tier lists made by us, anyone, on any game and see how often you see match-ups with 8-2 and 9-1. Very rare bud. Let alone a ZERO you even had? That doesn't happen man. Sorry. This game is much more balanced that you, and many know. Baraka also isn't as high as you think, as Zaq and previous others have said all he has is normals. He may not be the worst but your way too high on him dude. But once again, you decide not to listen to previous vets.

@vegeta are you on ps3? I can show you why Scorp is a bad pick vs her.

Seriously? Like he is even close to your level, what is any of that going to prove.

@dubson I am ONE of the best in the world.
I didn't say I was THE best, despite yes, many people telling me that.

Actually, you did say you were the best. Right here incase you forgot (which is what started most of this because you feel you need to state how good you are in every post, just put it in your fuckin sig or something for gods sake lmfao):

Caldwell and I are the 2 best MK2 players, so if we say Mileena and Jax destroy Scorpion, there's probably something to that

Next -

Yes Scorpion can beat average Mileenas regularly.
But versus a Mileena like Caldwell's or InsaneBoss's, Scorpion is screwed.

Once again places emphasis on an average player with an average character against a top player with a top character and tries to make a point. Once again assumes that Mike and Boss have the best Mileenas ever made/ever played and doesn't think anyone has ever played a top Mileena for that past 15+ years, and that they know things us and others don't.

I played KanoMK2 on Mame a few times. His name is Angel, he is a cool guy. Just too bad he doesn't live in the USA.
I remember the last set vs him I won about 35-15 in randoms, and he said I was one of the best he'd ever played.
I didn't put too much stock in it however because it was laggy for us both. But it was obvious he was elite level.
His Lao was the sickest I've ever seen. We had some epic matches!

Once again. Someone mentions a top player, Jason feels the need to state a "story" about how they played 50+ online matches (which I don't even believe half the time, I think he just makes these sessions up and/or exaggerates them), with players past their prime (your still playing every day) and ONLINE. Maybe not even in the same COUNTRY. And he boasts, makes vids of them fighting online, its ridiculous. They always mention your one of the best they have ever played too right? Most of your stories are pretty similar… (not worth as much as you think). Glad to know you think you can label who you think is Elite and who is not too. (just like how you think you can dub yourself Elite)

Like @MKillBill said, online skills give you a good estimation of offline. I guarantee you every elite player is even better offline (except probably splendour).
.

Actually, not really. Maybe for one person, but not always both. You see? Every elite is better offline, and then you proceed to mention a player who wouldn't be. Again. This isn't true. This is the reason Trikke91 (UMK3, Robo Smoke, Online player) has great success online but would be terrible offline. Like Hanzo mentioned, but again, is a concept you wouldn't be able to grasp. Trikke91 would never be as good offline as he is online. Why? His strategies, tactics and play are all based off of online play. Everyone knows this and he has never been acknowledged as a great player because of it. He is very defensive about it. He also lives in Italy, meaning he couldn't travel to offline tournaments against us American players anyway.

And when an offline tournament comes to my State, I'll be there. Don't see any MK2 majors floating around these days.
My friend Kevin592c once said "If MK2 were a sport, you'd be a millionaire". How I wish there were MK2 offline tournaments every week and I could quit my job

Another shout out from someone to boast yourself? Anyway. You seriously are going to use "waiting for a major" to come to my state as a crutch? Seriously? Your not willing to travel? Bro, not to put you on blast, but don't you live in Wisconsin? I wouldn't hold my breath on that if I were you. Most people are willing to travel to prove they are what they claim they are

BTW, the tier list is written assuming that the game connection is perfect.

Seriously? You mean you tier list is based on perfect connection? Does that even exist as a real thing? Does it even need to be stated? Again, tier lists aren't based on online play, but offline. Where everyone has the exact same connection. PERFECT. REAL PERFECTION. Undebatable bullshit for people to use as a CRUTCH. Cant believe you even threw this out there like it needed to be stated.

 

[dubson]

To an extent, I can agree with your assessment. A community is made up of more than one or two people and it is best if multiple people contribute. A high skill level does not automatically make someone's opinion the gospel; but it certainly does make it worthy of heavy consideration. As far as the online VS offline argument that @MKK hanzo is making goes.... look, we've been down this road with other offliners in the past. Online players such as myself, @btbb99, DavidGEM, and BillyBats have all gone to offline majors and either won or placed top 2 (my day in the sun will come soon enough.) Writing off online as completely irrelevant is hogwash and the performances of those mentioned proves it. ALTHOUGH... I will agree that any game, in its purest form, is best evaluated offline.

We are talking about tier list discussion as well as best in the world. Not just skill level. This is a more narrow subject. Neither should be based on online play, Sorry!

 

[dubson]

No offense but then we should disregard like 70% of yout tier/matchup info? Offline is the ONLY envuroment where a TRUE competitive tier list should be made.

I hate when ppl say "when online and JAX CAN ACTUALLY WALK"............. then I stop reading. Seriously?

How do you gauge your skill or a tier list/matchup having RANDOM VARIABLES and worse: not even facing other players on EQUAL footing?

I have seen your vids ans yes they are good for being ONLINE, but thats it. No offense again and dont take it wrong, but if you want to prove all this theory fighter, you should ride to a nearby tourney where actually TOP players are in.

I would PAY to play against I consider personally the greatest MKII player ever: KanoMKII

Big hug to everyone.

Exactly he has been contradictory, defending online play, perfect connections, then uses lag as he pleases as well as states there could be "Random Variables", lmao. Secondly, his Scorpion isn't anywhere near Elite, nor is Scoprion one of his best characters. See how testing with his Scorpion against Mileenas or anyone wouldn't account for much? Yet he thinks because he is such a skilled played, that it does. He doesn't understand the difference. Once again for the record, during the beginning of the OG days (not but a few years ago) this man was a 2 character specialist and tires to cover it up (Kitana and Mileena), but dub knows the truth

Jason is a great player. That doesn't mean his Scorpion is Elite, nor that Scorpion is one of his best characters. Nor does it mean he is equally good with every character. Concepts Im not sure if he understands, though.

Also agree about his online videos. They do not account for much at all! Some of them look so laggy its disgusting! And he claims they are lag free!

 

[mortal_jason]

Again, please do not speak for Mike. No offense, but we just cannot trust that it is coming from him, and that you are not leading him on to agree with you. Stop, seriously. The post is old?? Granted it is from 2013, but this game came out 15+ years ago. Your telling me that within a year he went from thinking the match-up was closer to even to total domination? Your telling me that You and Him found information that changed a match-up that drastically within a year, 15+ years after its prime that none else could figure out? You see where I am going here? Anyone time anyone disagrees with you on match-up related information, you get defensive and think your opinion is the truth and everyone else is wrong or misinformed. You think you know more than people have for a very long time. Its ridiculous



What about Elite Scorpions? This is where it is a serious problem with you making Tier lists and people listening to you. You have no experience or business making a tier list. Plain and simple. You don't understand the mechanics and to be point blank, your tier list is awful. Look at the amount of 9-1 and 8-2 match-ups. Are you serious? Do you have any idea how bad a game/character/match-up has to be to be 8-2, let alone 9-1? Look at tier lists made by us, anyone, on any game and see how often you see match-ups with 8-2 and 9-1. Very rare bud. Let alone a ZERO you even had? That doesn't happen man. Sorry. This game is much more balanced that you, and many know. Baraka also isn't as high as you think, as Zaq and previous others have said all he has is normals. He may not be the worst but your way too high on him dude. But once again, you decide not to listen to previous vets.



Seriously? Like he is even close to your level, what is any of that going to prove.



Actually, you did say you were the best. Right here incase you forgot (which is what started most of this because you feel you need to state how good you are in every post, just put it in your fuckin sig or something for gods sake lmfao):


Next -



Once again places emphasis on an average player with an average character against a top player with a top character and tries to make a point. Once again assumes that Mike and Boss have the best Mileenas ever made/ever played and doesn't think anyone has ever played a top Mileena for that past 15+ years, and that they know things us and others don't.



Once again. Someone mentions a top player, Jason feels the need to state a "story" about how they played 50+ online matches (which I don't even believe half the time, I think he just makes these sessions up and/or exaggerates them), with players past their prime (your still playing every day) and ONLINE. Maybe not even in the same COUNTRY. And he boasts, makes vids of them fighting online, its ridiculous. They always mention your one of the best they have ever played too right? Most of your stories are pretty similar… (not worth as much as you think). Glad to know you think you can label who you think is Elite and who is not too. (just like how you think you can dub yourself Elite)



Actually, not really. Maybe for one person, but not always both. You see? Every elite is better offline, and then you proceed to mention a player who wouldn't be. Again. This isn't true. This is the reason Trikke91 (UMK3, Robo Smoke, Online player) has great success online but would be terrible offline. Like Hanzo mentioned, but again, is a concept you wouldn't be able to grasp. Trikke91 would never be as good offline as he is online. Why? His strategies, tactics and play are all based off of online play. Everyone knows this and he has never been acknowledged as a great player because of it. He is very defensive about it. He also lives in Italy, meaning he couldn't travel to offline tournaments against us American players anyway.

Mike is in the process of getting his log-in info back from Bill so that he can speak for himself. We've been having quite a laugh about you.

Mmm what match up did I say is 10-0?

You're free to believe however you want about the tier, about where Baraka falls on it. We all have our opinions and mine is based on my personal experiences. It's up to others to decide who they find more credible.

Elite Mileena vs elite Scorpion is still 9-1 or 8-2.
And I had no idea what vegeta's level was, sorry.

Mike and I have been called "the best MK2 players" numerous times, by many people. I didn't think I would offend you by saying that.

I don't lie about results. If I say I beat Kano 35-15 last time, it's true.
If I say Broken 8 streaked me in Reptile mirrors once, it's true.
If I say Caldwell 25 streaked me in Kitana mirrors once, it's true.
When I say I beat Foozer 18-2 once, it's true... and luckily we agreed to record. Or else people would be saying I "lied" about that result too.

Trikke is not elite. He manipulates a top tier character in 200 ping.
The players who ONLY play in 200 ping, would most likely get wrecked in a real connection.

 

[mortal_jason]

Exactly he has been contradictory, defending online play, perfect connections, then uses lag as he pleases as well as states there could be "Random Variables", lmao. Secondly, his Scorpion isn't anywhere near Elite, nor is Scoprion one of his best characters. See how testing with his Scorpion against Mileenas or anyone wouldn't account for much? Yet he thinks because he is such a skilled played, that it does. He doesn't understand the difference. Once again for the record, during the beginning of the OG days (not but a few years ago) this man was a 2 character specialist and tires to cover it up (Kitana and Mileena), but dub knows the truth

Jason is a great player. That doesn't mean his Scorpion is Elite, nor that Scorpion is one of his best characters. Nor does it mean he is equally good with every character. Concepts Im not sure if he understands, though.

Also agree about his online videos. They do not account for much at all! Some of them look so laggy its disgusting! And he claims they are lag free!

The only one that has any lag was vs Foozer which you can see is slower.
Others look bad coz of my tv/camera, but they are not lagged.
LOL at them being so laggy it's disgusting.

Stop your trolling, seriously.

 

[dubson]

I'm not trolling man. And for the record, me and Mike are long time friends. We have had plenty of laughs about you too

Seriously, the vid against Scorpangel was disgusting.

Mileena vs Scorpion is not 9-1 or 8-2

You said somewhere that you played Scorpangel Kitana vs Jax 165 matches, and I don't believe that.

You still base stories and who is better off single, garbage, online sessions against players who don't play every day like you do and I think its childish

You had Scorpion vs Liu at a ZERO for Scorp. Granted it's horrible for him (even more than the other male ninjas) but it is not a ZERO and there are none.

 

[dubson]

OK to be fair I now see you tier list is based on a 0-4 ranking. This isn't detailed enough anyway and is still a joke for a tier list. 0-4? 0 being "fighter owned", lmfao

lets just be honest you probably would have it at 10-0 or 9-1

 

[nwo]

Actually, not really. Maybe for one person, but not always both. You see? Every elite is better offline, and then you proceed to mention a player who wouldn't be. Again. This isn't true. This is the reason Trikke91 (UMK3, Robo Smoke, Online player) has great success online but would be terrible offline. Like Hanzo mentioned, but again, is a concept you wouldn't be able to grasp. Trikke91 would never be as good offline as he is online. Why? His strategies, tactics and play are all based off of online play. Everyone knows this and he has never been acknowledged as a great player because of it. He is very defensive about it. He also lives in Italy, meaning he couldn't travel to offline tournaments against us American players anyway.

Nothing against Trikke91 (because I've never played him), but I agree. Not everyone would be "better" just because they are playing offline. I can easily lose 0-5 to someone who's been playing UMK3 for less than 1 year and who openly admits to me they are on wifi. Every single tactic they use I've seen a million times, but the timing on the entire game is thrown off so bad its not even remotely the same game. The funny thing is, a lot of times they can still move and perform their moves even in an absolute SHIT environment.

Which lead me to start thinking deeper about lag and the causes of it. There are different types and it doesn't always go both ways (I might make a video about it in the future).

Also high execution characters (characters with large combos and infinities) would gain more from playing offline since dropped inputs and delay wouldn't be an issue. That's why I think there should be an offline AND an online tier list, at least for UMK3, probably even for MK2.