General/Other - Kotal Kahn Kotal Kahn needs BUFFS

[Mr Aquaman]

Wow. Just saw this thread.











No.

 

[Pnut]

War God Kotal is just a wannabe Cassie Cage/D'vorah/KJ. People aren't realizing that every one of his footsie tools are punishable so they are spamming "Oh My God the range!!!" The "huge" damage bill is also being sold because people are starting their combos with f2 which is almost never practical. And even if he does start with f2 he still gets outdamaged by most of the cast. He gets around 36% for 1 bar (practically) which is below average compared to a lot of other characters. This variation, however, does have one of the best wakeups in the game, being a 2 hit armored launching overhead. If Kotal goes untouched throughout the game's life, you guys will see that we were right all along. Sorry that Kotal players are getting away with murder because of your lack of matchup knowledge. This character is midtier at best who has no counter zoning presence or ways to compete in footsies safely (Note I said safely,he can compete in footsies with almost anyone.) When push comes to shove, there are characters that play Kotal's, game just way better.

 

[regulas]

Wow. Just saw this thread.











No.

Do you consider Blood Offering and God Ray as decent usable abilities that you normally rely on in matches? And Do you find Blood god and Sun God to be at least viably tournament competative (doesnt have to be on par with war).

 

[Hellbringer]

Well there are a ton of bloodgod players in tournaments and alot of them making top 8 so we need to "lab it up"... Oh wait....

 

[Chairface_ChipNDale]

You would think with a variation called SUN God the Sun Ray would have extra buffs or benefits to that variation. Increased damage or health regen maybe increased damage/speed on sun stone if he's in the ray would be awesome.

 

[Shady]

 

[regulas]

Well there are a ton of bloodgod players in tournaments and alot of them making top 8 so we need to "lab it up"... Oh wait....

Reserved.

 

[John Grizzly]

Well there are a ton of bloodgod players in tournaments and alot of them making top 8 so we need to "lab it up"... Oh wait....

I've never seen one. Ever.

 

[Crayraven]

I've never seen one. Ever.

I think he was being sarcastic.

 

[John Grizzly]

I think he was being sarcastic.

 

[LeeVanDam]

The only other gripe I have besides the EX Air Takedown trading very often, is that I think the regular parry should be able to cancel into itself. At 8 frame startup, it's not an emergency tool... you're making a hard read to use the parry unless there is a string you know can be interrupted.

 

[regulas]

The only other gripe I have besides the EX Air Takedown trading very often, is that I think the regular parry should be able to cancel into itself. At 8 frame startup, it's not an emergency tool... you're making a hard read to use the parry unless there is a string you know can be interrupted.

Thats what EX parry is for.

 

[Wigy]

War God Variation.
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1. His EX DB.1 shows in the frame data as 0 on block, but in reality it is -14 or more ... NRS need to fix this.
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2. Blood offering is useless :

A. They need to make it 30 frames faster to make it Viable ( to end the combo with it )

B. Or They leave the recovery the way it is, But give him -5- enhanced damage hit instead of -3- hits.

C. Or They leave the recovery the way it is, but make it cost only 5% instead of 10%
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3. His B2 is a joke :

A. they should make it faster , OR

B. They leave it the way it is, But if it hits ... it bounce the opponent into a juggling state to combo
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4. His Ex Sun Ray should have faster recovery
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5. Make his DB.2 a bit safer but with less damage
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6. His Axe throw should be faster by 15 Frames
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7. Make his normals 1 or 2 frames FASTER would be nice

Disagree with 3-7

 

[Mr Aquaman]

Do you consider Blood Offering and God Ray as decent usable abilities that you normally rely on in matches? And Do you find Blood god and Sun God to be at least viably tournament competative (doesnt have to be on par with war).

Yes. One medium risks for a game changing damage increase. The other is a great way to force a move, ex is one of his best anti cornered options. I can think of a few great reasons for these skills. his unlockable cancel can be down right broken in the corner. Who said it was bad? Sun God is a fundamental style. Without great execution, spacing, and a bit of good reads he isn't for you. Blood god, high risk high reward, anything else would be broken.

 

[DavS13]

But he has three damage buffs dough

 

[regulas]

Yes. One medium risks for a game changing damage increase. The other is a great way to force a move, ex is one of his best anti cornered options. I can think of a few great reasons for these skills. his unlockable cancel can be down right broken in the corner. Who said it was bad? Sun God is a fundamental style. Without great execution, spacing, and a bit of good reads he isn't for you. Blood god, high risk high reward, anything else would be broken.

Well I can't outright argue with your opinion really, though the next questions: Do you have some secret to using them outside of combo ending? And you don't find that loosing out on oki or damage and leaving yourself to blocking is at all a problem? Like if your trapped in the corner you find it it's better to God Ray then it is to escape for example? I've watched pros completely ignore the ray and not have a significant impact on them.

Or it's better to deal 6-8% less damage and loose oki and pressure, and take 10% yourself in exchange for the possibility of doing more future damage?


And you don't think when people learn the match-ups that Sun and Blood God won't be easy to take advantage of even though their only easy ways to open people up is to punish? It feels like a pro who's learned the match-up would be able to just play carfully and have little trouble.

 

[ColdSpine]

Sun god is a just a bad version of commando kano when it comes to command throw.

Maximizing sun choke gives u 17% damage. Simply there is no reason the opponent should be afraid in close range coz they will blow u up with a 40% combo everytime u whiff.

Commando kano gets 20% from one dfb4, two equals 40%, that is a one command throw combined with the insane range and advantage on some of his normals, opponent will respect your pressure trust me.



Im not complaining, ive mained kotal since day 1 until today, and i gotta tell u war god is all he has now.

Other variations seem good on paper, not ingame. Anyone who thinks otherwise are clearly fooling themselves.

 

[kenzokukien]

The thing with Kotal is that, once you buff up some of his normals even by a little bit, he becomes bottom-half tier to top 10 tier pretty easily.
He's one of those tricky characters where it's evident he's not braindead usable like other chars and some moves may need work, but any slight change might may him close to being broken.

 

[regulas]

The thing with Kotal is that, once you buff up some of his normals even by a little bit, he becomes bottom-half tier to top 10 tier pretty easily.
He's one of those tricky characters where it's evident he's not braindead usable like other chars and some moves may need work, but any slight change might may him close to being broken.

Which is why all I want is a minor speed boost to his too overly slow specials. Like 10 frames faster on Blood offering (like 53 frames?) and 20 frames faster on God Ray (So like 44 Frames or whichever don't have them in front of me). They would still be hard to use, you would not be able to use them inside combo's, but it would make them actual practical moves by cancelling out some of the unnecessary added disadvantages to using them (like loss of oki) or possibly allowing them to be used full screen without allowing an automatic fullscreen combo punish.

 

[D. R.]

Sun God is a fundamental style. Without great execution, spacing, and a bit of good reads he isn't for you.

This can apply to any character not top tier. Lmao Come on now.

Besides War God (The definitive variation and dare I say a top 10 character), the other two need tweaks. I have ideas to make BG and SG better without breaking the character:

Universal:
-b2 pops up high enough for d1 to hit, allowing d1 xx AA grab to become an option. Make b2 more negative on block (-12).
-make normal parry 5 frame start up OR allow the buff to last until a hit is landed, not disappear in 1~2 seconds.

Blood God:
-Change the meter totem (db3, which is useless) to an armor totem. Allow Kotal one hit of armor after activation to last until he's hit or give him Jason armor and when the totem is depleted, he's open for full combo, keeping him high risk, high reward.
-Blood Sacrifice takes 5-7% from Kotal in this variation instead of 10% OR allow this variation to meter burn the move and gain 5 hits with a damage buff instead of 3.

Sun God:
-Command grab levels do more damage (lvl 1 = 12%, lvl 2 = 16%, lvl 3 = 20%).
-Meter burned command grab is instant lvl 3
-I feel sun ray should do something different in this variation but I like it as is so I'll refrain from any changes on it just for the sake of changes. I mean it's "Sun God" but idk...

Now, there's way too much theory fighter going on in here. If you all think they are viable then please start winning your weeklies and eventual tourneys with these variations while I don't kid myself and stick with War God for that CEO money. I've messed with this character extensively in the lab AND in matches and in the end,
War God >> Blood God > Sun God

"But I labbed it up for an hour and they are good!!" Fuck out of here. Lol Good ole TYM.

 

[Mr Aquaman]

This can apply to any character not top tier. Lmao Come on now.

Besides War God (The definitive variation and dare I say a top 10 character), the other two need tweaks. I have ideas to make BG and SG better without breaking the character:

Universal:
-b2 pops up high enough for d1 to hit, allowing d1 xx AA grab to become an option. Make b2 more negative on block (-12).
-make normal parry 5 frame start up OR allow the buff to last until a hit is landed, not disappear in 1~2 seconds.

Blood God:
-Change the meter totem (db3, which is useless) to an armor totem. Allow Kotal one hit of armor after activation to last until he's hit or give him Jason armor and when the totem is depleted, he's open for full combo, keeping him high risk, high reward.
-Blood Sacrifice takes 5-7% from Kotal in this variation instead of 10% OR allow this variation to meter burn the move and gain 5 hits with a damage buff instead of 3.

Sun God:
-Command grab levels do more damage (lvl 1 = 12%, lvl 2 = 16%, lvl 3 = 20%).
-Meter burned command grab is instant lvl 3
-I feel sun ray should do something different in this variation but I like it as is so I'll refrain from any changes on it just for the sake of changes. I mean it's "Sun God" but idk...

Now, there's way too much theory fighter going on in here. If you all think they are viable then please start winning your weeklies and eventual tourneys with these variations while I don't kid myself and stick with War God for that CEO money. I've messed with this character extensively in the lab AND in matches and in the end,
War God >> Blood God > Sun God

"But I labbed it up for an hour and they are good!!" Fuck out of here. Lol Good ole TYM.

So since I am just a "labbed it up for an hour" guy

Tell me how many tournaments you have entered? And how many of the top players you have played? And grinded out with? And used all 3 variations? And tell me how much of the game you truly know, and show us how good you really are, Because if you don't show me, you are just another random.

Instead of crying for nerfs how about you do a simple thing when a game is 3 fucking weeks old and learn more.

jesus christ I am overdo for a blow up, you got lucky

 

[Mr Aquaman]

or should I pretend to be a TRUE KOTAL MAIN

"I NEED BETTER STUFF, I CANT WIN IN RANKED WITH 2 VARIATIONS BUT STILL CAN'T WIN WITH THE GOOD ONE............BUFFS PLS."

3 weeks into the game get the f out of here

all I have read is I don't want to try

 

[Crayraven]

All I want is for blood totem to be fixed.

 

[Mr Aquaman]

All I want is for blood totem to be fixed.

It certainly would be nice, getting the nice combo into it, spending the bar for a nice 32ish combo, seeing your opponent gain no meter (also known as armor in MKX), then after the combo, a dagger smacks you in the foot, and no health regen

sad clown face

 

[Crayraven]

It certainly would be nice, getting the nice combo into it, spending the bar for a nice 32ish combo, seeing your opponent gain no meter (also known as armor in MKX), then after the combo, a dagger smacks you in the foot, and no health regen

sad clown face

Definitely! I'm kind of wondering if blood totem disappearing when you get damaged is a bug as well. I can't understand why mechanically it works radically different from the other two totems.

Aside from it being bugged and being considered the weakest of the three variations. Its my favorite variation, because its so unique.