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General/Other - Kano Kano General Discussion Thread

Dukmunky

Arms Dealer, including all 4 of Goro's
Please go ahead and quote me saying that you can win with nothing but zoning and footsies. Obviously you have to space out your opponent, anti-air, trip guard, whiff punish, everything fundamental to winning a match. You can't win with any character just with zoning and footsies. But of course you think what you want because you believe you're right and are under the assumption that you are the Omega Kano, else you wouldn't be strolling around these forums acting like an ass discrediting people who, oh I don't know, actually do something in competition with him.

As for insinuating Rude and I are acting like authorities on the character and/or game stop being a hypocrite and look at how you're posting. I haven't seen you do anything with the character in competition either so if anything you have just as little reason to suggest we don't know what we're talking about. Even Coach Steve agrees with us and he's a much more successful Kano than you are as of yet so there is no reason to listen to you. I suggest you go and prove that you are a credible source of information for this character before dragging around unnecessary negativity.

Agreeing with Saltshaker is agreeing with us because he's making the same points Rude and I are so well done for clearly being biased to certain members of the community. As for agreeing with dribirut who is claiming the character could actually be "lower mid/low" tier, well...whatever you say lol.

Sorry he's not Freddy Krueger, if you want your precious zoner with 50/50 mixups go play Summoner Quan Chi. Meanwhile we'll be here making the most of our characters tools (which we know we probably lack in comparison to other characters in the game but can still win with) and providing healthy competitive discussion like good and bad matchups and why, tech, "mixups" and gameplans.
First- I sincerely support the idea that Kano, while he does have good tools, must not be left behind as updates buff all the characters around him, or else he will, without a doubt, end up in the bottom 3-5.

Ok so how about this for a middle ground where we can all post a little "no salt" sign on the floor and keep the ad hominem attacks and crying to a minimum:

Kano is a zoner and footsie character who only gets good meterless damage in the corner.

How about we agree most of his match-losing weaknesses would be resolved if he had one or both of the following:

1) a meterless bnb that does something around the 32-35% that Erron black/scorpion/even Ferra/Torr get so that when you do make those tough reads/mind games payoff they have the potential to create the health advantage necessary to put Kano in the drivers seat (without a huge meter disadvantage) until the opponent responds in kind.

2) a more advantageous hit box on balls or (OMG OP NERF NOW) make air ball overhead when used in sweep range for a somewhat viable knockdown OH option when you play the footsie/mind game strategy perfectly. A jump back OH threat creates that situation for zoning and the diet rushdown cutthroat variation.

There. Is that an agreeable enough wish list, which avoids the pitfalls of wishing for the easy fix of converting Kano to rushdown? Does it sufficiently acknowledge Kano's footsie/space control/mind game character design? I think so. Then again, I'm just another noob who lounges around in his limited edition Kano undies.
 

HuttonMD

ADM Riddles
If any of you guys are on xbone feel free to add my I'd like to play against some more Kano's and have some feedback on making my gameplay with kano stronger my gt is xXxR1ddleMeTh1s
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
First- I sincerely support the idea that Kano, while he does have good tools, must not be left behind as updates buff all the characters around him, or else he will, without a doubt, end up in the bottom 3-5.

Ok so how about this for a middle ground where we can all post a little "no salt" sign on the floor and keep the ad hominem attacks and crying to a minimum:

Kano is a zoner and footsie character who only gets good meterless damage in the corner.

How about we agree most of his match-losing weaknesses would be resolved if he had one or both of the following:

1) a meterless bnb that does something around the 32-35% that Erron black/scorpion/even Ferra/Torr get so that when you do make those tough reads/mind games payoff they have the potential to create the health advantage necessary to put Kano in the drivers seat (without a huge meter disadvantage) until the opponent responds in kind.

2) a more advantageous hit box on balls or (OMG OP NERF NOW) make air ball overhead when used in sweep range for a somewhat viable knockdown OH option when you play the footsie/mind game strategy perfectly. A jump back OH threat creates that situation for zoning and the diet rushdown cutthroat variation.

There. Is that an agreeable enough wish list, which avoids the pitfalls of wishing for the easy fix of converting Kano to rushdown? Does it sufficiently acknowledge Kano's footsie/space control/mind game character design? I think so. Then again, I'm just another noob who lounges around in his limited edition Kano undies.
If his bnbs were all 35% meterless, meaning something like 40+% every time with 1 bar, then he'd pretty much always have breaker because of the meter build form throwing so many knives. He doesn't need a damage boost, he has the tools to deal with most of the cast just fine.

I don't see the problem with Up Ball and Kano Ball, I mean maybe a few less startup frames on Kano Ball would be nice but Up Ball is fine in my opinion. He also doesn't need an overhead, that's not the solve all problems answer despite popular opinion.

Cybernetic Kano is balanced, if we give him something like a damage boost and an overhead, which would give him great zoning, great damage and 50/50 mixups he's just going to get nerfed which we don't need. Therefore he's best left the way he is, but if he gets buffed that'd be good.
 

FlappyDaniel

Snappin' spines all day e'ry day.
My commando pressure will become beyond disgusting if I get 2F4 ending in an overhead, then again that second hit is definitely slow enough to react to.
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
It's a high, then a mid. They should make the f4 an overhead. That's all I want. No damage buff, nothing crazy. Just f4 as an overhead.
So? It'll only whiff if they neutral duck and who neutral ducks the Lord of Lows, Kano? F4 being an overhead is useless because as FlappyDaniel says it's reactable. 2F4 is more of a whiff punishing string or combo ender I reckon.

Cybernetic Kano does not need an overhead.
 

Dukmunky

Arms Dealer, including all 4 of Goro's
If his bnbs were all 35% meterless, meaning something like 40+% every time with 1 bar, then he'd pretty much always have breaker because of the meter build form throwing so many knives. He doesn't need a damage boost, he has the tools to deal with most of the cast just fine.

I don't see the problem with Up Ball and Kano Ball, I mean maybe a few less startup frames on Kano Ball would be nice but Up Ball is fine in my opinion. He also doesn't need an overhead, that's not the solve all problems answer despite popular opinion.

Cybernetic Kano is balanced, if we give him something like a damage boost and an overhead, which would give him great zoning, great damage and 50/50 mixups he's just going to get nerfed which we don't need. Therefore he's best left the way he is, but if he gets buffed that'd be good.
Recommending an overhead hit on Kano ball isn't the same as reccommending an overhead starter
 
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Hitoshura

Head Cage
Cybernetic Kano does not need an overhead.
In time you'll see Cybernetic become less and less viable. Just wait. When it happens the amount of grimaces in the Kano community will increase while I'll dawn a shit eating grin and laugh. I could be wrong though. No one is ever 100% right.
 

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
In time you'll see Cybernetic become less and less viable. Just wait. When it happens the amount of grimaces in the Kano community will increase while I'll dawn a shit eating grin and laugh. I could be wrong though. No one is ever 100% right.
Less viable based on what? I've made arguments as to why we need a few small things to hold positioning, but none of those things are an OH. Cyber will be fine without that if he can get buffs to a couple of normals like B2 start up speed, and Ball Special priority.
 

Dukmunky

Arms Dealer, including all 4 of Goro's
I didn't say overhead starter, so what's your point?
Well, that's what the whol
Less viable based on what? I've made arguments as to why we need a few small things to hold positioning, but none of those things are an OH. Cyber will be fine without that if he can get buffs to a couple of normals like B2 start up speed, and Ball Special priority.
agreed. It's cutthroat and commanded that might need other types of improvements, But hopefully the ball priority
 

Hitoshura

Head Cage
Less viable based on what? I've made arguments as to why we need a few small things to hold positioning, but none of those things are an OH. Cyber will be fine without that if he can get buffs to a couple of normals like B2 start up speed, and Ball Special priority.
Based on the fact that this game will evolve around certain characters. Things will be found that will alter the meta to make it even more one sided while Kano will stay primarily the same, or at least Cybernetic. It happened with a majority of the cast in MK9 and it will happen again in MKX. Just watch; there's only going to be 5-8 viable characters in a years time.
 

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
Based on the fact that this game will evolve around certain characters. Things will be found that will alter the meta to make it even more one sided while Kano will stay primarily the same, or at least Cybernetic. It happened with a majority of the cast in MK9 and it will happen again in MKX. Just watch; there's only going to be 5-8 viable characters in a years time.
Unless patches do help adjust the gameplay and balance as they release, honestly you'll probably be right.
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
Costume choice update:

As much of a tjcombowins kind of thing as this is I just want to update the scores.

We have
Kano > Revolution > MK1 > Tournament
MK1 > Tournament > Kano > Revolution
MK1 > Kano > Revolution > Tournament
Revolution > Kano = MK1 > Tournament
Revolution > MK1 > Kano > Tournament
Revolution > MK1 = Tournament > Kano
Revolution > Primary = Tournament > MK1
Default (alt color) > MK1 > Revolution (alt) >Tournament
Kano > MK1 > Revolution > Tournament
Tournament > MK1 > Kano/Revolution
Kano > MK1 > Revolution > Tournament
Revolution > Kano > mk1 > tournament

Points: 1st = 5, 2nd = 4, 3rd = 2 and 4th = 1 (so that any joint 2nds are allocated 3 points each)

MK1 = 41
Kano = 40.5
Revolution = 39.5
Tournament = 23

Goddamn we really hate tournament lol. And I was hearing good things about it on day 1 when people talked about him, guess they were wrong :p
 
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Dukmunky

Arms Dealer, including all 4 of Goro's
Costume choice update:

As much of a tjcombowins kind of thing as this is I just want to update the scores.

We have
Kano > Revolution > MK1 > Tournament
MK1 > Tournament > Kano > Revolution
MK1 > Kano > Revolution > Tournament
Revolution > Kano = MK1 > Tournament
Revolution > MK1 > Kano > Tournament
Revolution > MK1 = Tournament > Kano
Revolution > Primary = Tournament > MK1
Default (alt color) > MK1 > Revolution (alt) >Tournament
Kano > MK1 > Revolution > Tournament
Tournament > MK1 > Kano/Revolution

Points: 1st = 5, 2nd = 4, 3rd = 2 and 4th = 1 (so that any joint 2nds are allocated 3 points each)

MK1 = 35
Revolution = 32.5
Kano = 31.5
Tournament = 21

Goddamn we really hate tournament lol. And I was hearing good things about it on day 1 when people talked about him, guess they were wrong :p
Revolution>Kano>mk1>tournament
 

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
Costume choice update:

As much of a tjcombowins kind of thing as this is I just want to update the scores.

We have
Kano > Revolution > MK1 > Tournament
MK1 > Tournament > Kano > Revolution
MK1 > Kano > Revolution > Tournament
Revolution > Kano = MK1 > Tournament
Revolution > MK1 > Kano > Tournament
Revolution > MK1 = Tournament > Kano
Revolution > Primary = Tournament > MK1
Default (alt color) > MK1 > Revolution (alt) >Tournament
Kano > MK1 > Revolution > Tournament
Tournament > MK1 > Kano/Revolution

Points: 1st = 5, 2nd = 4, 3rd = 2 and 4th = 1 (so that any joint 2nds are allocated 3 points each)

MK1 = 35
Revolution = 32.5
Kano = 31.5
Tournament = 21

Goddamn we really hate tournament lol. And I was hearing good things about it on day 1 when people talked about him, guess they were wrong :p
The other outfits can go either way, and I see the appeal in all of them. But Tournament? Man that one has to go lol.