What's new

Match-up Discussion Johnny Cage: Official Matchup Discussion

Dizzy

False Information Police Officer
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
We will have to agree to disagree, for now at least.

Also, I think 11F1 against a crouch blocking Ermac is not very solid strategy. If he decides to let go of block it will whiff almost every time and he can do whatever he wants during your recovery.
 

A F0xy Grampa

Problem X Promotions
Dizzy I'm still having a hard time believing Ermac beats JC. Ermac's ability to keep out JC isn't as good as the other bad match ups I've listed. JC does more damage when he's up close than ermac when he's afar. Not to mention ermac is arguably more vulnerable to JC's pressure than most of the cast. Yes you can't do F33 ex force ball, but you can do 13 ex force ball and 11F1. You can do 11F1 on a crouch blocking ermac. He also doesn't have any armor. In the corner, ermac is just like any other character in the game, although probably easier because you have that 11F1. Also, just a random shadow kick is enough for ermac to respect it, even if it puts JC at a bad position. It's really fast and will punish TKP so long as he's not at max range. Yeah, the position shadow kick gives isn't ideal, but I can dash in while ermac's waking up and I'm pushing him into the corner. And again, ermac is not as good as others when it comes to keeping JC out.
Gonna have to agree with Dizzy, Ermac beats Cage, he doesnt just sit there and TKP the whole match, the fact that JC HAS to respect it makes it hard, it opens up opportunities for Ermac to advance, get some chip/throws etc and get out again, he's superior in the footsie game anyway, punishes alot harder than Cage.

Throws wont be that difficult for Ermac to get, which gives him the advantage.

you cant sit there and do 11F1 all day because for some reason if you hit Ermac with 11 and you go for another 11 he can lift you in between because of the way it moves your hitbox.

There are no forceball traps in the corner against Ermac at all.

Midscreen I would want the JC player to try shadow kicking if I played Ermac, thats just a death sentence and pushes him back to the other side of the screen again.

He has armour on his X-Ray too, doesnt sound spectacular but believe me its a game changer.

Maybe metzos13 has something to add
 
A F0xy Grampa compare 11f1 on ermac to whatever it is ermac can do against jc. Almost every string he does has holes whereas only JC's 11f1 has holes. Ermac's pressure and throw option is inferior to JC's; if he's coming to me then that's what I want, not to mention JC is one of the hardest characters in the game to approach on. Abusing 11f1 is a bad idea, but it's something to throw out. And there are force ball traps in the corner, go and find strings that will work. In fact, in the JC info thread I posted that it's possible to do F33B3 ex fb. This means Ermac is more vulnerable in the corner, meaning JC punishg TKP with shadow kick is not a bad idea. Little bit of chip in exchange for 8% and wall carry. I've also posted in the ermac MU thread and metzos is reconsidering the MU.
 

Metzos

You will BOW to me!
As of today the JC vs Ermac MU is 5-5. Ermac is clearly superior against JC in fullscreen and midscreen but that doesnt say anything. JC will eventually get in with enough patience. And when he does there are very little things Ermac can do to get him off him. 13 EX fb is OP. A question to all JC players i would like to have answered plz. Is JC's F3 bugged ? If not i am 100% positive that it is not at 0f on block. If there is a post somewhere about this i would really appreciate it if you guys could give me a link.

EDIT: I think i found a way to beat JC's F3 spam pressure with D3. I still need to test it more though.
 
As of today the JC vs Ermac MU is 5-5. Ermac is clearly superior against JC in fullscreen and midscreen but that doesnt say anything. JC will eventually get in with enough patience. And when he does there are very little things Ermac can do to get him off him. 13 EX fb is OP. A question to all JC players i would like to have answered plz. Is JC's F3 bugged ? If not i am 100% positive that it is not at 0f on block. If there is a post somewhere about this i would really appreciate it if you guys could give me a link.
F3 will give +9 advantage on crouch block randomly. It's detailed more here:

http://testyourmight.com/threads/cage-info-for-cage-players.12666/page-2
 
So, bad matchups everyone seems to agree with: Kabal, Kitana, Kenshi, Reptile, Sub-Zero, Noob
Possibly bad matchups: Sonya, Skarlet, Freddy

Marvaz, can you post your matchup thoughts?
I also noticed that TsungSupreme and DetroitBalln313 have the Shang-Cage matchup 6-4 in Shang's favor. I have no real experience with this so I can't comment on it.
 

A F0xy Grampa

Problem X Promotions
A F0xy Grampa compare 11f1 on ermac to whatever it is ermac can do against jc. Almost every string he does has holes whereas only JC's 11f1 has holes. Ermac's pressure and throw option is inferior to JC's; if he's coming to me then that's what I want, not to mention JC is one of the hardest characters in the game to approach on. Abusing 11f1 is a bad idea, but it's something to throw out. And there are force ball traps in the corner, go and find strings that will work. In fact, in the JC info thread I posted that it's possible to do F33B3 ex fb. This means Ermac is more vulnerable in the corner, meaning JC punishg TKP with shadow kick is not a bad idea. Little bit of chip in exchange for 8% and wall carry. I've also posted in the ermac MU thread and metzos is reconsidering the MU.
Abusing 11F1 is definitely not a bad idea, everybody stand blocks against Cage, despite fuzzying low, you just gotta end strings and start new ones/pokes when they're standing.

Nobody is actually crouch blocking him
 
Abusing 11F1 is definitely not a bad idea, everybody stand blocks against Cage, despite fuzzying low, you just gotta end strings and start new ones/pokes when they're standing.

Nobody is actually crouch blocking him
Restating your argument and agreeing to disagree would have been the way to go. I'm disappointed you felt it necessary to reply in a condescending tone.
 

TrickyNick

Weather Man
What about the baraka matchup i don't feel its 7-3 cage favor at all. Maybe 6-4 or even 5.5-4.5. I understand that once cage gets in barake has trouble but no more then the rest of the cast. With making his d-1 faster, the blade charge going full screen, his d-4, and his get off me spin. I feel like while approaching him im always nervous of the blade charge. On block at least i can flash kick him but still makes me nervous.
 

A F0xy Grampa

Problem X Promotions
What about the baraka matchup i don't feel its 7-3 cage favor at all. Maybe 6-4 or even 5.5-4.5. I understand that once cage gets in barake has trouble but no more then the rest of the cast. With making his d-1 faster, the blade charge going full screen, his d-4, and his get off me spin. I feel like while approaching him im always nervous of the blade charge. On block at least i can flash kick him but still makes me nervous.
Gonna go with 6 - 4, only because theres not much Cage can do against Barakas footsie game, but Baraka cant do much against Cages rushdown. Obviously he can shadowkick the blade charge but it just puts it straight back to footsies.

Damage from Cages rushdown > Barakas footsies/Space of the arena
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
The chart on the first page is out of date. I think most JC players agree it's 6-4 right now in Reptile's favor.
Ah, I see. Yeah, that's what I'd imagine it is, tbh.
 

A F0xy Grampa

Problem X Promotions
I for some reason thought the B+3 has enough range...

This is the kind of shit I hate being stuck to online play, I don't know very specific things because every other match I fight the same characters.
Forgot about the B3, not sure gonna have to have a look, I'm so used to F3ing everything
 

Durango

Enhancer
At the very best, Kung Lao vs. Johnny Cage is 60-40; at worst, 70-30.

Spin escapes the frame trap, fireballs aren't recommended, and Cage's only draws are his EX Shadow Kick and his fast uppercut to punish the teleport. Beyond that, I don't know what else to do.
 
At the very best, Kung Lao vs. Johnny Cage is 60-40; at worst, 70-30.

Spin escapes the frame trap, fireballs aren't recommended, and Cage's only draws are his EX Shadow Kick and his fast uppercut to punish the teleport. Beyond that, I don't know what else to do.
I think Cage-KL is even, maybe slightly in Cage's favor. Cage's dash B3 can punish teleport. KL really can't keep Cage out with hats, he'll get in eventually. Up close, as long as Cage is at frame advantage, KL can't do much. You can bait the spins, and punish them hard with a B3. F3 can stuff just about everything else.