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Match-up Discussion Johnny Cage: Official Matchup Discussion

Mikemetroid

Who hired this guy, WTF?
Dude I don't know if you are trolling or what but you obviously know I wasn't saying not to be emo over a personal matter. If that's true i'm really sorry for your loss man. If you need to talk, i'm here.
Not trolling, but thanks. Lets just talk MU.

I honestly think that Skarlet might be developed into an Anti Cage.
 
Isn't Mileena vs Cage 7-3 Cage? For any good Cage it's a slaughtering imo and she has to flawlessly zone him out and sai like a boss to win. She has nothing to get him off.
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
I was always unsure about the LK MU. MITDJT do you think Cage beats Kang or is it even?
its a 5-5 me and my bro play it alot we both know cage and liu. But most players don't play high footsies based kangs like my bro. it's 5-5 I think (kang could possibly win it 6-4). cage has to watch b312 and 213 the whole fight. his zoning is good players still downplay it. but zoning and footsies is how kang wins it. kang can even go on the offensive stop at the b31 seems to have random adv sometimes i dont know why seems like it. i need to test that. if cage gets in its bad for liu. but that is for all matchups if cage gets in its bad. Cage ermac i think is 6-4. Once cage is in, ermac has no safe way of getting out. any of mac's pokes blocked equals automatic f3 punish. iagb with mac isn't really that effective in this match imo. I think kit cage is a VERY manageable 6-4. kit has to keep him away. its very manageable like cyrax kitana. dont let cage block those d1 or f3 punish. d1 cutter can be interuppted before it comes out completely if you do it fast enough. i only pulled it off once when I played bit at dallas. Cage has a scare factor when he is pressuring anybody i think. Cage has the best pressure in my opinion. it's scarier then kabal pressure. Cage really puts you in a cage when he pressures. if the cage knows how you want to get out its dangerous. dont throw out armor at the wrong time and dont poke out at the wrong time. getting out of cage pressure is like reaction thing. You have to react to get out of cage pressure. Just like sub zero vs cage is a very manageable match for cage. it's 6-4 sub but if cage gets in or gets the lead he can lame sub out and win. cage can win any match because of his pressure. He loses to kabal but if he gets in kabal has to be very careful when armor is thrown out or your fucked. cage also has exnutpunch that beats out alot of moves and some armor moves too if timed right. In the right hands like dizzy curbo foxy for example cage can win any match. lol i keep repating that. JOHNNY CAGE!!! Cage vs rep is 6-4 imo. I play one of the best reptiles alot and reptile zoning is alright but cage just has to block it and slowly push rep to the corner. Reptile has nothing safe to really get to the other side. exdash can be punished with a poke, exnutpunch, or full combo if you have a fast enough normal to do like lao. lol this is too much it was only supposed to be liu aha.
 

xInfra Deadx

Gimmick stolen by Jordan Peele
Freddy- 4/6
Kung Lao- 6/4
Sektor- 5/5
I agree on the Freddy matchup, but why do you think Kung Lao is at disadvantage?

Cage/Sektor feels 4-6. Even with the tools Sektor has, I still believe Cage is eventually getting in. 6 frame jab only does so much for Sektor when Cage is properly spaced within pressure strings (1,(1)and 1,(2) whiff from 1's max distance) plus Sektor has no good wakeup attacks and no armored specials to speak of. It's more annoying for Sektor than it is Cage.
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
i agree with 6-4 cage beating mileena. i feel that cage does demolish scorp 7-3. it is extremely hard for scorp to keep him out the entire fight. cage does rape jax 7-3 completely agreeable to me. jax does have armor but he doesn't want to waste too much meter vs cage. f4 can be punished everytime with a full combo. that is jax best string lol. jax not using a lot f4 is bad for jax. cage vs rax is 5-5 imo. rax has all the tools and footsies to keep cage out and can even get offense going with d4 +16 and command grab mixups at times. if cage gets in he can abuse rax hitbox pretty good. its a tossup for me could be 6-4 rax also. I think 5-5 is most agreeable for me. cage shang seems more of a 5-5 to me. shang does have decent zoning and can go on the offense too. he can keep cage out. If the shang knows cage he gets a buffed up cage aha. I think there is no way.I did say cage vs mac was 6-4 but i think it is 7-3 cage. I think cage rapes mac so bad. mac just can't keep cage out for long i think. its hard for mac. all it takes is cage getting in one time and its basically good games. poking out with ermac isn't that safe. if they are blocked most of his pokes can be punished bad on block. iagb just doesnt mean much in this match imo. I feel like ermac does no better than scorp in that match. mac is fucked vs cage imo.
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
yeah cage beats raiden 6-4 reasonable to me. cage vs freddy i think freddy does have the slight advantage. 6-4 yeah kenshi is an extremely bad mu for cage. has to get in cant lame out kenshi with cage aha. i think cage beats smoke 6-4 possibly 5-5 doesn't seem like it is that bad for smoke. smoke does have damage good d4,d1,d3. b2 is good footsie tool to use in footsies. if you keep getting hit by d4 you will keep taking like 8% it will add up. that is when b2 comes into play. grabs help too. I think it is better for smoke then mac. mac doesn't have good pokes like smoke so I think it is better for smoke. smoke gets more damage for a punish. jk air grab is a good tool for smoke when he has to jump. his hitbox is big but he can keep his hitbox away from cage better than mac imo. I think I said it already but i'm say it again i agree with the cage sub being 6-4 sub.
 
Baraka- 6/4 5/5 after playing TheTetraSpirit Peckapowa and STB Shujinkydink. Adv to Cage (aka .5 but fuck .5s)
Cyber Sub-Zero- 6/4 5/5 Parry and good use of dive kicks. See Dizzy vs UsedForGlue
Cyrax- 5/5
Ermac- 5/5
Freddy- 4/6
Jade- 6/4
Jax- 7/3 6/4 You're trying to tell me that Jax with all of his armors, damage, and safe strings is as easy as a win like it is against Kano?
Kabal- 3/7 6/4 3/7 on Rooftop Day. It's how a player can get used to Kabal's rhythm then the sudden pressure game that he can do.
Kano- 7/3
Kenshi- 2/8
Kitana- 5/5 (16 bit and Khaotic both think Kitana wins. Maybe they are right.)
Kung Lao- 6/4
Liu Kang- 5/5
Mileena- 6/4
Nightwolf- 7/3
Noob- 6/4
Quan- 7/3
Raiden- 6/4
Rain- 6/4
Reptile- 6/4 5/5 Low Hitbox and Decent zoning can keep Cage on his toes. He also has armor.
Scorpion- 6/4
Sektor- 5/5
Shang- 6/4 (Another one I could use input on, not enough experience.) 5/5 Shang's zoning is tricky to get past, but upclose his armor and slow moves is what can hurt him. He also has a decent pressure game, which you will have to use meter or a fast normal to get out of.
Sheeva- 8/2
Sindel- 6/4
Skarlet- 6/4 5/5 Skarlet's zoning is pretty damn good against Cage. She also has really great armor to use against his Pressure.
Smoke- 6/4
Sonya- 5/5
Stryker- 6/4
Sub-Zero- 4/6

If my input means anything.
this is a really solid matchup chart, i think i have a few disagreements or potential qualms, but they are all debatable, i think jax can still effectively use gps and gp cancels, and his projectile too really fuck cage up.

i think freddy very well could be 3-7, i dont see why not, i personally smoke can be hard to catch, give him amazing zoning, all nms moves are only like -3 on block, this character should be able to outspace cage run away and take advantage of his zoning to grant grabs and safe pressure...
i think raiden is potentially even, but ill give you the 6-4
i think he might lose to sonya ( military stance 2 is hard to deal with, the fact that in order to punish ex cartwheel you have to njp is very risky, however f3 kind of hurts her gameplan a lot and yeah you can just block ex cartwheels)
i think kung lao is even-ill play any cage in this matchup even though i dont main lao and i think i can make you guys change your minds. kung lao can really space cage effectively and run away. people take too many risks
i think noob could be even- dont whiff upknee.
jade has really really good spacing against cage, i think shes underrated and i think shes being slept on
i think skarlet could be 4-6...her zoning is a bitch to deal with, her pressure is amazing, ill stck with 5-5 for now though
i think reptile could be 4-6 also.... reptile has such good spacing in this matchup, safe pressure, amazing zoning that grants him safe pressure, ill stick with 5-5 because cage's pressure is a bitch for reptile especially if he reads dashs and can deal with ex dash.... also f3 can blow up d4s if u anticipate it and b3 can whiff punish them well.
kabal and kenshi could both be 2-8's... but i think theoretically kenshi should never lose, if u guess right vs kabal you can blow him up... but still theoretically you shouldnt be winning either, i consider myself good at both of these matchups. flash parry is ridiculous
i think scorpion could be 7-3, sometimes i mash out pokes if i think they are going to counter-poke and it works really well in this matchup, scorpion.... i think scorpion is underrated due to to his counter-zoning abilities, armor, and really good upclose mixup game which he can choose to make safe or take risks, but against a rushdown like cages its tough, then again scorp can do things like ex spear after a blocked takedown.

this makes cage more mid-tier....hes a wildcard though because of his ability to get in and stay in and a lot of his tools are amazing i dont want to down play one of my mains too much.. i just think spacing is so important.
 

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
I think skarlet cage is 5-5. I can't prove it or say anything more but I think skarlet can build meter fairly well and end combos with f43 to push him mid screen. It is hard to get out but her armor dash to slide works well around frame traps.
 
i agree with 6-4 cage beating mileena. i feel that cage does demolish scorp 7-3. it is extremely hard for scorp to keep him out the entire fight. cage does rape jax 7-3 completely agreeable to me. jax does have armor but he doesn't want to waste too much meter vs cage. f4 can be punished everytime with a full combo. that is jax best string lol. jax not using a lot f4 is bad for jax. cage vs rax is 5-5 imo. rax has all the tools and footsies to keep cage out and can even get offense going with d4 +16 and command grab mixups at times. if cage gets in he can abuse rax hitbox pretty good. its a tossup for me could be 6-4 rax also. I think 5-5 is most agreeable for me. cage shang seems more of a 5-5 to me. shang does have decent zoning and can go on the offense too. he can keep cage out. If the shang knows cage he gets a buffed up cage aha. I think there is no way.I did say cage vs mac was 6-4 but i think it is 7-3 cage. I think cage rapes mac so bad. mac just can't keep cage out for long i think. its hard for mac. all it takes is cage getting in one time and its basically good games. poking out with ermac isn't that safe. if they are blocked most of his pokes can be punished bad on block. iagb just doesnt mean much in this match imo. I feel like ermac does no better than scorp in that match. mac is fucked vs cage imo.
these are all great ponts, i think jaxes zoning is a bit underrated in the matchup though, i realize cage has a lot of ways to blow up gp cancels

i really agree about cyrax, i think cage is forced to go in verse cyrax meaning cyrax can footsie with him decently and can whiff punish him effectively and his rushdown is also really really good and a full combo is death, but i think cyrax has a 9 frame d3, meaning he needs to d1 out of pressure, meaning i can full punish him for this, and cyrax's doesnt have an armored move thats going to damage me.

maybe i should use redkick more, i mean im going to build a ton of meter o nce i get in anyways right? but i tend not too
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
Sonya does seem like he has a hard time with sonya. My bro just recently picked up sonya and it can be hard with that d4 safe armor fast normals military stance fast uppercut. fast projectile. all good things vs cage. if cage gets in he can stay in good. he can punish ex cartwheel with exnutpunch in the middle of pressure i've only seen dizzy do this with that gdlk johnny. 5-5 does seem most agreeable for me. cage vs lao does seem 5-5. cage wins if he gets in lao wins if cage is out. its a footsie game with lao vs cage.
 
Kang has great zoning and awesome normals, things that makes Cage irritated.
Kang also has shitty wakeups and a bigger hitbox, things that makes Cage happy.

i also think kang has fantastic rushdown and im getting better and better at it... fuck cage is a bitch to get off my d3 betrays me half the time, but in every other aspect, i win.
 
Sonya does seem like he has a hard time with sonya. My bro just recently picked up sonya and it can be hard with that d4 safe armor fast normals military stance fast uppercut. fast projectile. all good things vs cage. if cage gets in he can stay in good. he can punish ex cartwheel with exnutpunch in the middle of pressure i've only seen dizzy do this with that gdlk johnny. 5-5 does seem most agreeable for me. cage vs lao does seem 5-5. cage wins if he gets in lao wins if cage is out. its a footsie game with lao vs cage.
does he ex nutpunch on reaction? i usually just neutral jump punch, but i could see situations where ex nutpunch could be an amazing tool. i also think military stance 2 for sonya is actually really good.
 

Mikemetroid

Who hired this guy, WTF?
does he ex nutpunch on reaction? i usually just neutral jump punch, but i could see situations where ex nutpunch could be an amazing tool. i also think military stance 2 for sonya is actually really good.
I can ex nutpunch a 6 frame jab on reaction...

kappa ;)
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
these are all great ponts, i think jaxes zoning is a bit underrated in the matchup though, i realize cage has a lot of ways to blow up gp cancels

i really agree about cyrax, i think cage is forced to go in verse cyrax meaning cyrax can footsie with him decently and can whiff punish him effectively and his rushdown is also really really good and a full combo is death, but i think cyrax has a 9 frame d3, meaning he needs to d1 out of pressure, meaning i can full punish him for this, and cyrax's doesnt have an armored move thats going to damage me.

maybe i should use redkick more, i mean im going to build a ton of meter o nce i get in anyways right? but i tend not too
yes rax does have to use d1 to get out. but if he does use d1 its d1+exragdoll it is not interuptible best option for rax to get out. red kick should be used to get the finish vs cyrax imo. wasting any meter vs rax is just not the best idea unless you are in. cant make any mistakes. it def a 5-5 imo after playing lots of matches with diff cages and my bro. its 5-5 for me.
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
does he ex nutpunch on reaction? i usually just neutral jump punch, but i could see situations where ex nutpunch could be an amazing tool. i also think military stance 2 for sonya is actually really good.
like in the middle of cage pressure vs sonya dizzy did it vs riu48. go watch riu 48 vs dizzy at mlg arena for anaheim dizzy did it multiple times it was gdlk.
 

STB Shujinkydink

Burning down in flames for kicks
6-4 for baraka seems right. I do agree the .5 cuz of the 7 frame spin that knocks him full screen, but then barakas zoning is kinda sub par lol

I believe we decided 6-4 for cage for quan. unless im missing something. Insuperable?