Question If Kabal was nerfed, do you think the game would be less scrubby?

[TargetAudience]

Forget broken ass kabal.... nerf retarded ass safe stupid blk strings with massive chip damage, mix ups safe launchers, d1catwells, safe on block super armor dumb ass hitbox and insane range on her normals and stupid upppercut sonnya.etc etc

etc

 

[KH StarCharger]

my changes to kabal:
more cool down on iagbs
hit boxes of buzz saw and nomad dash are no longer active behind him
enhanced nomad dash can only absorb one hit and can no longer be canceled. (no more flash parry)
projectile glitches fixed


Problem solved. But that's just me so take it with a grain of salt. And hopefully that's as far as I'll go when it comes to listing the things I would fix if I was tampering with the game's inner workings because I'll have to make my own thread to list them all lol.

 

[Gesture Required Ahead]

How about making community rules where only mid-tier characters are allowed?

 

[Axel_Redd]

he needs his iagbs since his ground gb's are shit...

 

[quandaghost]

Ban Smoke.

Fool

 

[YOMI DJT]

You only talking about top players that have natural skill/understanding of a fighting game who also have the amount of time to geek as fuck on mk9 with other players offline. What about the others ? They stfu ? Ok, good argument..

Yes we casual players with no brother to practice can ask to get some advise against kabal, but it still doesn't make a fair/balanced game.

What I believe is that Dizzy would have win MLG if he would have main Kabal since the very beginning

yeah complainers can stfu. I don't care if you state your opinion on what should be changed nerfed buffed etc. Yes Kabal is a messed up char, kenshi is messed up if your not like kl. Then again there will always be complainers I just dont really care. I like the game there is some unbalanced things but i still like it. Everybody has their reasons. Maybe i'm just being too mean about other players in general. Everybody has their reasons of playing mk. I play to have fun and win. others it might just be casuals. hmm if dizzy was a kabal from the beginning he would win mlg possibly? what if all the top players were kabals in the beginning? Would that be fun to watch? top 8 all kabals? I think there is still stuff that could possibly be discovered in this game. It's all opinion tho. There is no fact that the game is balanced or unbalanced. Me I think the game is fine and will continue to have fun in mk. others will continue to complain and get characters like jade nerfed lmao!!

 

[YOMI DJT]

I think it's a mind thing. I think if every mk player had a kabal to fight almost everyday there would be no complaints because most ppl would know kabal from experience

 

[PPJ]

I would buff everyone in this game including Kabal. I'd increase his X-ray damage to 35%, make it safer on block (-10) and reduce the scaling when used in combos a bit. I'd also change his 11b43 string to be +1 on block.

 

[Illmatix]

i kinda hate when people say kunglao needs to be nerfed, after he got hit with the nerf bat so hard in the fuckin grill. i picked him up to cover ermacs bad matchups and to use him properly you have to use a great deal of concentration and possess substantial skill. you see i didnt realize how good pig, reo, and perfect legend were till i tried picking up kenshi kabal and kung lao. trust me its not as easy as it looks.

 

[GLoRToR]

He just needs Dash to not be cancellable anymore and all the bullshit like resets and other glitchy shit / infinites / unblockables / removed.

 

[THTB]

i kinda hate when people say kunglao needs to be nerfed, after he got hit with the nerf bat so hard in the fuckin grill. i picked him up to cover ermacs bad matchups and to use him properly you have to use a great deal of concentration and possess substantial skill. you see i didnt realize how good pig, reo, and perfect legend were till i tried picking up kenshi kabal and kung lao. trust me its not as easy as it looks.

Kung Lao got better.

 

[Illmatix]

Kung Lao got better.

because his pressure can actually be poked now, and a safe overhead?
i would say he was better before but hes not scrubby trash now and you have to master his combos to do damage.

 

[THTB]

He just needs Dash to not be cancellable anymore and all the bullshit like resets and other glitchy shit / infinites / unblockables / removed.

Dash not being cancellable = Kabal might as well not have it, and pretty much removes an actually interesting aspect about him.

You don't need to neuter him to make him more fair. If people are capable of playing vs Kabal in his current state, there's really not much to tweak on him other than slight things. 16 Bit said it some time ago, a few things here and there, and this game is good.

Also, on the subject of broken characters, has anyone noticed that Kenshi is basically designed around how the game was at launch? As are Skarlet, Freddy and Rain?

Illmatix Kung Lao's only big, big nerf is spin's pushback being nerfed and his damage. Once people would've eventually learned the drawbacks of low hat pre-patch, it wouldn't have been nearly as big a deal as people make it out to be. 24 low hat/1+2 mixup wasn't even that good. 1+2 is blocked on reaction, so people didn't have a reason to stand block him outside of that and f2, which was also unsafe. Low hat was -7 on block. 21212 xx low hat was actually combo punishable because you could jump before low hat ever came out, and just letting 21212 rock was pointless because there was no reward for it, and the risk was stupid high. Eventually, people would've figured out that it wasn't as great as it was cracked up to be because no one would really care to stand block him. People still don't really care to, but he doesn't get raped for making you want to either. Spin's pushback was huge simply because it gave him basically a poke on some characters, but most of those particular characters don't really possess the type of offense that would make him want to spin them often in the first place anyway. The damage nerf was something that was guaranteed to hit him, and everyone took hits there, actually. Not to mention, with how the game is played now, and the above fact on 21212 xx low hat, X-Ray would've ended up used as much as it is now.

The character was never that easy to begin with, and was never really nerfed. The aspects they weakened weren't aspects that would be big factors now. Kung Lao is top tier because he's one of the few characters that completely says fuck all to a ground game. His mobility ends up making footsies nearly impossible to play, and for a number of characters, this ruins pretty much anything they want to do. This part of Kung Lao was NEVER touched, and is why he remains so good.

 

[Rathalos]

He just needs Dash to not be cancellable anymore and all the bullshit like resets and other glitchy shit / infinites / unblockables / removed.

In all seriousness, just making it so you can't cancel his dash anymore would be the absolute worst way to nerf him.

Yes it would "fix" him, but its the easy way out and would ruin the character.

Don't get me wrong, he would still be a good character, but he would be a soulless shell of his former self.
It would further dumb down the game and suck all the fun out of Kabal. His dash cancels are a unique mechanic that help him stand out compared to the rest of the cast.

 

[GLoRToR]

In all seriousness, just making it so you can't cancel his dash anymore would be the absolute worst way to nerf him.

Yes it would "fix" him, but its the easy way out and would ruin the character.

Don't get me wrong, he would still be a good character,

I don't make the calls about the game but my point of view on patching and development is that overpowered moves need some sort of weakness to them or it's Kabal.

 

[TheTetraSpirit]

I don't make the calls about the game but my point of view on patching and development is that overpowered moves need some sort of weakness to them or it's Kabal.

You have to understand though, the character still needs to be usable.
Sure, he can still make a lot of characters work a bit to get in, but without the threat of ND fake-outs and pressure once they do, what does he have?
He'd be totally crippled, which is why he should keep the cancels on regualr ND, lose it on the EX one, and have his iaGB toned down significantly.

 

[Rathalos]

I don't make the calls about the game but my point of view on patching and development is that overpowered moves need some sort of weakness to them or it's Kabal.

Well the only thing overpowered about it is 2 NDC infinite, and that's really more of a problem with 2, then it is ND.
That and EX ND probably doesn't really need armor.

 

[Lulzlou]

Well the only thing overpowered about it is 2 NDC infinite, and that's really more of a problem with 2, then it is ND.
That and EX ND probably doesn't really need armor.

Even then, is the 2ndc infinite really a problem?
What Kabals have you seen actually win with it? You have no idea how hard it is to get it on frame. Its not even an infinite if you are crouching too lol.

The advantage it has is silly because what options it brings but I honestly don't think the 2ndc infinite itself is the problem. Until I see a kabal actually do some broken ass win with it, I'll keep the opinion the way it is.

 

[Son ov Timett]

Only real silly thing about Kuh Bawl is armor on ex dash. With all his other tools, he doesn't need a string interrupter that leads to full combos.

 

[4x4lo8o]

Even then, is the 2ndc infinite really a problem?
What Kabals have you seen actually win with it? You have no idea how hard it is to get it on frame. Its not even an infinite if you are crouching too lol.

The advantage it has is silly because what options it brings but I honestly don't think the 2ndc infinite itself is the problem. Until I see a kabal actually do some broken ass win with it, I'll keep the opinion the way it is.

2ndc is a pain if you play a high hitbox character. Even if he's not executing it perfectly it's not always easy to get out. Regardless, there's reason Kabal should have a block infinite on anybody. That's just broken

 

[Lulzlou]

2ndc is a pain if you play a high hitbox character. Even if he's not executing it perfectly it's not always easy to get out. Regardless, there's reason Kabal should have a block infinite on anybody. That's just broken

If you are crouch blocking and let go of block the second 2ndc will whiff

 

[4x4lo8o]

If you are crouch blocking and let go of block the second 2ndc will whiff

Even on high hitbox characters? I was under the impression that characters like Raiden and Freddy are basically fucked unless the Kabal player messes up.

I've seen Detroit baby B Wizz at locals with 2~ndc. I don't think that was because B Wizz doesn't know the matchup or understand how to get out of pressure

 

[Lulzlou]

Even on high hitbox characters? I was under the impression that characters like Raiden and Freddy are basically fucked unless the Kabal player messes up.

I've seen Detroit baby B Wizz at locals with 2~ndc. I don't think that was because B Wizz doesn't know the matchup or understand how to get out of pressure

Yes, even high hitbox characters.
The reason why people sit there and block is because they are afraid of all the options he has off of a 2ndc. It leaves his at +10 so he can do anything. b121 is the most deadly and if you happen to let go of block, you are completely fucked.

It all comes down to how predictable the Kabal player is and how well he mixes it up. Being predictable can work in the Kabal players favor. You don't have to worry about this if you are fighting a average kabal player.

 

[Owerbart]

This is how I feel about it. In the old street fighter 2, the version with Akuma playable he is a very good character. He is at the top of the tier list, he is the only character in the game in S tier. He is also the only character in the game with 0 bad matchups, and 0 even matchups. Every single matchup he has is in his favor. The other top tier characters in A tier have a bad matchups, or at least a few even matchups, Akuma is the only character that beats every single other character. When playing Street Fighter 2 competitively in tournaments, they ban Akuma because they don't see a reason why there should be one character that is playable that dominates the whole cast. Yeah Akuma is beatable, but it is still not fair to have one character in the game that has an advantage over everyone else in competitive play.

Now lets talk about Super Smash Bros. Brawl. They have a similar situation in this game. There is only one character in S tier, Meta Knight, who is believed to have 0 bad matchups, and 0 even matchups, he wins every single matchup in the game vs every other character. In Brawl competitive play, they ban Meta Knight for his advantages over everyone else, just the same thing they do to Akuma.

Now on to MK9....... I would say we have the same problem again. Kabal is the only S tier character in the game, he is clearly above everyone else, he has 0 bad matchups and 0 even matchups. The rest of the top 5 characters all have bad matchups, and alot of even matchups as well. Kabal is literally the only character in the game that has advantage over every other character. He is the equivalent to Akuma in Street Fighter 2 and Meta Knight in Super Smash Bros Brawl. In my opinion he should be banned, there is no reason why there should be one character that is viable competitively and literally has ZERO bad matchups and ZERO even matchups. Don't give me that BS that Kung Lao goes even with Kabal because he's far from it I think.

Now LBSH, there are top players in this community that picked up Kabal only and solely because he is the best character in the game. I don't think there is one single person in the community we can name that has been using Kabal since day 1, everyone picked up this character because he is the best. If Kabal was only say top 10 instead of top 1, I don't think we would even see maybe two Kabals at the most in any tournament. Ban him or patch him, one of the two. And obviously we are not getting a patch any time soon....... so yeah lol

Actually I played him since day 1 because he is one of my favorite characters. Then NDC came

Also... funny it is that today I was wondering about if there was a tier list at super smash. Cool to know.

And for the end, now I can say Kabal goes 5-5 with Ermac.

 

[Owerbart]

Now, about patching the game, I would really like for Kabal to be a S+ tier. I don't think you can compare him with Akuma.

Instead of nerfing kabal, just make little fixes in some of the top tier chars and give the low tiers some tools. I don't think as Pig Of The Hut said that the game would be boring, even if all characters were tournament-worthy, still you'll have some good and bad MUs.

Don't do big nerfs on the high tiers, just give the low tiers more of a fighting chance.