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Match-up Discussion Harley Quinn Matchup Discussion

nightE89

nightE89

Cupcakes!!!
yeah after sitting down and having a pow wow meeting it all made clear, now time to get my Zatanna game up there now
 
nightE89

nightE89

Cupcakes!!!
dont waste your time man, her normals are ass and her whiff punishing it almost nonexistent.​
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​
She is hard to play i give you that but she mostly setups like Testament from GG ​
 
SaltFace NS

SaltFace NS

Ultimate Mileena Exterminator
The Superman Match-up

Now this is a MU that I've worked on since Day 1 of this game's release which in all honesty took lots of trial & error (and numerous losses to my record) but I truly feel this MU is honestly a 5-5 now. Now anyone reading this may think I'm speaking insanity right now but I've got solid reasons to prove why it is indeed a 5-5

  • With the numerous patches that the game has gone through Superman has been hit in some key spots that made the MU a lot more bearable than it once was. The MAIN problem before was the F2 3 Breath string being an infinite block string for infinite chip damage unless you had meter to push block him away. With the Breath getting nerfed (neutral on block instead of +1 and more pushback) this string IS NO LONGER an infinite block string & can now be cut into if the Superman tries another brainless F2 3 Breath string with a D2 or a Jump Back 2 into combo punish but be warned if you fight a smart Superman he can delay the second F2 3 string to bait a D2 & whiff punish you. How it is here it is a risk for both characters & the player that makes the right read in this situation will get rewarded.
  • Superman LOSES the zoning game against Harley due to one main reason and that is the start-up of her guns compared to his lasers. If done properly Superman will NEVER be able to get any ground lasers out on Harley due to the fact she can just shoot him before the beam even leaves his eyes. Also from full screen Harley can go mad shooting guns with no care in the world for ridiculous meter gain & at the same time it keeps him in check. If Superman shoots lasers in the air from full screen just jump over it & he'll realize that he's going nowhere fast against you & if you block a laser that he shot in the air & if he's high up in the air fire a reversal gunshot to punish him & continue your gunshot lockdown & meter gain. He'll be forced to MB his laser to make himself safe. Now once Superman gets 3/4 to about Mid-Screen your best zoning options here will be the Instant Overhead Jump Guns (to prevent forward dashing) & Ex Cupcake Bombs (to prevent Air Dash Jump-ins) but once in this range its all about reads & guesses. If you guess right you will continue to keep him at bay with zoning but if the Superman player guesses right he gets in. Once again the player that makes the right reads gets rewarded here. Now the ONLY WAY Superman wins in zoning is if you are at a large life defecit & he forces you to come to him.
Once these main concepts are truly understood you will see that the only way a Superman should defeat a Harley player is in the event he makes good reads to get through the zoning & get into her face. Besides that Superman shouldn't win in a range game unless he has a massive life lead in which at that point he'll force Harley to come to his face & play his game. If you play this MU right you will see Harley can do it & its not impossible like people believe it is.
 
dotunderscore

dotunderscore

._
Spinky said:
Apart from air-to-airing his J2... how the hell do you fight Batman?
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Air guns are good if you can catch him turtling with trait - also somewhat good for dodging released bats if you can time it correctly.

I'm not sure how to get him off me once he gets started. It seems easier for him to stuff wakeup tantrums
 
Jermball

Jermball

Noob
thanks saltface i needed something like that, superman is just my absolute worst matchup.. I now know what to look for also.

Flash has become a problem recently, but I notice Pop pop works wonders against him and guns in the zoning game, he can't RMS for any reason except during your oki. If you don't want to deal with flash trait just use pushblock. someone told me on MB DB3 (flash uppercut) you can duck the 2nd hit and make it whiff.

also, a blocked BF2 (flash psycho crusher) i've always been able to squeak out raw TS, 1 and it always connects. i'll have to double check though
 
cpmd4

cpmd4

Slaughter is the Best Medicine
I love EX cupcakes at full screen against Flash if he's about to RMS, and I find he has trouble against air guns. Can't say I have much experience against good Flash players though.
 
Awkward Sloth

Awkward Sloth

Lamest Harley, still better sloth than Jer
deg222 said:
http://www.twitch.tv/perfectlegend/b/451518210
@1:20:24

Few matches between me and PL's flash. It's only online, but it might help.
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I saw those matches and they were pretty amazing. My favorite part was when PL said "Dang Deg you playin like it's a tournament". I was like 'uhhh he's playing to win cause that's kinda the point in a fighting game.

So after the second hit in his overhead string you can get a 1 2 full combo inbetween?
And like Jermball said duck block the MB charge attack and you can get a combo off of that as well?

Jermball I don't really like using Pop-pop too much against the Flash because he has that annoying hitbox. About 25-30% of the time level 1 and 2 pop-pops go right over him even though its a mid. And depending on where he's at on the screen he can get really close after it whiffs and starts tearing me apart. :c
 
deg222

deg222

Best Zatanna that uses Aquaman
Awkward Sloth said:
I saw those matches and they were pretty amazing. My favorite part was when PL said "Dang Deg you playin like it's a tournament". I was like 'uhhh he's playing to win cause that's kinda the point in a fighting game.

So after the second hit in his overhead string you can get a 1 2 full combo inbetween?
And like Jermball said duck block the MB charge attack and you can get a combo off of that as well?

Jermball I don't really like using Pop-pop too much against the Flash because he has that annoying hitbox. About 25-30% of the time level 1 and 2 pop-pops go right over him even though its a mid. And depending on where he's at on the screen he can get really close after it whiffs and starts tearing me apart. :c
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Yeah, overtime Flash players are gonna have to learn to use f2 xx kick instead of f21 xx kick. Because as shown in the footage, you can duck the 1 in f21, and whiff punish with 12.

And as far as the lightning charge goes, yeah if he MBs it, you need to duck the first hit so the 2nd hit whiffs. You can get a free punish with b22 or 12, whichever you feel more comfortable with. Only problem is, if he uses non MB lightning charge farther than midscreen, you need to stand block it to get a b22 punish. Crouch blocking it will push you too far.
 
SaltFace NS

SaltFace NS

Ultimate Mileena Exterminator
deg222 said:
Yeah, overtime Flash players are gonna have to learn to use f2 xx kick instead of f21 xx kick. Because as shown in the footage, you can duck the 1 in f21, and whiff punish with 12.

And as far as the lightning charge goes, yeah if he MBs it, you need to duck the first hit so the 2nd hit whiffs. You can get a free punish with b22 or 12, whichever you feel more comfortable with. Only problem is, if he uses non MB lightning charge farther than midscreen, you need to stand block it to get a b22 punish. Crouch blocking it will push you too far.
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I had to learn all of that the hard way lol...can't wait for Battle & Brew...I want revenge against Harold's Flash.
 
Davie_boss

Davie_boss

Noob
I have problems, with Aquaman, a sliding douche Killer Frost, a Sinestro, and sometimes Batgirl... Any help with these? Oh and I'm patiently waiting a few mirror matches with Salt Face. I want to see what I should work on. :)
 
dotunderscore

dotunderscore

._
I recently been staying just outside of "MK sweep" distance with Sinestro and had good results. They think you are trying to rush in and usually whiff something that you can punish. At that range your gunshots can stop his boulder, fireballs as well.

Scorpion I have been messing with neutral jump 3 as it kinda works on the way up and down and knocks him out of teleport.
 
Awkward Sloth

Awkward Sloth

Lamest Harley, still better sloth than Jer
Denzell said:
So what do you Harley players think of Gl vs Harley? I think it is 5-5
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I agree with you to an extent. For my experience if a GL is full screen then Harley can zone him out pretty well. But at the start of the match depending on what the GL player does can really make things hell for Harley. Its 6-4 Harley when full screen and then it's 4-6 if GL has got to much pressure on you and he can lame it out if he wants.

My zoning tatics against GL's has gotten me quite a bit of hate mail. >.>;
 
serge

serge

Mortal
Yea I think it's 5-5 too. A good GL can be annoying with air rockets since Harley can't punish them well and he has his b13~close missiles which is a block infinite against a meterless cornered Harley. (Don't let it happen)

If you can dodge all his projectiles, he will get tired and try to air turbine to get in and MB cupcakes eats that.

At the very start of the match you can hold back for one step just to make sure you block the Lantern's might if he starts with it. If after that one step back he hasn't ringed you, chances are he is opening with b1. That is full combo punishable with b2 but you have to be really good with the timing. If I can pull it off online, everyone can! Hope this helps :)
 
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