Fundamentals of Injustice

[CrimsonShadow]

A reversal is when you input a special move during block stun and it comes out the first frame you're able to. It will say reversal on screen.

Ah ok, thanks -- that's what I was looking for.

Another note is that a lot of character's special moves last longer than 8 frames in Injustice. Not everyone has a Lex Corp Charge (b,f+2) which is 6 frames so the entire duraction of the move will be invincible.

This made me realize that there's no Duration info on the frame data. So Corps Charge has a 6 frame startup and a 6-frame duration?

 

[Slips]

This made me realize that there's no Duration info on the frame data. So Corps Charge has a 6 frame startup and a 6-frame duration?

That I have no idea on that actually. Depends on the distance your opponent is from you. But chances are if they are right next to you you'll still have your invincibility by the time it hits.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

Ok, and one last thing to confirm -- as far as armoring is concerned, can an armored f3/b3 gain armor on the first frame of the move, or is there a minimum delay of frames before the armor takes effect?

It feels later for some reason, but someone said that Bill said it can be active on the first frame.

 

[colt]

couple notes on "wakeups". almost every special move can be done on wakeup. All projectiles and projectile like moves have zero invincibility on wakeup. other moves have variable invulnerability windows but noone has anything over 12 or 14 maybe. Everyone has atleast one "good" wakeup move.

b3/f3 gain armor on the 8th frame. So you can't use them on reaction to counter a jab with a 40% combo.

 

[Jim]

Be honest, that was your idea, wasn't it?

Let's Be Serious Here, who would let @GGA 16 Bit name something in a video game?

 

[CrimsonShadow]

b3/f3 gain armor on the 8th frame. So you can't use them on reaction to counter a jab with a 40% combo.

Ok, thanks Paulo -- makes sense based on what it feels like.

 

[Blair Kirkley]

Really liking the demo. The difference in gameplay is intriguing IMO. Tuesday can't come soon enough. Glad I found this forum.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Also b+3 and f+3 are unclashable. As well as projectiles unless they're part of a combo. Finally, the extra hits of MB moves are unclashable unless in combos. So like with Flash's Sonic Kick the additional kicks can't be clashed.

So you're saying if i end a combo with sinestro rock projectile they can clash it?

Push-block all day vs Doomsday!!!
If he stays this cheap I'm probably gonna main him jesus....

No, just punish his shoulder ram on block

 

[16 Bit]

So you're saying if i end a combo with sinestro rock projectile they can clash it?

Yes

 

[Posthuman]

So you're saying if i end a combo with sinestro rock projectile they can clash it?


No, just punish his shoulder ram on block

how much is Lex's JI3 on block?

 

[CrimsonShadow]

how much is Lex's JI3 on block?

It's like -8 in the demo.

 

[1man3letters]

A reversal is when you input a special move during block stun and it comes out the first frame you're able to. It will say reversal on screen.

do reversals give any added benefits to the move being done like how wakeups get invincibility frames?

 

[Crazykitana]

okay thought it was about time i signed up again oh well .
im here to share some new tech, involving the focus attack system in the game.
ill post this on other sites but ill start here.



a key feature of the injustice mechanics which is some what over looked is the focus attack system.
an accustomed system that can be recognised by those that have seen or played SF4.
the focus attack system in injustice doesn't quite function like its sf4 counter part, but they follow the same principles.
they are both able to absorb a one hit attack,in other words have one hit of armour.
the focus attack system in injustice works ,by imputing forward heavy or back heavy plus the meter button.
this is often useful in block strings and as a universal counter to certain strings with low block stun.
most of you may already be aware of this but im not sure anyone has mentioned that you can actually dash out of both forward heavy and back heavy charge version attacks so this can be used for bating attacks and whiff punishing since back dash is safe.
also adds a new layer of depth, as well as granting more movement options.
think of Jax ground pound cancel.
bare in mind you must be charging to dash cancel out of forward heavy or back heavy.


this should have its own thread as i feel this will play a huge role in competitive play given the depth and possibilities at hand.

 

[16 Bit]

do reversals give any added benefits to the move being done like how wakeups get invincibility frames?

No

 

[CrimsonShadow]

Crazykitana welcome to TYM, make sure you read some of the other forum posts -- that's already been covered in this thread and a few others.

 

[Posthuman]

It's like -8 in the demo.

Have anyone tried to punish it with batman's 113 or 123 for full combo? it may be possible cause is 6frames.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

Have anyone tried to punish it with batman's 113 or 123 for full combo? it may be possible cause is 6frames.

The thing is, you have to consider pushback and distance. 8 frames is not a big enough window to close any sort of gap, especially with batman's stubby standing 1.

 

[Posthuman]

The thing is, you have to consider pushback and distance. 8 frames is not a big enough window to close any sort of gap, especially with batman's stubby standing 1.

Ok at least Lex loses pressure and has to block batmans follow up right?

 

[Dizzy]

Ah ok, thanks -- that's what I was looking for.



This made me realize that there's no Duration info on the frame data. So Corps Charge has a 6 frame startup and a 6-frame duration?

I think duration can be calculated from the in-game frame data as startup + recovery. I haven't looked into the recovery data so far but just glancing at it thats what it seemed like at least.

 

[Euphoric]

Yes

I've had a Batarang clashed before in the Demo, so I am assuming projectiles can be too.

 

[Knoterror]

No

What is the point of reversals then? Just to make sure you punish a blockstring without having to worry about mistiming because of blockstun?

 

[cyke_out]

What is the point of reversals then? Just to make sure you punish a blockstring without having to worry about mistiming because of blockstun?

It pops up just to let you know you did it correctly.

 

[Dizzy]

What is the point of reversals then? Just to make sure you punish a blockstring without having to worry about mistiming because of blockstun?

Reversals give you a larger window to get something out with "perfect timing".

The easiest way to see this in game is block something -6 (such as batmans b113 I believe) and try to punish with d1. It's extremely hard because this is a "just frame punish". Now try to punish this with Lex's Corp Charge on reversal (6 frame special). Any time you get the reversal, it gives you that perfect timing that makes Corp Charge hit in 6 frames.

The reason this is easier is because when you are in block stun, there is a window to enter special moves that allows you to get it as a reversal, allowing for some leniency. There is no window for normals so you just have to time it perfectly.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

Ok at least Lex loses pressure and has to block batmans follow up right?

For most practical purposes (in the demo), vs. Batman at anything outside of point blank (which is pretty common given the range of lex's U3) this might as well be 0. Also, in practice the way it feels seems to vary on how high lex is off the ground when the 3 comes out (partially because by the time he lands, more frames have passed). I'm going to have to mess around with it more in training to really get a feel for it.

You can parry afterwards, but if it's read you're going to pay for it.

In-close as Lex I use j2, because it has 30-ish frames of advantage and allows me to setup b13, 11X, or whatever else on block.

 

[Knoterror]

Reversals give you a larger window to get something out with "perfect timing".

The easiest way to see this in game is block something -6 (such as batmans b113 I believe) and try to punish with d1. It's extremely hard because this is a "just frame punish". Now try to punish this with Lex's Corp Charge on reversal (6 frame special). Any time you get the reversal, it gives you that perfect timing that makes Corp Charge hit in 6 frames.

The reason this is easier is because when you are in block stun, there is a window to enter special moves that allows you to get it as a reversal, allowing for some leniency. There is no window for normals so you just have to time it perfectly.

So what I said then.

Thanks for the clarification.