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Frost General Discussion

Kindred

Let Be Be Finale Of Seem
Geras is a lol Matchup. D1 infinite.

If he uses the command grab variation you can use her head bomb variation. Low sand trap gets full punished by the bomb if he hits you.
that MU is like 9.99 to 0.01 LOL
 

Wigy

There it is...
So I've been in the lab just working on oki.

Off her corner bnb b32d1 b32d1 344 df2. Or really any ender where you hit df2 with them lowish.

Dash in stance switch njp beats stay down and roll out. Just an easy way to time it and you can block after stance switch for the U2/U3 or just walk back shimmy into b22 or d4.

Also worked out meaty d4 timings it has 7 active frames which is crazy useful for Oki and means you can meaty it to be around -4 (best I could get). With the spacing your options for special cancelling off this can be
-db4 to block up counterpokes
-df2 or bf4 to blow up reversal strings
-db2b to catch jumping after the d4 blocked.

If youve conditioned them to fear the d4 and they don't have good neutral tools to counter it they will start jumping out the corner then you can get d3 antair into about 270 for a bar (easy combo can probably be optimised)

A lot of wakeups d4 will entirely avoid, if they roll or delayed wakeup you will recover in time and avoids people just standing up and going into a high string.

This is barely worth mentioning but thought I'd just throw it out there.

Also after 22 on block- (which I recommend after freeze into 344)

B22 draws back your hitbox which can mean you punish a lot of people pressing buttons and b3 will low crush a low of d3's.

Otherwise just get the guaranteed sweep check.

Gotta get inventive to open people up

Scraping the barrel til I make this frozen whiffing mess work lol.
 
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My experience with Lui kang mu righ now = Ok, lui kang i can't deal with you, do what you want i don't care just end it quickly. Nice strings can i push a button? No? ok fine. He's simply to fast and frost is like the character with dalay as a feature. Love lui kang in mk11 btw.
 

Wigy

There it is...
My experience with Lui kang mu righ now = Ok, lui kang i can't deal with you, do what you want i don't care just end it quickly. Nice strings can i push a button? No? ok fine. He's simply to fast and frost is like the character with dalay as a feature. Love lui kang in mk11 btw.
Use 13 to punish the stagger game is all I can say.

Just a disclaimer. This matchup is horrid, just like worthless trying to poke.
 
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Wigy

There it is...
Looking at all her frame data and normals i really think frosts main trait isn't her zoning or neutral. It's her corner pressure.

Bf4mb has MASSIVE corner carry
D4 is the best meaty in the game and can be spaced after her plus 40 knockdown to the point that they just have to hold it unless they have an exceptionally long range u3.
D3 checks any jump outs.

Post d4 on block special cancel guessing game keeps people blocking.

Once they just sit there respecting everything. You then have 22 344 and shimmy b22s walk up grabs.

Getting her corner game down has shot her viability up for me big time
 

Wigy

There it is...
Combos I'm using-
Let me know if I can squeeze out more damage with any doable combos


Corner:
B22(KB) 4db3 13 db4mb jk 3df2
BF4(KB) 1db3 13 db4mb jk 3df2

Starter-db4mb j2 b32d1 b32d1 322 df2
(Easier) Starter-db4mb jk 4db3 344df2
(Even easier)- starter-db4mb j2 b32d1 22 13df2

Off Oki NJP - use this as it's plus and hitconfirmable.

43-db3 13 db4 mb jk 13 df2
(Harder) 43-db3 344 df2

Midscreen-

Starter - db4mb j2 b32d1 b32d1 s1 bf4 (think that's character specific)
Starter- db4mb j2 b32d1 1 13 bf4

Good Oki setup midscreen-

Starter -db4mb b32d1 22 db2
-you can dash in and njp and beats every wakeup after except roll back for a lot of characters

D3 antiair-

Far antiair- d3 d1-df2
Close antiair- d3 1 13-bf4
Crossup- d3-db4mb dash back (pause) b32d1 13 bf4 (the b3 whiffs) bit tricky but max I can get off.
 
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MrRevz

Noob
Hey, guys, I'm new to the MK series, and I picked up Frost, using mostly the Ice Machine variation. I just can't seem to get in against zoning characters like Liu Kang, Shang Tsung, and Cetrion. I've gone full sets of getting knocked across screen, ducking and blocking projectiles while moving forward, and then having to immediately block a combo once I'm close enough that'll push me far away enough to reset the situation. This is especially bad against Shang Tsung.

Are there any options Frost has to get up and close to zoners? Any tips on how to deal with it?
 

phnmnl

Noob
Hey, guys, I'm new to the MK series, and I picked up Frost, using mostly the Ice Machine variation. I just can't seem to get in against zoning characters like Liu Kang, Shang Tsung, and Cetrion. I've gone full sets of getting knocked across screen, ducking and blocking projectiles while moving forward, and then having to immediately block a combo once I'm close enough that'll push me far away enough to reset the situation. This is especially bad against Shang Tsung.

Are there any options Frost has to get up and close to zoners? Any tips on how to deal with it?
Zoners can be tricky but Frost is generally pretty good anti-zoner. Use your shield and db2 to get the knock down, then you'll have advantage for another db2 and they'll have to block.

Try and check them with f2 during their start up frames if you're close enough. Although of you abuse this they'll catch on and punish.

Finally don't get too close. Frost sucks up close and is much better between d4 and b2 range. Go for whiff punishes with b22, d4 to check strings and use bf4 to push them into the corner. Then abuse them using oki tips that @Wigy has dropped.

Good luck!

Btw @Wigy you're doing god's work
 

phnmnl

Noob
If given the chance,How would you ppl buff frost??
I wouldn't want to change her game plan too much so against popular opinion I wouldnt buff her b1 to keep her honest.

2 should still whiff low block otherwise her 22 +5 on block would be too strong and out of character.

Buffs.

  • 1 should hit low block
  • F2 should hit low block
  • Fix 3 whiffing first or second hit randomly
  • Make microburst plus on hit so it's actually useful and plays into her stong throw KB game
  • Make her b2212 KB have less pushback so it's useful midscreen or give it more damage so its more punishing in the corner
Essentially more momentum on hit and still mostly loses her turn on block.
 
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Wigy

There it is...
If you're in range I like to use bf4 to check zoners after ducked/blocked projectiles or do get out the way of the aimed ones like skarlets tongue. This is risky use it sparingly.

You want to hit trades with db2 and get into a range where you can use b2, d4 or jump at them.

In matchups where they have multi projectiles, pay close attention to their bar as most require it for the second. You can use the shield here when they don't have bar to get favourable trades, and when they do have bar you can pop shield to bait the mb then block.

Liu Kang just seems like a straight loosing matchup. Perfect blocking his projectiles isn't the hardest and really will help.

One adjustment I've made versus heavy zoners-

Always end combos in bf4 mb to get them in to the corner where you can mess up basically anyone

Or

End in 22 db2 after the b32d1 (dash in njp for nice Oki)

Inch your way in like many characters have to and abuse the d4 special gimmicks. Make them scared to do anything but block. Get trades where you can with db2.

@MrRevz

P.S shang is a stupid character and bad matchup idk with that one.

I basically go full rush down. You can perfect block second hell skull and bf4 him.

Corner his wakeups are pretty weak so bully the fuck out of him. I basically go full rushdown with some neutral and Oki db2's to catch him trying to jump or whatever
 
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Wigy

There it is...

Just some corner KB combos etc seen a few people online using unoptimal as shit combos from them.

Side switch and max damage d3 antiair combo from crossup.

22 on block mindgames- demonstrated on the king of annoying mash. (Setup for this is starter-db4 mb j2 322 microdash 22). Useful in clutch moments when they can roll out your combos.
 

JSF

Best Worst character Main
after seeing shang there really is no excuse for the way frost is. b1 should be 9 or 10 frames. maybe even make b2 16 frames (maybe) and d1 should be 7 like everyone elses i dont care if that makes it the best d1 in the game she needs it and wouldnt be as busted as scoprion or erron or geras . if those changes happened i could live with her. i do wish f2 was a krushing blow tho so she would actually have a viable one
 
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vegeta

Saiyan Prince
Premium Supporter
@Kindred
Random thought occurred to me today. If she ever gets buffs, for V1 since the head bomb is mid keep that as is. But they should give it an AMP option that could take say one bar of defensive and one offensive meter to make the bomb a low. That’d be decent
 

Wigy

There it is...
@Kindred
Random thought occurred to me today. If she ever gets buffs, for V1 since the head bomb is mid keep that as is. But they should give it an AMP option that could take say one bar of defensive and one offensive meter to make the bomb a low. That’d be decent
I think they'd be too scared with her bf4 as it would be a hard to blockable.

I mean they could just give her a MB with more range. Would give her actual setups and presence with it.

Her best way of checking jumping in the neutral her air grenade which is the big problem with this variation. People just kinda jump all over the place.
 

Marinjuana

Up rock incoming, ETA 5 minutes
For buffs outside the norm, I thought it would be nice if Frost-Byte could amplify BF4 on block, so it would still be unsafe on both normal and amplify but you'd have a little mixup there to help keep you from getting punished.

I also think it would be nice if DB3 would connect more consistently across the cast at the end of strings so she could have more combo potential, particularly in Frost-Byte.
 

vegeta

Saiyan Prince
Premium Supporter
Well it’d be taking up two bars so if they block right or punish with combo she wouldn’t be able to break out or if she hits the freeze you can only use one bar worth of combo for damage.

Plus the bf4 is two hits so even if you get frozen by headbomb and use it you can’t combo off it and you unfreeze them with the second hit
 

vegeta

Saiyan Prince
Premium Supporter
But overall outside of slightly later stages in tournament, most people don’t respect anything, push buttons or jump around too much to be trained so to speak
 
However the kounter picking in kombat league is absurd, people just switch to lui kang on my frost and i have to sweat for every single string. I have to say that i never played a fighting game where the emphasis on kounter pick is so huge
 
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For bomb variation:
  • Increase hitbox so you don't have to move 1 pixel to dodge it
  • It should NOT replace her projectile
Just that and at lest it would be playable
 

Kindred

Let Be Be Finale Of Seem
@Kindred
Random thought occurred to me today. If she ever gets buffs, for V1 since the head bomb is mid keep that as is. But they should give it an AMP option that could take say one bar of defensive and one offensive meter to make the bomb a low. That’d be decent
Honestly, I dont think that would be enough IMO. By default, everybody should always block low against Frost so adding a bomb that hits low wouldnt really change much I feel. I want to see the bombs work properly with more range. Now tell me you need to spend a bar for that increased range and Ill say fine because then it can act similar to the Microburst of V2.

Her combo potential in V1 is lacking and if we could use the AMP bomb that has more range, then the times the setup does work, we can get some damage in. Couple setups that work more consistently (w/ meter) + her control of the map (w/ regular bomb, F2 & B2) and you have a character that could be worth testing out.

Still need to fix the fact that her mids are slow, her S1 and S3 have shit range and her B121 hitbox is fucked though. (These arent even buffs, these are just fixes that need to be done)

All this gets fixed and she might be more viable IMO.
 
Another big problem with v1 is that your opp can do all kind of unsafe stuff, and how much can you get from a s1 punish? 16%? That's super shltty
Guess right vs Sonya twice, 30%, guess wrong once, eat 35/40%
 

JSF

Best Worst character Main
However the kounter picking in kombat league is absurd, people just switch to lui kang on my frost and i have to sweat for every single string. I have to say that i never played a fighting game where the emphasis on kounter pick is so huge
ill fight the Frost Kang matchup and just zone, it usually works out because most online players in this game have no idea how to deal with good zoning. it is pretty crazy that his flying kick is safe on block at max range against her though