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Frost General Discussion

Wrath0594

Steam profile: 76561198102032134
Seeing some comments about jailing- d1 and d3 on hit definitely jail into b12.

If d1 connects and you immediately b12 it'll beat out an opponent's d1. I know it's a mid, but you have options vs d1 mashers.

If yall are looking for some dirt- d1 also makes d4 uninterruptible. If you cancel d4 into bf3 (projectile special) it jails, as long as it isn't at max range. It's not a true combo (nothing from anyone's d4 is) but if the opponent does anything except block after eating the d4, you get some juicy dmg for free.
 

Yxng Raijin

Cosmic Despot
Seeing some comments about jailing- d1 and d3 on hit definitely jail into b12.

If d1 connects and you immediately b12 it'll beat out an opponent's d1. I know it's a mid, but you have options vs d1 mashers.

If yall are looking for some dirt- d1 also makes d4 uninterruptible. If you cancel d4 into bf3 (projectile special) it jails, as long as it isn't at max range. It's not a true combo (nothing from anyone's d4 is) but if the opponent does anything except block after eating the d4, you get some juicy dmg for free.
Thanks for the tip!
 

Wrath0594

Steam profile: 76561198102032134
I’d rather keep discussion on tech instead of general statements, but I can definitely see an identity crisis here. Frost neutral consists of... Chucking out b2’s and seeing if they land. Yeah, yeah, stop typing “but f2 and d4!” Sure. But uh... Kinda boring, right? All her other normals are so bad you can only get them off jump ins- normals like 344 and 43.

Might mess with V1. I don’t care if it’s weaker as long as it’s more interesting. With the sets I played I’m V2, I just can’t see myself sticking with this character. She’s boring, unfortunately.
 

Xzyj

Noob
I wouldn't call her boring personally, maybe she's just not your playstyle? I played some sets yesterday and i love how she plays, b2 is your best tool to approach neutral, sure, f2 is complementary if they want to intercept you at certain ranges, but besides that you also have great anti-airs if they are sick with dealing with you in neutral and want to avoid b2 pressure with jumps, d4 into bf4ex and oops now oppo in the corner with you doing random bullshit to crack his defense up or doing throws for 300 (with probably the coolest KB animation of hers).

She's such an annoyance really and that's what's cool about her imo.

As for the strings i think 43 is supposed to be her antiair and high crush, 344 is her best damage punish string and ground damage string (when you want to avoid breakout/fallout whatever it's called), b12 mid check string after the poke and a mindgame between this string and throw upclose, a lot of her tools have nice design to them and it really feels like all of her strings are useful in some situations just from what they do really, like even 22 being +5 on block but doing less damage than 13 tells you to use it in pressure instead of combo enders
 

scarsunseen

Safeties disabled. Mod mode engaged.
Moderator
I'm finding that B121 is pretty useless. People just duck the last hit and punish. Also, I've D4-cancelling off of opponent wake-up attacks :) Just like MK9, you can cancel off of invincible wake-up frames, and Frost's D4 range really benefits her.
 

Wrath0594

Steam profile: 76561198102032134
I wouldn't call her boring personally, maybe she's just not your playstyle? I played some sets yesterday and i love how she plays, b2 is your best tool to approach neutral, sure, f2 is complementary if they want to intercept you at certain ranges, but besides that you also have great anti-airs if they are sick with dealing with you in neutral and want to avoid b2 pressure with jumps, d4 into bf4ex and oops now oppo in the corner with you doing random bullshit to crack his defense up or doing throws for 300 (with probably the coolest KB animation of hers).

She's such an annoyance really and that's what's cool about her imo.

As for the strings i think 43 is supposed to be her antiair and high crush, 344 is her best damage punish string and ground damage string (when you want to avoid breakout/fallout whatever it's called), b12 mid check string after the poke and a mindgame between this string and throw upclose, a lot of her tools have nice design to them and it really feels like all of her strings are useful in some situations just from what they do really, like even 22 being +5 on block but doing less damage than 13 tells you to use it in pressure instead of combo enders
Don’t get me wrong, if you’re enjoying her- MORE POWER TO YOU. I’m happy that you’re having fun playing her, I hope that never stops, I want everyone to enjoy the game their own way.

However, for me to dislike her playstyle she’d need to have one. “B22 confirm” is not a playstyle. I think Frost is stronger than Jade, Kotal, Dvorah, Kano and a few others, but I find all of those characters more interesting to play. I hope her V1 gets buffed and gets moves added to it. Probably take bf4 out and replace it with another special too. I was right that V1 at least has SOMETHING to play with, but it isn’t worth losing almost all her combo damage.

Again, she has a cool design. I hope she gets some changes. Not trying to shit on anyone enjoying her. Just saying I don’t and the reasons why that I hope get addressed when the first major patch rolls out. She’s just lacking in tools and you don’t get a lot of decisions to make. B22, f2, d4, or jump in. It’s just too linear. She might be the first character I check out the custom specials for.
 

Sugarwatermixlegit

Frosty Cage
What do you guys think about the Scorpion MU? I think this might be one of her MUs that I’ve played at least. He seems to be able to invalidate so many of her tools.
 

scarsunseen

Safeties disabled. Mod mode engaged.
Moderator
What do you guys think about the Scorpion MU? I think this might be one of her MUs that I’ve played at least. He seems to be able to invalidate so many of her tools.
Don't attack him from a distance because he will just teleport and punish you. Keep him close and finish your combos with oki/bomb setups. DF2 will catch Scorpion teleporting behind you.
 

Marinjuana

Up rock incoming, ETA 5 minutes
I played 15 matches or so against a pretty solid Baraka player last night. I got a ton of use out of Cryogenic Crown, but in the entire set I think I freezed him less then 2 times. But it was extremely valuable in forcing him to avoid or respect the bomb and allowed the zoning game to function even though his blade spark was an adequate counter to Frost's normal projectile.

Also, when you do her amplified projectile from full screen, she's +11 or so on block. In a lot of matchups that will mean you can throw out a safe bomb.
 

Kindred

Let Be Be Finale Of Seem
I played 15 matches or so against a pretty solid Baraka player last night. I got a ton of use out of Cryogenic Crown, but in the entire set I think I freezed him less then 2 times. But it was extremely valuable in forcing him to avoid or respect the bomb and allowed the zoning game to function even though his blade spark was an adequate counter to Frost's normal projectile.

Also, when you do her amplified projectile from full screen, she's +11 or so on block. In a lot of matchups that will mean you can throw out a safe bomb.
What's a reliable punish for the teleport? Her 1 or 3 have the speed to punish but not the range so they are weird. I try S4 but its hit or miss
 

Kindred

Let Be Be Finale Of Seem
Huh that’s weird I’ve never encountered this?
I have encountered it and this video just came in to confirm the issues I was having a while back. Specifically, that her S1 range is inconsistent when it comes to punishing scorpions teleport.
So Ive been using B3 instead, which doesnt lead in much damage.

Maybe they fixed it without mentioning it since the video is relatively old.
 

JSF

Low Tier Villain
She's actually the worst character in the game. to punish with jab you have to dash cancel into jab. so block an unsafe move input dash first then jab. or just d2 and get 14% or test your luck punishing with her 16 frame mid (b1). why is she the only character wit this problem? and the only one besides geras who doesnt have a low d3 -____- sorry if i sound salty i just really want this character to be fixed lol
 

Kindred

Let Be Be Finale Of Seem
She's actually the worst character in the game. to punish with jab you have to dash cancel into jab. so block an unsafe move input dash first then jab. or just d2 and get 14% or test your luck punishing with her 16 frame mid (b1). why is she the only character wit this problem? and the only one besides geras who doesnt have a low d3 -____- sorry if i sound salty i just really want this character to be fixed lol
I don't know if i would say she is the worst in the game but low tier most definitely mainly because of issues that were clearly not intended to be in the game (like the aforementioned scorpion teleport issue). Giving her a 13f B1 and fixing the range of her S1 and S3 can easily being her a few tier levels up and I'd be very happy with that
 
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Kindred

Let Be Be Finale Of Seem
So whats her optimal combo after D1? Seems like all combos too late for 10 frames afte d1
Your best option is B1. It's 16f so you can get poked if someone has a 6 frame poke (like Geras) and it's a very time window for people with 7-8f pokes. Considering its online though, dont expect it to be consistent. Expect to be angry and poked to death
 

Kindred

Let Be Be Finale Of Seem
What is the main punish tool? I’ve been whiffing s1 all day
Lol if only she had a main punish tool!
Its all dependent on how negative and the distance the blocked move leaves you at.
For example, Scorpion teleport is punished with B3 pretty consistently (but no good damage), S4 sometimes works and leads to more damage or S1 if he teleports to the right but not the left. Sub-zero's slide, B1 is tight but works. Basically, there isnt one size fits all because of her shitty range and slow mids.
 

TheLewis

Noob
Just go to the "Is she viable thread?" Ive got over 300 games with her now and she needs the 2 fixes kindred discusses above.

1. B1 needs to be faster ~ 13 frames. It is unreasonable to think even someone like sonicfox is going to be frame perfect, online. D1 on hit is +10, minus 16 frame startup on B1 and even frame perfect means you trade with a 6 frame D1. When I play against frost I steal my turn back 100% of the time because wtf is she going to do about it, and most dont think to, or arent able to, D1 into a special move.

2. Hit collision issues, you shouldn't have to think "what side is he on?" to punish something as negative as teleport. Blocking SZ slide (11 frame, full screen, low profiling, projectile avoiding, low, that krushing blows) and knowing you have to be fast as fuck online to punish it when its minus 10 billion because your fast buttons will wiff and your other buttons are slow as mud, should not be a thing.