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General/Other - Ferra/Torr F/T is bottom 5! Lets do this.

Karnage

Karnage

Ancestors give me Strength!!
Make lackeys roll have the same properties as mileenas so you can meterless punish...for example
b121xxroll f2 f3 4xxgrab - still doing the same damage as the f2/b2 starters..but using roll with b121 or 11 needs hit confirming if not you eat a big punish for it which is fair so its only use is in punishing
 
Doombawkz

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
Karnage said:
Make lackeys roll have the same properties as mileenas so you can meterless punish...for example
b121xxroll f2 f3 4xxgrab - still doing the same damage as the f2/b2 starters..but using roll with b121 or 11 needs hit confirming if not you eat a big punish for it which is fair so its only use is in punishing
Click to expand...
b.1 isn't much of a punish, its kind of slow. You're more likely to use 2xx(blank) or 11xxcharge.

That being said, spend a bar of meter and you can do combos using roll as an extender.
Also off of certain starters.
 
Karnage

Karnage

Ancestors give me Strength!!
yeah, i wasnt intending to use b1 as the prime example to punish lol...just trying to get my point across about lackey being able to have a decent meterless punish, so yeah 2xxroll launch into normal bnb combo. that being said making 11 2+4 launch would solve that. My only complaint with lackey at the mo
 
Wetdoba

Wetdoba

All too easy...
My only complaint with the character in general right now is that B121 which is suppose to be 3 mids in a row seems to always whiff high
 
S

Shade667

#StrongisthenewCute
I agree with karnage. Unless u hit f2 ur getting like 22% max meterless, which is like a doomsday punish. Kitana pokes u and ur losing 40%+.
He needs a faster combo starter. Cuz im using all my meter trying to get in on hish qu ten and kenshi, and then all I can do is 20%, when ive just eaten 30+.
 
MK Led

MK Led

Umbasa
Shade667 said:
I agree with karnage. Unless u hit f2 ur getting like 22% max meterless, which is like a doomsday punish. Kitana pokes u and ur losing 40%+.
He needs a faster combo starter. Cuz im using all my meter trying to get in on hish qu ten and kenshi, and then all I can do is 20%, when ive just eaten 30+.
Click to expand...
We also have b2, which leads to the same amount of damage. And it's not that easy for kitana, you can just block low and her max punish is the like 11% her b2 does. She can have a rough time opening her opponent up, so she has to rely more on punishing for her damage. Whereas f/t (non-lackey) gets a free mixup every time you land a block string. It sure isn't very much damage, but you can do it every time. And if you're playing vicious, you can also mix in a tic throw off 1, 2 or b1, (or d1 in ruthless, etc.)
 
Karnage

Karnage

Ancestors give me Strength!!
lackey highest max punisher is 13% using 2 and 1 as starter, if they have a -11 then b121 is 16%.

11 2+4 to launch...lets start a petition!!
 
chrisofrays

chrisofrays

Fish can hear you thinkin just before you sneeze
Where do NRS get their info about balancing characters? I hope F/T wont just get ignored because of their popularity

1,1,2+4 needs to set up a midscreen launch. If theres a slight bit of lag moves like ermacs teleport and subs ex slide are so hard to punnish. I ususaly have to go for 11 50/50
 
S

Shade667

#StrongisthenewCute
MK Led said:
We also have b2, which leads to the same amount of damage. And it's not that easy for kitana, you can just block low and her max punish is the like 11% her b2 does. She can have a rough time opening her opponent up, so she has to rely more on punishing for her damage. Whereas f/t (non-lackey) gets a free mixup every time you land a block string. It sure isn't very much damage, but you can do it every time. And if you're playing vicious, you can also mix in a tic throw off 1, 2 or b1, (or d1 in ruthless, etc.)
Click to expand...
Kitanas more of a whiff punish character imo. She doesnt have to open u up.

He doesnt have any 50/50's which u cant reacto to. U can just block low, see b2 coming and block high.
Bane had fast mixups, If I recall correctly (I didnt exactly play him) why cant torr? B2 is hardly a mixup. I have time to make tea while hes winding up.
 
MK Led

MK Led

Umbasa
Shade667 said:
Kitanas more of a whiff punish character imo. She doesnt have to open u up.

He doesnt have any 50/50's which u cant reacto to. U can just block low, see b2 coming and block high.
Bane had fast mixups, If I recall correctly (I didnt exactly play him) why cant torr? B2 is hardly a mixup. I have time to make tea while hes winding up.
Click to expand...
So you agree with me about kitana. And yeah b2 isn't fantastic, but the launching string off it is safe, so it's not the worst thing in the world. And don't tell me someone can actually react to low/OH throw after a string - yeah I know it's not an unreactable 50/50 starter that leads to a full combo, but it's what we have atm.
 
joeldm

joeldm

Noob
Can anyone easily punish Bo Spin Kung Jin?
I know we can punish F3~Torryuken but it is difficult.
Other characters like Sub-Zero and Scorpion can punish without spending bar with f4 and b3 easily because these movements has 11 start frames.

F3 has 15 start frame. IMO F3 should have 11 start frame
 
chrisofrays

chrisofrays

Fish can hear you thinkin just before you sneeze
joeldm said:
Can anyone easily punish Bo Spin Kung Jin?
I know we can punish F3~Torryuken but it is difficult.
Other characters like Sub-Zero and Scorpion can punish without spending bar with f4 and b3 easily because these movements has 11 start frames.

F3 has 15 start frame. IMO F3 should have 11 start frame
Click to expand...
Ive seen in biohazards videos that he runs then does 1,1 to punish.
 
Karnage

Karnage

Ancestors give me Strength!!
ohhh...lackeys grab can be low profiled too...cage can d4 it...i think he can pretty d4 everything though (even saw cage low profile ermacs xray lol)

I heard hes getting a run cancel too? guess we will see later, hoping we can get a meterless punisher thats higher than 16%
 
B

BlahBlahLOL

Noob
  • Ferra/Torr - Adjusted several regular attack collisions to hit more consistently on ducking opponents and in combos
  • Ferra/Torr - Increased damage of Tuck 'n' Trample to 13 (up from 9)
  • Ferra/Torr (Ruthless) - Removed 20 recovery frames from Pain And Gain
  • Ferra/Torr (Ruthless) - You can now dash cancel out of Pain And Gain after being stabbed, doing so will knock Ferra off of your back
  • Ferra/Torr (Lackey) - Torr Charge (Meter Burn) no longer ignores damage scaling and had its damage increased by 2
 
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Barrogh

Barrogh

Meta saltmine
So, Ruthless parry is a thing now? Too bad that there's not much damage to be done off it without Ferra, but hey, free armor to get out of disadvantageous situation.
 
Doombawkz

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
Barrogh said:
So, Ruthless parry is a thing now? Too bad that there's not much damage to be done off it without Ferra, but hey, free armor.
Click to expand...
There is plenty of damage that can be done, actually. f.2 n.j.p is all it takes for Ferra to climb back on.

Land the parry, land the f.2, you get 40% meterless with one buff on the counter.
With two buffs, its 47% meterless.
At three, its a 56% meterless.
 
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MadeFromMetal

MadeFromMetal

Heart From Iron, Mind From Steel.
I'm so hyped for this. I was hoping for other variation changes but they didn't touch on frame data so there could be more changes that help the others. The ruthless buff it's going to be great though. I wonder if we can do starter~PnGC, f2 now.
 
Wetdoba

Wetdoba

All too easy...
Well they said that shit like B121 will hit mid across the board now right? Thats kinda huge for Lackey imo. Still no meterless punishes though unless they forgot to mention that stuff
 
Karnage

Karnage

Ancestors give me Strength!!
i hope they did forget to mention it...pretty disappointing if thats the case, waiting for the full patch notes though
 
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