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F Champ Receives Lifetime Ban, Racism in the FGC/USA, and Other Prevalent Social Discussions

ItsYaBoi

Noob
And here is 'free speech' advocate JK Rowling threatening legal action to a children's news website because they criticised her comments on trans people, ultimately forcing them to apologise and pay an unsubstantiated sum of money - https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/jul/23/childrens-news-website-apologises-jk-rowling-trans-tweet-day

Another hypocrite exposed, and further proof that many of the free speech advocates want to just say harmful shit and get away with it with ZERO repercussions, even if those repercussions involves somebody else exercising their free speech in order to criticise them.

Filthy fucking TERF. Free speech advocates ITT, where you at?
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

(NOTHING)
Premium Supporter
So I'm a radical liberal Ideologue whose responses aren't worth dignifying, but David Rubin is a classical liberal worth taking seriously?

Nah. Someone's screwing with me here.
 

ItsYaBoi

Noob
So I'm a radical liberal Ideologue whose responses aren't worth dignifying, but David Rubin is a classical liberal worth taking seriously?

Nah. Someone's screwing with me here.
I love the stance that people like him take "I'm actually moderate, not conservative". Yet as Crimson said, he is incessantly defending conservatives and shitting on the left at EVERY, AVAILABLE, OPPORTUNITY in this thread.

Just screams of "I'm right wing but too cowardly to admit it". Change my mind.
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

(NOTHING)
Premium Supporter
I love the stance that people like him take "I'm actually moderate, not conservative". Yet as Crimson said, he is incessantly defending conservatives and shitting on the left at EVERY, AVAILABLE, OPPORTUNITY in this thread.

Just screams of "I'm right wing but too cowardly to admit it". Change my mind.
I hate to bring the ducks back into this, but this is becoming a very "if it looks, talks, quacks" scenario.
They don't want to see Angelman win the fight over Baltimore, B. People wouldn't be able to stand for it. But no one's outshot me yet. I keep waiting to be proven wrong, or taken down, or set straight, I tried every approach from gentlemanly and decent to borderline furious...I hear crickets. But I'm the cringe guy, I'm the radical guy, I'm this and I'm that and I'm not worth taking seriously...nah. I'm right. I've been right for a month. I'll defend my points to the death because I'm not afraid of being challenged and I know I'm on the right side of history and have been for the 20+ years I've been keeping up with these subjects. And I'd love for someone to try and analyze me and take a guess as to what my actual beliefs and standards and so forth are, since apparently believing in things being made more equal is all it takes to qualify as a radical.

Also, sidenote: cheers to the 7,000+ QAnon morons who were purged from Twitter yesterday. Of all the inside out conspiracies ever made for the sake of whitewashing the dirt under the grass of America and the rest of the world, I hesitate to think of one I've ever heard in the same level of absolute idiocy as the Q people believe.

Anyway, have a lovely day, everyone. Even you, Trump people. Maybe some sunshine and human decency will snap you out of your hypnosis.
#VoteAngelman
 

NHDR

Noob
So, question... I've been lurking a lot in this thread because I don't follow American politics in-depth, but I find it interesting to read everyone's thoughts.

With that said, one thing I'd like to understand is why someone who is "Conservative/Republican/Right" is immediately labeled as a racist (or isn't, if that's the case?). Is it not possible to agree with certain economic policies the Republicans may have but still disagree with any racism?

Case in point, one of my good friends is from Jamaica and a huge Trump supporter. Does that mean he's racist against himself?

I'm not arguing for anything, I just wanted to understand. Because this is the impression I have after reading so many forums, social media posts, and news articles.
 

Marlow

Premium
Premium Supporter
With that said, one thing I'd like to understand is why someone who is "Conservative/Republican/Right" is immediately labeled as a racist (or isn't, if that's the case?). Is it not possible to agree with certain economic policies the Republicans may have but still disagree with any racism?
I wouldn't say "everyone who is conservative is labeled a racist". It might seem like that sometimes, but that's not the reality.

I'd suggest reading up on the Republican Southern Strategy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_strategy

Essentially there are accusations that Republicans used coded language and policies to try and appeal to white voters. That's likely where a lot of the skepticism comes from. A lot of places in the country where racism has been very bad also happened to be very large Republican strongholds.

Case in point, one of my good friends is from Jamaica and a huge Trump supporter. Does that mean he's racist against himself?
Probably not. But President Trump has a history of racist practices. He and his father got in trouble in the past for racial discrimination in their housing and real estate projects. He's made a ton of racially insensitive comments over the years, and has routinely displayed a casual attitude of racism. So in a way, if you're supporting him and his agenda, are you not also supporting his values?
 

666 I HazeOner

When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.
Probably not. But President Trump has a history of racist practices. He and his father got in trouble in the past for racial discrimination in their housing and real estate projects. He's made a ton of racially insensitive comments over the years, and has routinely displayed a casual attitude of racism. So in a way, if you're supporting him and his agenda, are you not also supporting his values?
Which presidential candidate do you guys support, especially the BLM supporters?
Hope it's not Biden as his Crime Bill lead to the great American mass incarceration and his role as drug czar didn't help the world either.

I hope both left and right leaning start voting independent instead of the 2 main parties that started all of this shit. And especially BLM supporters should not vote blue, they haven't done anything for you and probably won't do anything after you vote for them.

I thought this vid was interesting too btw, seems that in these days you can better listen to comics than the media, lol.
 

Obly

Ambiguous world creator
With that said, one thing I'd like to understand is why someone who is "Conservative/Republican/Right" is immediately labeled as a racist (or isn't, if that's the case?). Is it not possible to agree with certain economic policies the Republicans may have but still disagree with any racism?

Case in point, one of my good friends is from Jamaica and a huge Trump supporter. Does that mean he's racist against himself?
It's one of those Venn diagram situations: Not every Conservative/Republican/Right-winger is a racist, but probably darn close to all racists are politically Conservative/Republican/Right-leaning. I agree people shouldn't make assumptions, but the two value systems have definitely become more in lockstep over time.

I don't think it's because conservative doctrine is, in and of itself (at least boiled down to its philosophical essence), racist. It's mostly because a few decades ago, the Republican party saw an opportunity for political gain and made a conscious decision to court the support of whites who felt threatened by the legal and cultural movement to empower people of color in the U.S.. And of course a lot of that animosity specifically had to do with fear that empowering people of color was a threat to white economic livelihood.

So it's not that conservatism is racism. But racism and economic beliefs have really begun to go hand-in-hand, and the Republican party went out of its way to stoke that fear and anger, and thereby made itself a comfortable home for the country's racists. There's a good historical overview piece on FiveThirtyEight: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-republican-choice/.

As for your friend, well, people can choose to support a particular political figure for a variety of reasons. I'd assume your friend doesn't hate his own race (I'm assuming he's Black), but it does make you curious what he sees in Trump that's so compelling that he's willing to ignore Trump's blatant white supremacist rhetoric and policy.
 

ItsYaBoi

Noob
Which presidential candidate do you guys support, especially the BLM supporters?
Hope it's not Biden as his Crime Bill lead to the great American mass incarceration and his role as drug czar didn't help the world either.

I hope both left and right leaning start voting independent instead of the 2 main parties that started all of this shit. And especially BLM supporters should not vote blue, they haven't done anything for you and probably won't do anything after you vote for them.

I thought this vid was interesting too btw, seems that in these days you can better listen to comics than the media, lol.
I'd say the priority right now for the US is getting Trump out, because no matter what people say about Biden (and there is a LOT to say) he is nowhere near as bad as Trump and his presidency would not be anywhere near as destructive as these last 4 years. Voting independent in important swing states is basically voting for Trump.

It is a shame that the dems didn't choose somebody better, but it is what it is. Biden is much more open to change than Trump ever would be (see his stance on LGBTQ issues in recent years, in which he has been a good ally considering some of the comments/stances that he had early on in his career).
 

ItsYaBoi

Noob
It's one of those Venn diagram situations: Not every Conservative/Republican/Right-winger is a racist, but probably darn close to all racists are politically Conservative/Republican/Right-leaning. I agree people shouldn't make assumptions, but the two value systems have definitely become more in lockstep over time.

I don't think it's because conservative doctrine is, in and of itself (at least boiled down to its philosophical essence), racist. It's mostly because a few decades ago, the Republican party saw an opportunity for political gain and made a conscious decision to court the support of whites who felt threatened by the legal and cultural movement to empower people of color in the U.S.. And of course a lot of that animosity specifically had to do with fear that empowering people of color was a threat to white economic livelihood.

So it's not that conservatism is racism. But racism and economic beliefs have really begun to go hand-in-hand, and the Republican party went out of its way to stoke that fear and anger, and thereby made itself a comfortable home for the country's racists. There's a good historical overview piece on FiveThirtyEight: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-republican-choice/.

As for your friend, well, people can choose to support a particular political figure for a variety of reasons. I'd assume your friend doesn't hate his own race (I'm assuming he's Black), but it does make you curious what he sees in Trump that's so compelling that he's willing to ignore Trump's blatant white supremacist rhetoric and policy.
Regarding the last paragraph, I've seen numerous polls indicating that men tend to lean towards supporting Trump more than Biden. I'm not saying any of this applies to his friend, but there's multiple reasons as to why somebody can support a racist such as Trump without hating their own race. A lot of young males like Trump for the memes and lulz, which is pathetic, but it is what it is. Somehow they've convinced themselves that Trump is anti establishment, despite being the poster child for the estabilishment.

As well as this, Trump is a serial, SERIAL sexual deviant. Biden has his problems, but they are dwarfed by Trump and his rampant misogyny, adultery and history of sexual assault. I wouldn't be surprised if a few men support him because of his attitude towards women, how it aligns with theirs (again, not saying his friend is like this, but it's certainly something that I've encountered online).
 

666 I HazeOner

When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.
@ItsYaBoi & @Marlow

Still have to look into Warren and her policies because I don't know anything about her.

Trump needs to be stopped, that's also my opinion. He is only in the presidential game for the self gain. I couldn't understand that the narcissist got voted in in the first place. But is Biden really an ally when he is one of the reasons why there are so many problems in minority communities in the last 3 decades? He doesn't even want to apologize for his role in all this bs.

It seems like the same story as 2016, you guys are going to have to choose between the plague or cholera.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
So, question... I've been lurking a lot in this thread because I don't follow American politics in-depth, but I find it interesting to read everyone's thoughts.

With that said, one thing I'd like to understand is why someone who is "Conservative/Republican/Right" is immediately labeled as a racist (or isn't, if that's the case?). Is it not possible to agree with certain economic policies the Republicans may have but still disagree with any racism?

Case in point, one of my good friends is from Jamaica and a huge Trump supporter. Does that mean he's racist against himself?

I'm not arguing for anything, I just wanted to understand. Because this is the impression I have after reading so many forums, social media posts, and news articles.
It’s not really that they’re racists — but since there are only two parties, the racists have to go somewhere; and unfortunately, the so-called ‘right’ is where they go these days to feel comfortable.

Anyone who is racist, xenophobic, or sexist knows that the Republican party will welcome them with open arms. It didn’t use to be this way, but now it’s a near-epidemic. You can take our President for starters, but it extends all the way down to regular-old small town America. All those people flying confederate flags and telling immigrants to get out of our country? Guess which ‘side’ they’re aligned with.

And so the issue is that the party itself does absolutely nothing to push back against these things, because they need the votes. And this is why, to me, this notion of dividing everything into two artificial categories is absolute nonsense.

When people say ‘conservative’ in the US what they really mean is ‘Republican’. The party that accepts statements like telling four minority congresswomen to ‘go back to their countries’ without any sort of argument, shame, or reprimand. The party that supported banning people from predominantly Muslim countries except for the one that vaporized 3000 Americans in a single day in 2001. And the party that embraces a FOX news network that amplifies these kinds of racist and xenophobic messages to their fullest degree, and the party that is endorsed wholesale by white supremacists without any sort of pushback.

So yes — theoretically you can be ‘conservative’ without being a Republican, and embrace views from all ‘sides’ in a fair and objective way, while fighting for the rights of marginalized people. But that’s not what ‘conservative’ has come to mean in this country, and that’s why I’m tired of this notion of people trying to divide 400 million people up into strictly ‘conservative’ or ‘liberal’, align all of their talking points with the two major parties and the news/pundit networks, and make everything, even the simplest of humanitarian, environmental, and social causes into something political.

It needs to end. All it does is feed the moneymaking machine that keeps our society polarized — for the sake of entertainment, campaign contributions and advertising revenue. And meanwhile, the people who need our help the most keep suffering.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
I'll give another example -- I support balancing our federal budget. Categorically, that makes me a fiscal conservative. The Republican party in recent history has traditionally claimed the mantra of being fiscally conservative, but when the party switched over to endless spending and propagating the balooning of the US budget deficit, the 'conservatives' went with them and have nothing bad to say about Republican economic policy.

If you support cutting funding for public radio ($65 million a year) but increasing spending on the bloated US military ($680 billion a year), you are not a conservative. You are a Republican.

Likewise, if you're a legal conservative, you probably support the constitution and the passage of important changes using the two houses of Congress via consensus. However, the same people who criticized Obama for passing certain executive orders (like DACA), and criticized the ACA for supposedly being on questionable legal grounds, are now cosigning Trump's unprecedented use and abuse of executive orders (which are regularly struck down by the nation's highest courts) wholesale. This makes no sense.

To me, it's extremely disingenuous. These people aren't 'conservatives' at all -- they vote for anything and anyone that this party put on the table, whether it's actually 'conservative' policy or not.

Hopefully that brings some context and helps you understand why this forced alignment to 'liberal' vs. 'conservative' is actually nonsense, when it comes to solving real issues in the US.
 

Obly

Ambiguous world creator
Which presidential candidate do you guys support, especially the BLM supporters?
Hope it's not Biden as his Crime Bill lead to the great American mass incarceration and his role as drug czar didn't help the world either.

I hope both left and right leaning start voting independent instead of the 2 main parties that started all of this shit. And especially BLM supporters should not vote blue, they haven't done anything for you and probably won't do anything after you vote for them.
Well look, as others have said, the Trump presidency represents a darn near existential threat to the "American experiment": rule of law, social justice, the economy, and public health are crumbling around us. It's time for pragmatism to take priority over ideology. You think the Lincoln Project supports everything about Joe Biden? Of course not, but... they get it--what good would it do to keep your own party in power if it destroys the country as a consequence?

I doubt many people are truly excited about Joe Biden; he's about as moderate a Democrat as they come, and has his own list of personal and political flaws and failings to answer for. But he's a good pragmatic choice for drawing support back from that large segment of the 2016 electorate who only voted for Trump out of a stronger dislike for Hillary Clinton.

Also, Biden has publicly committed to selecting a woman as his VP running mate. It's well-known that his short list includes several women of color and solid progressives. If they're elected, that person will be the most logical person for the next Democratic presidential nominee when Biden's term is finished. It's hard to ask people to put aside their ideals, but sometimes you have to play the long game.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
So if these people aren't fiscally conservative (supporting the shrinking of Govt. spending and balancing of the budget) and they aren't legally conservative (supporting the tenets of the Constitution, the sanctity of law, and the democratic decision-making authority of Congress) and they are backing a fairly radical President, then what are they?

Well, the last remaining tenet is being "socially conservative", which lately means 'borderline racist'. It means that you take the talking points that have been used to marginalize slaves, freed African-Americans, immigrants, and other minority groups in this country for decades, remove all the history and the context, and try to package them into something masquerading as 'thoughtful', while remaining ideologically aligned with the very same people who started those beliefs in the first place.

And that is the silliness we're dealing with right now. It's why the president of our nation can hop on Twitter and say "When the looting begins, the shooting begins", a tagline taken from a segregationist and a racist police chief from the 1960s civil rights era, and only one 'side' of the political divide points out how dangerous this is. Actual racism is allowed to reach the highest office in the country, without political repercussion from the party in power, under the the guise of 'free speech'. And someone who's against this is immediately branded a 'liberal' even though they may be fiscally conservative, legally conservative, etc.

It's a huge farce, and it threatens the very fabric of our nation.

This is why I hate current political debate.. Because people aren't even standing for the very principles they claim to represent. All this 'liberal' and 'conservative' foolishness is actually anything but. It's just a distraction from the true issues at hand.
 

Marinjuana

Up rock incoming, ETA 5 minutes
And here is 'free speech' advocate JK Rowling threatening legal action to a children's news website because they criticised her comments on trans people, ultimately forcing them to apologise and pay an unsubstantiated sum of money - https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/jul/23/childrens-news-website-apologises-jk-rowling-trans-tweet-day

Another hypocrite exposed, and further proof that many of the free speech advocates want to just say harmful shit and get away with it with ZERO repercussions, even if those repercussions involves somebody else exercising their free speech in order to criticise them.

Filthy fucking TERF. Free speech advocates ITT, where you at?
Your inability to see the issue outside of the context of JK Rowling's opinions is your issue, not free speech "advocates". (As if being pro free speech is some controversial policy to advocate for.)
 

ItsYaBoi

Noob
Your inability to see the issue outside of the context of JK Rowling's opinions is your issue, not free speech "advocates". (As if being pro free speech is some controversial policy to advocate for.)
Well done on saying a whole lot of nothing. Here is the timeline of events:

- JK Rowling makes transphobic comment (and they are transphobic, you’ve got many trans people saying so)

- Children news website says her comments are harmful to trans people

- She threatens legal action against them thus forcing them to apologise and pay her an unsubstantiated amount of money - essentially stifling their free speech.

All whilst this is going on she signs a letter advocating free speech. Do you understand?
 

M2Dave

Zoning Master
Royal Contributor
With that said, one thing I'd like to understand is why someone who is "Conservative/Republican/Right" is immediately labeled as a racist (or isn't, if that's the case?). Is it not possible to agree with certain economic policies the Republicans may have but still disagree with any racism?
No, because anybody who proposes solutions that diverge from the liberal perspective is spreading "racist propaganda", of which you have seen a plethora of accusations in this thread.

While the Republican party has most certainly engaged in white identity politics in recent history, a large fragment of contemporary racial tensions in America can be solely attributed to some white liberals, who are obsessed with and fixated on race beyond comprehension. One can observe evidence in Robin DiAngelo's bestselling book "White Fragility", which dictates to black people by what they should be offended and to what extent, and in protests, in which some white people yell at black police officers implying that they "sold out". The tone is inconceivably supercilious and patronizing. Former police officer Brandon Tatum recounts the following story below.

 

ItsYaBoi

Noob
No, because anybody who proposes solutions that diverge from the liberal perspective is spreading "racist propaganda", of which you have seen a plethora of accusations in this thread.

While the Republican party has most certainly engaged in white identity politics in recent history, a large fragment of contemporary racial tensions in America can be solely attributed to some white liberals, who are obsessed with and fixated on race beyond comprehension. One can observe evidence in Robin DiAngelo's bestselling book "White Fragility", which dictates to black people by what they should be offended and to what extent, and in protests, in which some white people yell at black police officers implying that they "sold out". The tone is inconceivably supercilious and patronizing. Former police officer Brandon Tatum recounts the following story below.

Stay clowning. Still not feel like addressing the multiple posts directed at you? There’s that ‘moderate’ spirit lmfao
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
You have been well-reserved in this thread, but after having observed various political discussions on TYM throughout the years, you tend to lean to the left in my opinion. I think your perspective on religion is somewhat extreme, but I may be biased because I was raised in a Roman Catholic household. For the record, I am religious in the cultural sense. Government itself must be secular, of course. I respect that you contemplate voting for the libertarian candidate in this election, which demonstrates that you are nonpartisan and open-minded. I agree with Sub that you are more of a classical liberal. David Rubin and Coleman Hughes are classical liberals, and I agree with almost everything they say.
I don’t think my views on religion are extreme at all. I think everyone has the right to believe in whatever they want to. As long as there’s a separation of church and state, your beliefs are your beliefs. We don’t have to get into it here, but which views do you think are extreme? Also, I grew up in a very Christian household. Everyone in my family is Christian, all my friends, peers, teachers, etc, were ALL Christians growing up.

Anyway, aside from that, the funny thing is, up until recently, I actually didn’t even lean left. When I first started paying attention to politics, I considered myself firmly liberal. A lot of insane lefties pushed me to the middle right. I realized the right was also insane, so got pushed back to the middle. Until recently, I was firmly in the “middle”. But only because after all of this happened and I landed in the middle as I guess a “moderate”, a lot of shit has happened in my life that I had to focus on. Such as my father getting diagnosed with stage 4 kidney disease and leukemia within a week from each other. So that took priority and still does. Wasn’t really until Covid did I have a little more time to start paying attention again. And I quickly started leaning more left due to certain left leaning influential people making so many more better arguments on different issues than the right. But, I don’t want to take a deep dive into all of this. I definitely could, and technically did, lol. I had a very long post, much longer than this, typed out explaining my entire political history. Mainly WHY I went from the left to the middle/middle right. Then WHY I went from that to straight middle. Then WHY I went from that to far more left leaning than right. I will quickly say, the internet is both great and also absolutely horrible. The internet has basically all the info you ever need, but also, algorithms exist that kind force you into echo chambers even if you didn’t intend to be in one.

But anyway

TLDR: Started out on the left. Was pushed to the middle/middle right. Then was pushed to the middle. And recently, I lean far more to the left than the right (even though I live in a conservative state where A LOT of my friends and family are conservatives). I am always willing to hear arguments from anyone though.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
TLDR: Started out on the left. Was pushed to the middle/middle right. Then was pushed to the middle. And recently, I lean far more to the left than the right (even though I live in a conservative state where A LOT of my friends and family are conservatives). I am always willing to hear arguments from anyone though.
Are they actually conservatives though? Or just Republicans calling themselves conservatives.
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

(NOTHING)
Premium Supporter
No, because anybody who proposes solutions that diverge from the liberal perspective is spreading "racist propaganda", of which you have seen a plethora of accusations in this thread.

While the Republican party has most certainly engaged in white identity politics in recent history, a large fragment of contemporary racial tensions in America can be solely attributed to some white liberals, who are obsessed with and fixated on race beyond comprehension. One can observe evidence in Robin DiAngelo's bestselling book "White Fragility", which dictates to black people by what they should be offended and to what extent, and in protests, in which some white people yell at black police officers implying that they "sold out". The tone is inconceivably supercilious and patronizing. Former police officer Brandon Tatum recounts the following story below.

Stiiiiiiiiiiill doing exactly what @CrimsonShadow is talking about and what I pointed out before and throwing Liberal on top of everything to bunch all the "dissenting" opinions together under one convenient slanderable name.

As long as there's an enemy to argue against, there's something to distract from the real discussion that needs to be had.
Tactic as old as time.