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Erron Black General Discussion Thread

babalook

Apprentice
Not sure if this is known, but F32 LnL 2 is a true block string and Lnl D1 appears to be unavoidable (can't jump and too far away for quick pokes, including his ridiculous D4). This isn't the most useful thing in the world since it's unsafe but it's something you can use if they're mashing or backstepping after F32. Works with B2U4 as well.
 
I'm trying to figure out what to do with the b2,u4 string.orher than the corner setup that was displayed. I'm trying to experiment with the df3 poke but I think d4 is just too good not to abuse.
 

babalook

Apprentice
I'm starting to think the reason they went the preset route is because 80% of the moves just aren't viable. First off, I am by no means calling Erron bad, but without enhanced LnL and Scud Shot, he might be.

TNT is abysmal, F32 on hit into TNT is punishable by anyone with a long-range move, projectile, or teleport, even Erron himself can punish it on hit with slide or boot drop for free. You could probably save yourself from long range moves with the amplified version but that leads to nothing. Also, even if you do manage to hit someone with it, and not yourself with them, the payoff is pretty low especially considering that at longer ranges you'll be lucky to get a boot drop or slide at best.

The command grab is pretty meh, tick throws off of F3, D1, and D3 (not B222 or 21212 which is where it would matter most), but the way it positions the opponent doesn't synergize with his acid game or corner pressure at all.

Netherbest Trap is alright in matchups where you don't lose the zoning game but long range isn't really where Erron accels. You can't really throw them into it either unless you have the CG, but that combination comes with the heavy price of losing basically all of your combos from enhanced LnL and the safety Scud Shot affords B222 and the -1ish it gives to F32/B2U3.

Outworld gunslinger is, again, pretty meh. B122/F212/B2U4 222/32 are all decent but none of them really compare to B222/F32/21212/D4 and they don't alter his combos as far as I know (since B2U4 doesn't connect in combos outside of 21212 KB). F21 might have had some interesting applications being a cancelable projectile but that got removed (F21 into LnL might have offered some decent mixups).

Acid Pour is just a less damaging ender than slide with worse KND advantage and no DOT.

Up Peacemaker has a very limited hitbox and you can only use it in combos in the corner, but it doesn't allow for any followups or better damage.

Down Peacemaker is actually a pretty solid move (safe and fast); If customs were allowed I'd swap Outworld Gunslinger with this.

Enhanced Rattle Snake Slide is decent-ish. It can be used to make B222 -7 and F32 -1 which isn't bad, but at the cost of a defensive bar (for roughly the same results you get meterlessly from Scud Shot) this just isn't worth it. The F4 cancel is basically just a very fast and long forward dash but still, the cost just isn't worth it to me.

I think I can tell how these moves were meant to function, but most of them fall very short and this appears to be true for a fair chunk of the cast if not all of them. While I'm whinging, I'd just like to say that I have a feeling Scud Shot cancels are going to get nerfed, not because they're broken, but I doubt that making B222, F32, and B2U4 safer was an intended utility.
 

M2Dave

Zoning Master
I seen SonicFox do B222 > BF4 > 2
I haven't hit it once, am I missing something?
Canceling the last hit of b+2,2,2 has been challenging for me too. I cannot explain the timing at all so any help is appreciated. I do know that you have to perform the whole string in order for the second hit to come out. In this regard, b+2,2,2 is similar to 2,1,2,1,2.

But yes you can do b+2,2,2 xx b,f+4, 2, f+3,2 xx slide or acid.
 

babalook

Apprentice
If you press all three 2's as fast as you can (before the first hit finishes) and you don't press 2 any more than three times, canceling the move becomes very very simple.
 

magandi

Apprentice
yay i can do his 21212xxrifle d3 combo now. it was easier than i thought. its important to input 21212 clean. i recommend to practise this first. the actuall cancel is easy.

If you press all three 2's as fast as you can (before the first hit finishes) and you don't press 2 any more than three times, canceling the move becomes very very simple.
canceling the second hit of b222 is easy but the third one is hard. i can do it in the corner sometimes. is it even possible outside of corner?
 
yay i can do his 21212xxrifle d3 combo now. it was easier than i thought. its important to input 21212 clean. i recommend to practise this first. the actuall cancel is easy.


canceling the second hit of b222 is easy but the third one is hard. i can do it in the corner sometimes. is it even possible outside of corner?

21212xxrifle d3 is friggen hard man, idk how any can do it. it never comes out as a combo for me after the d3
 

M2Dave

Zoning Master
After b2222 cancel bf4 up 2, Ive given up trying to link to the down 1 into f32 slide. I just go straight to the f23 now
I'm not even sure that combo works because the last hit of b+2,2,2 already juggles so the gravity keeps them lower to the ground. Just stick to f+3,2.

I think f+3,2 is the best option after a flawless block too.

I know 2,1,2,1,2 xx b,f+4, d+3, d+1, f+3,2 xx slide works consistently.
 

lionheart21

Its Game Over, Man
I'm not even sure that combo works because the last hit of b+2,2,2 already juggles so the gravity keeps them lower to the ground. Just stick to f+3,2.

I think f+3,2 is the best option after a flawless block too.

I know 2,1,2,1,2 xx b,f+4, d+3, d+1, f+3,2 xx slide works consistently.
Is this midscreen or corner?
 

babalook

Apprentice
I keep forgetting to test this and I'm not home atm, but I'm pretty sure Shao Kahn's spear beats Scud Shot.
 

jakehk

Noob
is 52 kard his best possible loadout or is it better to trade scud shot for something like command grab or acid pour or down shot when youre not facing zoners?
 
Are we gonna get a Bnb thread for this man?
My main one is:
21212xxbf4,d3,u2,u2,21212
Timing is awkward for ending the juggle in 21212, I’ve yet to be able to connect f32 after the last u2, but that’s probably because I’m still a noob after all these years