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Question - Necromancer Does Necromancer Need to be Further Balanced?

loogie

loogie

Noob
IlALXlI said:
I have been thinking lately, does Necromancer need to have anymore adjustments made to him? If his DB+1 was cancel-able, it would surely give Necromancer the ability to pressure his opponents. Playing with Necromancer recently though he seems pretty solid, just get some hate for zoning the opponent. Additionally, it would greatly help his counter zoning game by decreasing the Start-Up and Recovery frames on his Amulet Strike (this would also be affecting Impostor though, which seems like the most balanced variation).
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He's meant to be a keep away character, I don't see how a cancellable db1 would fit in his play style and what would be his options afterwards? he already can get a +frame blockstring off of an ex hellspark. With your proposed change, you would turn necromancer into more of an upclose pressure character and he doesn't have the right toolset for it.
if any adjustments are to be made, a better tracking on bf2 would suffice and maybe a little damage buff on his ex grab
 
ArmedCalf

ArmedCalf

I guess I play Necromancer now.. PSN: ArmedCalf
Fix flick and it's okay. I'm telling ya, yes it's a pretty horrible variation for zoning, but ending combos in df4 is niiiiiiiiice. Most people will get hit with a raw db1 right after, and it sets up a nice opportunity for a mix-up. I get why a lot of people say this variation is bad because you probably are supposed to use it as a zoning variation, but this variation does fine if you ask me.
 
STB Damashi

STB Damashi

SmallBurntEarths
loogie said:
He's meant to be a keep away character, I don't see how a cancellable db1 would fit in his play style and what would be his options afterwards? he already can get a +frame blockstring off of an ex hellspark. With your proposed change, you would turn necromancer into more of an upclose pressure character and he doesn't have the right toolset for it.
if any adjustments are to be made, a better tracking on bf2 would suffice and maybe a little damage buff on his ex grab
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Oh no, I mean cancel it from a distance in order to trick the opponent into either running in and you can punish, or simply have the constant threat on their mind.
 
XxSYNDROISxX

XxSYNDROISxX

For the Shokan since Mk3
IlALXlI said:
I have been thinking lately, does Necromancer need to have anymore adjustments made to him? If his DB+1 was cancel-able, it would surely give Necromancer the ability to pressure his opponents. Playing with Necromancer recently though he seems pretty solid, just get some hate for zoning the opponent. Additionally, it would greatly help his counter zoning game by decreasing the Start-Up and Recovery frames on his Amulet Strike (this would also be affecting Impostor though, which seems like the most balanced variation).

Edit: I mean cancel-able from a distance, in order to trick the opponent into thinking you will use DB+1, and then have them run in or delay wake-up, which you can react to appropriately.
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Yes the skeleton hands need to be removed and replaced with a skull helmet
 
ArmedCalf

ArmedCalf

I guess I play Necromancer now.. PSN: ArmedCalf
Okay so I've been using this character for a while and I love Necromancer. The zoning tools combined with Hell Sparks make for an interesting keep away game and the unblockable hand is always nice to throw out - especially with @KHAOTIC True Grave 's setup (see his thread if you don't know, gotta give credit where it's due). The only thing in my head: should they remove the tracking from flick and make it so that the player chooses where on screen it will appear?
 
Youphemism

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
ArmedCalf said:
Okay so I've been using this character for a while and I love Necromancer. The zoning tools combined with Hell Sparks make for an interesting keep away game and the unblockable hand is always nice to throw out - especially with @KHAOTIC True Grave 's setup (see his thread if you don't know, gotta give credit where it's due). The only thing in my head: should they remove the tracking from flick and make it so that the player chooses where on screen it will appear?
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Man I wish Necro was as good as you're making it sound lol. I just wish Flick was faster so it's actually more useful in zoning wars and the tracking issues wouldn't be as much of a problem. You'd probably also be able to make things safer by ending your strings in Flick which would be great because a lot of his strings are unsafe as it is, he'd build meter which he needs for combos and it'd give his up close game a new interesting element. Even then you still have DF4 being super minus on block (why?!) which if you try and zone with gives them a whole 30 frames to advance if you do DF4 into another DF4 to catch runs. Unfortunately noone decent that I've played ever gets hit by hand because they just roll everything :(
 
thlityoursloat

thlityoursloat

kick kick
NRS really do seem to have this thing against dedicated zoners having good mid-hitting zoning tools, lol.
How about they just make it high and track much better?
 
ArmedCalf

ArmedCalf

I guess I play Necromancer now.. PSN: ArmedCalf
Youphemism said:
Man I wish Necro was as good as you're making it sound lol. I just wish Flick was faster so it's actually more useful in zoning wars and the tracking issues wouldn't be as much of a problem. You'd probably also be able to make things safer by ending your strings in Flick which would be great because a lot of his strings are unsafe as it is, he'd build meter which he needs for combos and it'd give his up close game a new interesting element. Even then you still have DF4 being super minus on block (why?!) which if you try and zone with gives them a whole 30 frames to advance if you do DF4 into another DF4 to catch runs. Unfortunately noone decent that I've played ever gets hit by hand because they just roll everything :(
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I play off of the oki game. I try to end everything in df4 and then I approach while they're on the ground and go for a mix-up. Or, honestly, I hit them with df4 and throw out the hand as they slump to the ground. 9/10 times this will work the first time you do it
 
Youphemism

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
ArmedCalf said:
I play off of the oki game. I try to end everything in df4 and then I approach while they're on the ground and go for a mix-up. Or, honestly, I hit them with df4 and throw out the hand as they slump to the ground. 9/10 times this will work the first time you do it
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I end everything in 4~DF4 as well since it's optimal and leaves you with good positioning but it doesn't make his zoning any better :( People let you get away with 58 frame hands?!
 
smile

smile

Noob
Youphemism said:
You'd probably also be able to make things safer by ending your strings in Flick which would be great because a lot of his strings are unsafe as it is, he'd build meter which he needs for combos and it'd give his up close game a new interesting element.
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that's what i did with pre-patch necro. -3 flick never forget
 
ArmedCalf

ArmedCalf

I guess I play Necromancer now.. PSN: ArmedCalf
Youphemism said:
I end everything in 4~DF4 as well since it's optimal and leaves you with good positioning but it doesn't make his zoning any better :( People let you get away with 58 frame hands?!
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I land 2-4 squishes a match
 
RM slacked

RM slacked

Shinnok trash from Canada.
This character needs his flick startup lessened along with the squash then he's easily the second best shinnok variation.
 
ArmedCalf

ArmedCalf

I guess I play Necromancer now.. PSN: ArmedCalf
Youphemism said:
Lol it was -4 and I explained nothing cancelled into Flick was safe because everything had a gap :p

WHA?! Dude you need to tell your opponents to tech roll lol.
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They can't that's what I'm saying! Say you land a df4 full screen - a pro will usually block in case you throw out another zoning tool. That's when you hit them with the first squish! Then if you use any sort of set-up in order to throw out the ex squish, that's 2. Then I mean you can throw them out after any ol df4. If they start running on wake-up then you keep hitting them with df4 or Hell Sparks. It's a full screen mind game man it's so good:p

Also when I say they can't tech, I mean that df4 doesn't allow it
 
smile

smile

Noob
Youphemism said:
Lol it was -4 and I explained nothing cancelled into Flick was safe because everything had a gap :p

WHA?! Dude you need to tell your opponents to tech roll lol.
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112 is -7, f22 is -8, f4 is -7 if you were playing against say a cassie or a lao you're screwed either way. for other characters you could, like, not cancel into flick.
 
Rude

Rude

You will serve me in The Netherrealm
I think doing close, mid, and far Flicks would fix your tracking problem. At least enough that characters wouldn't be running through your zoning.

I'm still super serious about Summon Fiend as a grab. Make it duckable, backdashable, armorable, and vulnerable to jumps and it would be balanced.

Plus these escape options open up your other projectiles more.

Make it happen, NRS.
 
The_Tile

The_Tile

Your hole is mine!
Rude said:
Why would it be OP?

Like any grab, you could armor it, backdash it, jump it, etc.

Close, Mid, and Far flicks would cover specific regions of the screen and allow for more consistency in hitting the target.

It would just require a read to use.

Especially if you can interrupt strings canceled into Summon Fiend, making it a grab would improve his mix up ability, while making those mix ups escapable.
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Full screen command grabs? Hell no.
 
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