Cassie Cage General Discussion Thread

[Hor_PeT]

According to the patch notes the nutkick hit region fixed. That means to me that nut kick ender is easier to do.

The video proof about restand is not clear to me. It looks like before.
The videos about characters where restand never was in issue.

Please test it with Erron, Kitana, Sonya where poke was available.
I may do it later but nowadays I play less Mk. But curious.

EDIT: I just tested it with Erron Black. He still can D3 out of F4.
Maybe this time it is a bit more difficult... Character looks closer after BnB... So might be better than before Idk for sure.
So I think that part is not really changed. But I do not have experience just this practice room.

 

[OfficialCasti]

No the nutkick hitbox region is still the same. The thing that changed is the hurtbox region during active frames. This means that when she uses the move as a kounter she is more likely to get hit.

For example before the patch you could duck sonya first ring and nutkick kounter on the second hit making it whiff. Now she can still kounter but Cassie gets hit by the ring.

EDIT: the patchnote is not clear about this. For sure the hurtbox is larger now but maybe they increased the hitbox too. Did anyone notice nutkick connecting where it previously didn't?

 

[Hor_PeT]

No the nutkick hitbox region is still the same. The thing that changed is the hurtbox region during active frames. This means that when she uses the move as a kounter she is more likely to get hit.

For example before the patch you could duck sonya first ring and nutkick kounter on the second hit making it whiff. Now she can still kounter but Cassie gets hit by the ring.

EDIT: the patchnote is not clear about this. For sure the hurtbox is larger now but maybe they increased the hitbox too. Did anyone notice nutkick connecting where it previously didn't?

Thanks for the clarification.

Oh that sux. And what about Geras's F212? May need to check it.
As they eliminated Johnny's whiff on F212 I would not be surprised for that either.

Not critical things but that tiny pieces can be escalated in a match up.

Btw Geras's new KB requirement gives him an 50/50 KB on 112, 11xxsand trap I just realized yesterday lol. It can be strong in certain situations.

 

[lordlosh]

After the patch, SonicFox streamed 2 time and he was using Jax Briggs and simply annihilate Dragon, Semij and Kombat. It`s obvious too early to say if he is going to switch, but he obviously give it a try.

 

[OfficialCasti]

Btw Geras's new KB requirement gives him an 50/50 KB on 112, 11xxsand trap I just realized yesterday lol. It can be strong in certain situations.

yeah it's a 50/50 but you can fuzzy block because of a few frame difference in start up (if you are good at blocking and not like me who just release block middle combo...)

 

[JDE]

According to the patch notes the nutkick hit region fixed. That means to me that nut kick ender is easier to do.

The video proof about restand is not clear to me. It looks like before.
The videos about characters where restand never was in issue.

Please test it with Erron, Kitana, Sonya where poke was available.
I may do it later but nowadays I play less Mk. But curious.

EDIT: I just tested it with Erron Black. He still can D3 out of F4.
Maybe this time it is a bit more difficult... Character looks closer after BnB... So might be better than before Idk for sure.
So I think that part is not really changed. But I do not have experience just this practice room.

I tested it on 6 frame normals in the video & jump ins. I’ll test this again later. Before people were jumping out of it. but I couldn’t at all.

 

[sars]

After the patch, SonicFox streamed 2 time and he was using Jax Briggs and simply annihilate Dragon, Semij and Kombat. It`s obvious too early to say if he is going to switch, but he obviously give it a try.

Sonic fox normally switches characters after EVO. I think he gets bored using the same character. I remember in injustice 2 he won 4 tournaments in a row with 4 different characters.

He did say he doesn’t think she top 5 anymore since she lost her safety though.

 

[JDE]

Like I said before, people need to stop letting Sonic Fox validate how good a character is or isn't. He's a strong player so people will jump on the bandwagon with him. That's usually how it is. He's a good guy & I've met him,. Solid player. Even learn from the guy, but it doesn't mean you have to always agree with him. Think for yourself. He was the main one yelling she was dumb. I never really considered him an actual Cassie player to begin with. He usually picks characters that allow him to keep his turn and play somewhat aggressive in either neutral & offense.

 

[OfficialCasti]

This only means that next patch she will be safe from other nerfs. Maybe even get a little buff if we are lucky, like, bring back F4 zero on block. They did take a shot to her neutral this patch tho...

 

[lordlosh]

Im pretty sure they will reverse the hp. The worst thing you can do to balance things out is to add or remove hp. And to do this in FG is even worst.
JDE, dude the hype train about Cassie Cage is OP begin when he pick her. There wasnt a single person who wasn`t yelling that Yaas Queen sucks.
He pick her, everyone start saying how great Yaas Queen is. And most people starting putting Cassie Cage in top tiers.
I remembet the time people starting putting Cassie at the top characters. It was when SonicFox pick her and starting to obliterate every single one with her.
Just watch the hype train with his next character and how fast it will turn that he is OP and top tier.
sars, SonicFox is PRO, he will play what suit him the best. I]m watching him for long time, so i know his history.
Back in MK10 days, no one ever use Kitana and people were saying how crap she was, and suddenly at the biggest stage Pro League Season Finals he obliterate everyone with Kitana and he won 60k.
After that everyone was she is OP.
Same with Erron Black Gunslinger. No other pro ever touch that character, SonicFox simply dominate with him.

And i said it many times that balance should be done at highest level possible, its idiotic to nerf character, because of 1 man success, that doesn[/ICODE]t mean the character is OP and need nerf.
And yeah he already said that she aint top 5. The reason for that are many. I dont think she was top 5 even before.

 

[lionheart21]

Im pretty sure they will reverse the hp. The worst thing you can do to balance things out is to add or remove hp. And to do this in FG is even worst.
JDE, dude the hype train about Cassie Cage is OP begin when he pick her. There wasnt a single person who wasn`t yelling that Yaas Queen sucks.
He pick her, everyone start saying how great Yaas Queen is. And most people starting putting Cassie Cage in top tiers.
I remembet the time people starting putting Cassie at the top characters. It was when SonicFox pick her and starting to obliterate every single one with her.
Just watch the hype train with his next character and how fast it will turn that he is OP and top tier.
sars, SonicFox is PRO, he will play what suit him the best. I]m watching him for long time, so i know his history.
Back in MK10 days, no one ever use Kitana and people were saying how crap she was, and suddenly at the biggest stage Pro League Season Finals he obliterate everyone with Kitana and he won 60k.
After that everyone was she is OP.
Same with Erron Black Gunslinger. No other pro ever touch that character, SonicFox simply dominate with him.

And i said it many times that balance should be done at highest level possible, its idiotic to nerf character, because of 1 man success, that doesn't mean the character is OP and need nerf.
And yeah he already said that she aint top 5. The reason for that are many. I dont think she was top 5 even before.

Yaas Queen was never even a bad variation. It was just seen as the inferior version due to it not having her Low Gunshot.

It started getting the attention that it has now when people realized that her damage is unbreakable in that variation with her AMP Energy Burst.

 

[Hor_PeT]

yeah it's a 50/50 but you can fuzzy block because of a few frame difference in start up (if you are good at blocking and not like me who just release block middle combo...)

Oh I did not realize Geras new frames (did not lab it) - thx for noticing it.
Ii just checked it in the lab.
21F OH vs 17F LOW.

Well it looks like I do not even need to fuzzy guard but can react to the OH now. That's really good news I take my notice asap to that match up.

Thank you!

 

[lionheart21]

Yeah cass is fine. Will have to center more on zoning and whiff punishing since you’re generally going to want to stagger to confirm instead of string into ex glow kick. We’re basically going to be minus more often but that’s fine. Her buttons and her zoning are still incredible. When she does hit you, you’re going into the blender.

I’m fine with her nerfs and still feel she is high/top tier.

I'm fine with that since that's how I've already been playing Cassie as a whiff punisher

 

[Hor_PeT]

I tested it on 6 frame normals in the video & jump ins. I’ll test this again later. Before people were jumping out of it. but I couldn’t at all.

The frame data does not lie. 6F normal will be beaten by 9F normal if it is +4.

The problem is that e.g. Erron Black's D3 (which is 7F) low profiles F4.
So Cassie is in +4 and starts her 9F move.
But Erron Black starts his 7F normal and in the 5th frame (as restand is +4) he is in low profile mode. Cassie's F4 hits faster but whiffs and the "slower" Erron's D3 hits.

Pretty much stupid how I explained it sry lol.

Many pages back we wrote a list about the low profiling characters and moves. The question is if it is changed or not. I think not really.

 

[lionheart21]

@Vslayer sorry for the double post, but here's more proof. I'm actually happy as fuck lmao. She got a tradeoff for the nerf to glow kick for the fix to restand.

 

[Hor_PeT]

I'm fine with that since that's how I've already been playing Cassie as a whiff punisher

Sonicfox used her 111 pretty much during pressure. Insanely much. For autoshimmy in pressure... As it is not safe anymore (especially against certain characters) it is a "no go" move in neutral on high level.

Of course it is not like dropping Scorpion's yolo teleport but against a prepared pro opponent who can punish it all the time (or at least risk reward ratio is bad for Cassie) it is a big luxury to do.

Probably that's why Sonicfox could have said that "she is lost safety".
And do not forget all the other strings into ex glowkick: that moves were already safe but with that move Cassie was in advantageous position for more pressure due to pushback: now it is also gone as after B24, F41 you stay close and lose your turn (if you not risk 3rd move or special). It might be a tiny change but matters a lot on pro level.

Probably she is still very good especially on not that high level - that tiny things might be escalated on Sonicfox level.

 

[lionheart21]

Sonicfox used her 111 pretty much during pressure. Insanely much. For autoshimmy in pressure... As it is not safe anymore (especially against certain characters) it is a "no go" move in neutral on high level.

Of course it is not like dropping Scorpion's yolo teleport but against a prepared pro opponent who can punish it all the time (or at least risk reward ratio is bad for Cassie) it is a big luxury to do.

Probably that's why Sonicfox could have said that "she is lost safety".
And do not forget all the other strings into ex glowkick: that moves were already safe but with that move Cassie was in advantageous position for more pressure due to pushback: now it is also gone as after B24, F41 you stay close and lose your turn (if you not risk 3rd move or special). It might be a tiny change but matters a lot on pro level.

Probably she is still very good especially on not that high level - that tiny things might be escalated on Sonicfox level.

I've already switched off using her 111 in place of 11. Even if its blocked, she's at -2.

 

[Hor_PeT]

Like I said before, people need to stop letting Sonic Fox validate how good a character is or isn't. He's a strong player so people will jump on the bandwagon with him. That's usually how it is. He's a good guy & I've met him,. Solid player. Even learn from the guy, but it doesn't mean you have to always agree with him. Think for yourself. He was the main one yelling she was dumb. I never really considered him an actual Cassie player to begin with. He usually picks characters that allow him to keep his turn and play somewhat aggressive in either neutral & offense.

I highlighted the main part. If Sonicfox like it he will not find it in Cassie anymore I think.
Jax however lol "he is always +7" frame data lies with -7 lol.

I do not like pressure characters so I will not follow Sonicfox. I do not even play Cassie like him - and did not win EVO either lol.

 

[Hor_PeT]

I've already switched off using her 111 in place of 11. Even if its blocked, she's at -2.

Yes but you can not really hitconfirm 11 especially in autoshimmy situation where it was superior.
I do not know if I can even hitconfirm the first hit as the 2 hits are too fast - I did not try it yet. Suspicious...

 

[sars]

I still think she really good. I always thought the glow kick was kind of cheap. I havnt labbed her that much but I feel like she still top tier, just can’t theow out buttons randomly. I always tried to use her as a wiff punish character anyways. I will have to see when I play her but I don’t think her nerfs were that bad.

 

[sars]

I highlighted the main part. If Sonicfox like it he will not find it in Cassie anymore I think.
Jax however lol "he is always +7" frame data lies with -7 lol.

I do not like pressure characters so I will not follow Sonicfox. I do not even play Cassie like him - and did not win EVO either lol.

I hate Jax online lol. He’s way safer than he should be

 

[Hor_PeT]

I still think she really good. I always thought the glow kick was kind of cheap. I havnt labbed her that much but I feel like she still top tier, just can’t theow out buttons randomly. I always tried to use her as a wiff punish character anyways. I will have to see when I play her but I don’t think her nerfs were that bad.

You like using F4 very much too.
Well I just feel F4 stagger pretty bad according to my small experience from few matches. Recovery is too much easy to realize the stagger. But online probably will not be an issue lol.

I could stagger F4 into throw but it was "escape failed" so even online people realized the stagger and pressed button. It might be not a real problem though as Cassie has still options after -3.

Btw I am fine with "new Cassie". I did not use ex. glow kick too much I already stopped my strings on block (except 111). Well probably will not use 111 that much.
People on my level in general are very unpatient and masher - F41 can do the job no need for high level auto shimmy lol.

 

[JDE]

It seems like the character who gets out of the restand is Erron Black. I tested Sonya & him Sonya wasn't able to beat it out guys. Erron's D3 beats it. Strange.

 

[JDE]

Im pretty sure they will reverse the hp. The worst thing you can do to balance things out is to add or remove hp. And to do this in FG is even worst.
JDE, dude the hype train about Cassie Cage is OP begin when he pick her. There wasnt a single person who wasn`t yelling that Yaas Queen sucks.
He pick her, everyone start saying how great Yaas Queen is. And most people starting putting Cassie Cage in top tiers.
I remembet the time people starting putting Cassie at the top characters. It was when SonicFox pick her and starting to obliterate every single one with her.
Just watch the hype train with his next character and how fast it will turn that he is OP and top tier.
sars, SonicFox is PRO, he will play what suit him the best. I]m watching him for long time, so i know his history.
Back in MK10 days, no one ever use Kitana and people were saying how crap she was, and suddenly at the biggest stage Pro League Season Finals he obliterate everyone with Kitana and he won 60k.
After that everyone was she is OP.
Same with Erron Black Gunslinger. No other pro ever touch that character, SonicFox simply dominate with him.

And i said it many times that balance should be done at highest level possible, its idiotic to nerf character, because of 1 man success, that doesn[/ICODE]t mean the character is OP and need nerf.
And yeah he already said that she aint top 5. The reason for that are many. I dont think she was top 5 even before.

I said this too but if you ask the discord this, they try to retrack it. You're right. I said the same thing. I did believe that Cassie might've needed 2 changes but I didn't expect the changes we got. Still, I think she's good but does give her turns more.

 

[lionheart21]

It seems like the character who gets out of the restand is Erron Black. I tested Sonya & him Sonya wasn't able to beat it out guys. Erron's D3 beats it. Strange.

Does Sonya's D3 low profile, though?