Captain Cold General Discussion Thread

[dribirut]

Your community just got sonic foxed... Get fucked.. Ggs

Get ready for comments such as "brooooo you soo baddddd cc is amazing!! Fox just proved all you guys wrong"

 

[imblackjames]

I think he only needs a couple things he's not terrible but he needs some fixing. I think:

lvl 3 trait should either have faster start up or freeze them longer.

D1 should connect into straight shot on hit or block (ideally ice puddle would but that's reaching)

12 Ice puddle to work on hit

The regular wall to be + on hit

Dream fix: if i could get ji1 to force them to block s1 id be in heaven

 

[Noodle Monkey]

If I could have any buffs it would definitely be to make MBDF3 slow them like glacier grenade. It would lead to some cool ass setups

 

[buyacushun]

Just do what I did. Learned the character enough that I can play him. Not hard since he has like 4 strings and 5 specials. Then pick up a stable character to actually learn. Save captain cold for when you're fucking around or it benefits you to play the character. NRS is clearly not trying to balance the whole game and sees fit to regulate characters to specific roles or "sometimes" character. So CC is just a character I'll pick "sometimes" as the game goes on.

 

[Somea2V]

Guys, come on. We've been through this already. 12 xx DB3 connecting wouldn't really change anything. If we're going to talk about tweaks, please keep them useful.

 

[Noodle Monkey]

Guys, come on. We've been through this already. 12 xx DB3 connecting wouldn't really change anything. If we're going to talk about tweaks, please keep them useful.

How so? I thought it would help because it gives him an Overhead Low?

 

[Somea2V]

How so? I thought it would help because it gives him an Overhead Low?

The overhead low has no mix up. Just because it goes from one to another doesn't mean it throws off your opponent.

Now, some might say you can do 12 or 1 xx DB3, which works. You could also do F23 xx DB3 or F23 xx FFMB for a mixup. Both of which can be done right now. It cost a lot of meter as an option, but Cold isn't a typical mix up character.

And as far as catching, 12 when pushed to string completion or cancelled usually gives you room and time for trait or icicle. 12 isn't really a primary open-up-your-opponents string. If you want to do that, it typically revolves more around your ability to play the neutral, which F23 and B23 perform much better for.

I mean, 12 xx DB3 would catch the opponent a couple of times, but it would be quickly learned and no longer useful. Everything it might give you is already provided by existing tools.

 

[Noodle Monkey]

The overhead low has no mix up. Just because it goes from one to another doesn't mean it throws off your opponent.

Now, some might say you can do 12 or 1 xx DB3, which works. You could also do F23 xx DB3 or F23 xx FFMB for a mixup. Both of which can be done right now. It cost a lot of meter as an option, but Cold isn't a typical mix up character.

And as far as catching, 12 when pushed to string completion or cancelled usually gives you room and time for trait or icicle. 12 isn't really a primary open-up-your-opponents string. If you want to do that, it typically revolves more around your ability to play the neutral, which F23 and B23 perform much better for.

I mean, 12 xx DB3 would catch the opponent a couple of times, but it would be quickly learned and no longer useful. Everything it might give you is already provided by existing tools.

Fair enough actually, you have me there.

 

[Marinjuana]

I don't think he needs or should have it but 12~DB3 hitting would be useful as it allows CC to go for a 50/50 that leads to good damage both ways. It's not the low aspect of it that would make it useful, it's the combo potential outside of the corner.

 

[neveradestroyer]

*Black Adam's thunders not longer ignore Captain Cold wall. The only *"buff" I will ask for. Can we please don't get thunders entering for free against Cold for once

 

[Youphemism]

I don't get why people want 12~DB3 to link.

1. It wouldn't be a 50/50, the last hit of 122 isn't an overhead. 1~DB3 or 12 is the mixup.
2. You already have a 9 frame high that's hit confirmable that DOES link into DB3mb in 21.

 

[Somea2V]

I don't get why people want 12~DB3 to link.

1. It wouldn't be a 50/50, the last hit of 122 isn't an overhead. 1~DB3 or 12 is the mixup.
2. You already have a 9 frame high that's hit confirmable that DOES link into DB3mb in 21.

I'd only add that he also has an advancing 10 frame high and an advancing 11 frame mid that do as well.

 

[Somea2V]

*Black Adam's thunders not longer ignore Captain Cold wall. The only *"buff" I will ask for. Can we please don't get thunders entering for free against Cold for once

And regarding the thunder, all kinds of tracking projectiles ignore the wall. The thunder does, functionally speaking, track. It's just something we have to account for and work around.

 

[IrishMantis]

What @imblackjames said earlier I concur. As a CC main it's a real challenge to fill the trait along with the zoning. The only way to fully fill the trait is to face the CQC chars, like Catwoman. That's why the Ice Trap (called Big Freeze) is there. His Wall is so slow (2 times slow than UB Sub's Parry). Same goes for the icicle. Everything is punishable, because Cold is so slow movingly. You even saw his gameplay. Try playing him against any character, and you'll see the problems he has. Even @IrishMantis was kind of struggling with him in his match.

What NRS did was the worst thing to happen for Cold (and for the other bottom tier chars). They nerfed almost every top tier, and buffed this super-chick. They, also, nerfed even more Captain Cold, something that he DIDN'T need. He didn't need the nerfhammer. He needed tweaks or the buffhammer to be viable and finally a threat against the other characters, excluding the CQC ones. Now everybody is wondering why NRS isn't listening to us, and listens to this fox by showing the characters. -_-;

All we asked is to balance the game. Not to make it more unbalanced. It's like I said earlier. If they buff someone of the top tier and nerf the bottom tier, then they're smoking a lot of weed and get stoned behind the scenes.

I wouldn't use my set as an example, Cold wrecks Cheetah I just played ass and not comfortable with the MU yet, but in theory he wrecks her

Cold is a really strong char with some terrible MUs

If the char don't have a half decent Projectile they are fucked. He's got big weaknesses no doubt but also got really dirty strengths to make up for it imo

 

[KH_Seraph]

All these people saying 12~mbdb3 wouldn't help CC... Haha.

You all don't know how often people get clipped by the overhead. It's not about putting them in 50/50 situations; it's about getting beefy ass damage off of the overhead.

 

[Somea2V]

All these people saying 12~mbdb3 wouldn't help CC... Haha.

You all don't know how often people get clipped by the overhead. It's not about putting them in 50/50 situations; it's about getting beefy ass damage off of the overhead.

And when I get the overhead, I either complete the string into ice shot to knock them away and charge, cancel 122 into icicle for set up, or do the 12/1 xx DB3 mix up now that they're standing.

Could we get a bit more damage on the occasional hit, sure. But if you think that would actually address his problems, when he already has a decent chunk of options that don't include "big damage", it makes me question whether -you- actually play him.

Besides, you -can- connect 12 into Freeze if only the 2 hits the opponent with the right spacing. So you could already be converting those many times you clip the opponent with the overhead if you actually worked on what the character has instead of asking for things that wouldn't help.

 

[IrishMantis]

Cheetah, Flash, Scarecrow, Bane, Robin, Catwomen, and SZ all get fucked by Cold when played right
Could be more too

 

[Tanno]

Cheetah, Flash, Scarecrow, Bane, Robin, Catwomen, and SZ all get fucked by Cold when played right
Could be more too

Against SZ might be like 5/5. Problem is that his Iceball ignores the MB Wall.

 

[Noodle Monkey]

I want 12xxDB3 just so i can do some tricky to block stuff in jump 1 12xxDB3

 

[KH_Seraph]

And when I get the overhead, I either complete the string into ice shot to knock them away and charge, cancel 122 into icicle for set up, or do the 12/1 xx DB3 mix up now that they're standing.

Could we get a bit more damage on the occasional hit, sure. But if you think that would actually address his problems, when he already has a decent chunk of options that don't include "big damage", it makes me question whether -you- actually play him.

Besides, you -can- connect 12 into Freeze if only the 2 hits the opponent with the right spacing. So you could already be converting those many times you clip the opponent with the overhead if you actually worked on what the character has instead of asking for things that wouldn't help.

You're quoting me and saying all of this as if I don't already know that.

And assuming that I 'think' this would be the end-all solution that would address his problems. Just shut up already man, unless you've been following all of these threads and actually participate in the CC discord chat. Don't quote me out of context and say these things as if they haven't already been said a thousand times before.

 

[Somea2V]

You're quoting me and saying all of this as if I don't already know that.

And assuming that I 'think' this would be the end-all solution that would address his problems. Just shut up already man, unless you've been following all of these threads and actually participate in the CC discord chat. Don't quote me out of context and say these things as if they haven't already been said a thousand times before.

Quote you out of context? You make a statement saying 12 connecting in Big Freeze would help because of beefy damage off of all the times it connects. I pointed out that we already have a ton of functional options off of 12, some of which do lead to beefy damage. Oh yes, addressing your short, condescending post is taking it out of context.

I'm sorry if I don't have the forum cred to discuss Captain Cold. But if the points I've made have already been discussed "a thousand times already", then why the hell is 12xxDB3 still the go to request of these forums? It wouldn't actually change much. Shouldn't this have been discussed to death already?

 

[KH_Seraph]

Quote you out of context? You make a statement saying 12 connecting in Big Freeze would help because of beefy damage off of all the times it connects. I pointed out that we already have a ton of functional options off of 12, some of which do lead to beefy damage. Oh yes, addressing your short, condescending post is taking it out of context.

I'm sorry if I don't have the forum cred to discuss Captain Cold. But if the points I've made have already been discussed "a thousand times already", then why the hell is 12xxDB3 still the go to request of these forums? It wouldn't actually change much. Shouldn't this have been discussed to death already?

It wasn't a condescending post directed at any particular individual, it was pointing out that having 12~mbdb3 would be a nice option for have as a damaging combo starter, given a lot of other characters have many strings that lead to their combo starting options, whereas CC only has 1, and granted it's a forward advancing mid, it wouldn't hurt to have a second option that starts with a high.

What you're actually saying @Somea2V has already been discussed to death already like, since day 1.

Saying that the option wouldn't help or change anything though is pretty silly. It would help his game a lot... probably too much though. Maybe even broken, which is likely why NRS hasn't implemented it despite being a popular buff to bring up.

 

[mistaRONJON]

What if there are better anti-zoning/set up/trap style characters awaiting in the DLC?? CC is just a prototype of a better character? Maybe CC was meant to fail as competitive character on the roster. If that is true, then he will truly be nothing more than a "pocket character". I feel like one of the other DLC characters is going to be a better fit for the entire CC community.

Realistically, without breaking the character the only thing NRS could possibly buff is the time it takes to charge trait. I slightly agree with @KH_Seraph on the 12 xx mbdb3 as a combo starter but it could lead to disgustingly massive damage in the corner within the globe

 

[foxof42]

And when I get the overhead, I either complete the string into ice shot to knock them away and charge, cancel 122 into icicle for set up, or do the 12/1 xx DB3 mix up now that they're standing.

Could we get a bit more damage on the occasional hit, sure. But if you think that would actually address his problems, when he already has a decent chunk of options that don't include "big damage", it makes me question whether -you- actually play him.

Besides, you -can- connect 12 into Freeze if only the 2 hits the opponent with the right spacing. So you could already be converting those many times you clip the opponent with the overhead if you actually worked on what the character has instead of asking for things that wouldn't help.

This is a focus of mine so I want to pick your brain - how are you staggering 12 to 1db3? 12 is only +2 on hit, so it doesn't jail. I've been using 12bf1 to create enough hit advantage for a follow up, but even then there's too much pushback to jail 1 and 2 can be interrupted.

Also, whaaaat? If you have proof of 12db3 connecting at ANY range, I want to see this godliness in action! Please and thanks?

 

[MisguidedAngel]

Hey, guys... I kinda have a general question. Does anyone feel like they've changed the way inputs after a jump in work? This goes for every character. Am I dumb and missed something?

It feels like you have to input the string after the jump in far less early than you used to... I can wait until I land to input the commands and it will still combo... sure couldn't do that a month ago?