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Blue Beetle General Discussion Thread

Espio

Kokomo
He's supposed to receive a buff where he will always have his blade's out now and his new trait will be his projectile attack. THIS will make him REALLY fun to play now because I hate changing between the two.
You have entirely misunderstood. That is a legendary gear augment/perk. It is not apart of regular Beetle in the same way Swamp Thing's air dash is not apart of his regular kit. You can use it for fun, but not in the competitive nerf/buff sense.
 

JBeezYBabY

Mr. Righteous
You have entirely misunderstood. That is a legendary gear augment/perk. It is not apart of regular Beetle in the same way Swamp Thing's air dash is not apart of his regular kit. You can use it for fun, but not in the competitive nerf/buff sense.
REALLY!! FAAAAAWK! I totally did misunderstood that....my bad, but THAT sucks...
 

TurboTaco

Mexican street vendor
You have entirely misunderstood. That is a legendary gear augment/perk. It is not apart of regular Beetle in the same way Swamp Thing's air dash is not apart of his regular kit. You can use it for fun, but not in the competitive nerf/buff sense.
Wait is Swamp Things air dash a gear move?
 

Sesal Snow

Exorcist, Demonologist and Master of the Dark Arts
He's supposed to receive a buff where he will always have his blade's out now and his new trait will be his projectile attack. THIS will make him REALLY fun to play now because I hate changing between the two.
This buff you are on about is only for gear. It's the ability you get when you equip his new legendary scarab.
 

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
@Espio

I got a friend who is (kinda) learning BB (been playing him from beta), can you give me some advice to help him out, especially matchup tips for Wonder Woman, Red Hood, Fate, and Starfire? They're characters I play so I could help him with matchups.

I don't know the character at all but I'd like to help him out somewhat.
 
Where does Blue Beetle stand on the common tier charts? A good friend of mine who's really good at the game tells me that Beetle is top tier. That true? If so, why aren't more pros taking him into the tournaments?
 

Espio

Kokomo
Where does Blue Beetle stand on the common tier charts? A good friend of mine who's really good at the game tells me that Beetle is top tier. That true? If so, why aren't more pros taking him into the tournaments?
Character is not top tier, he is just a solid, balanced character. He has answers for just about any situation with solid zoning, safety and decent footsies. The thing about this character is while he has tools for everything, it's all very honest and not oppressive. Every pro has a reasonable con of some sort.

He is floating somewhere around mid tier. There's a lot of misinformation surrounding these characters in general and Blue Beetle in particular. He is neither trash nor top.

He can be very rewarding to play if you put in the time with him. You just can't play him as your 7th character and think you're gonna be godlike.

@Espio

I got a friend who is (kinda) learning BB (been playing him from beta), can you give me some advice to help him out, especially matchup tips for Wonder Woman, Red Hood, Fate, and Starfire? They're characters I play so I could help him with matchups.

I don't know the character at all but I'd like to help him out somewhat.
Is your friend on TYM? I don't know the Red Hood match up, nobody I play or anybody good plays him.

I don't think my writing essays on the match ups would help, I don't want the info lost in transference and if you're new half the stuff being applied would be confusing.

Starfire is just about abusing air control/zoning on the ground and spacing her out. Her answers for people zipping around in the air are meh. Get good at zoning and spacing her out, she has a hard time chasing opponents down and her air dash gets mopped by Beetle's fast projectile.

Wonder Woman is purely footsies, I play it mostly in projectile stance and play a really solid ground game. They both have to guess a lot so if you're good at mixing up flight, anti-airing and turtling you can do very well against her.

I have footage on my Youtube channel versus Starfire and Wonder Woman, that would be the most useful in helping them learn those match ups.

I can't provide any input on Fate because I don't play Fates, the match up seems pretty simplistic in the sense of using your air control to be annoying use your safe strings and footsie tools up close. I'm sure the match up is way deeper than that, but that's my current theory since the experience is not present.
 

Sesal Snow

Exorcist, Demonologist and Master of the Dark Arts
Where does Blue Beetle stand on the common tier charts? A good friend of mine who's really good at the game tells me that Beetle is top tier. That true? If so, why aren't more pros taking him into the tournaments?
I personally would place him high-mid tier.
He has great footsie game, great zoning, amazing meterbuild and has great mobility.
The only thing he lacks is high damage he gets decent damage and nice damage from 2 bar conversions but of of anti air conversion etc his damage is lacking not like a lot of the higher tier chars which is one of the reasons I would not place him top tier.
I think he close to being top tier but not there yet he has great mu's not loosing many and at the end of the day hes a fun char ^_^.
 

AkioOf100

I play Raph
I've been maining Blue Beetle for about two months now, and I really love his playstyle. He's awesome.
Amazing crossups, some of the best in the game actually, a really good projectile, some air mobility and some great counter-zoning. His only issue is characters with a good air-to-air and some damage off of his most execution-heavy stuff. He needs some adjusting to his hitboxes in my opinion and some scaling changes on his db1 MB. Aside from that, he's a solid character.

Perhaps they could changeh is trait around? Add a Mace Stance so they don't have to really buff his damage, let that be his damage-heavy thing? Give him some new strings and stuff in that stance, and let him keep his power blades. Maybe he could keep his main neutral but slow down their startup in exchange for really good damage? IDk something like that could really help him out. Plus it would probably boost his range slightly.

and PLS.. REMOVE THE HURT BOXES FROM POWER BLADES?
 

gibster13

A fan of fans
I watched Atai play Theo yday and my love for i2 has been reborn, and it is in the form of blue beetle.


halp meh
 
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Espio

Kokomo
Everything

I'm trying to find gameplay but idk.

Neutral, mixups and general gameplay tbh
Here's what you need gameplay wise: Watch Sesal Snow, Atai, me, Pfidude, there's several others in the match video thread as well.

The core of your neutral/footsie game is gonna be forward 2, sweep, back 1 and shield bash are some of the core ways he plays neutral.

My play style puts shield bash at the forefront. I play him very chip/pressure heavy but also lots of zoning depending on the match up. Trait is super good in most match ups to give you the footsie advantage especially against characters you aren't reliably zoning.

Shield bash is so important to my play style because it gives me a safe 50/50 with sweep and Back 2, shield bash. It gives him a safe advancing special AND a safe advancing footsie normal with forward 2 into shield bash.

Jump 3 and jump 2 can be used for some ambiguous jump ins, I use jump 3 a lot for meterless block pressure since it's plus enough to beat out fast reversals with throw, down 1 or block string/stagger into throw or pressure. Jump 3 on block into shield bash is a true blockstring as well.

The beauty of float is how many applications it has for offense and defense. You can use it to make wake ups, pokes and many attacks whiff and punish on the way down for full combos as well as setting up ambiguous cross ups. It can also be used for baiting like for example, I played a Grodd player yesterday and did float, projectile to punish his anti-air or float backwards into jump 2 to make his charge whiff and punish it. A lot of his depth comes from flight.

When it comes to his ground mix ups, I think something that needs to be emphasized is that he isn't a super mix heavy character. He has some solid mix, but you don't wanna over extend on it since several are unsafe.

Back 2,3 should be apart of your ground mix up game, even if you don't do it often because it's overhead, overhead that crosses up meaning that Blue Beetle can mix that up with Back 2, low stab. The MB low stab leads to full combos but both options are unsafe. Back 2, MB bounce cancel forward 3 is good if you've conditioned well with back 2, low stab but you're gonna wanna use that sparingly because people can see it if you do it too much.

Beetle builds a lot of meter because the core of his gameplan revolves around abusing safe specials like energy cannon, float, shield bash etc so he always has meter. Don't buy into the no damage hype either. He gets over 300 around 360 ish for a one bar combo punish for example. He doesn't have the best damage, but his damage is very serviceable.

When you watch all the different Beetles, you'll quickly pick up on the reality that his design allows for a lot of creative freedom in how you approach playing as him. You've got crazy set ups and shenanigans with Sesal whereas with me you have more of a basic zoning, footsies and safe based style. There's no set be all end all play style, he has tools for pretty much every situation so you have the comfort and freedom to create your own way to play.
 

pfiidud3

Apprentice
OK, here is my write up. keep in mind, I use some set-ups that suffer vs techrolls.

BB is awesome in the corner. 13fc1 and 13fc2 are great loopable block strings, that have to be poked out of at different, yet precise times. (they also lead to decent meter-less corner damage on hit, into the below set ups)

Shield bashing someone into the corner leads to a nifty cross up jump most of the time. b2 df1mb and b23 will keep them in the corner.

df1 and bf2 are fun combo enders in the corner as well. (while they are tech roll-able) They can lead to some ambiguous flight shenanigans. such as....
13 reverse fly cancel
or jump over reverse fly cancel (you want to hit down to cancel flight, then hit 2 on the way down)
These side switch the opponents wake ups, but you can choose to land outside the corner.

Ending long combos in the corner with b1 bf2mb forces them to block the + gun shot (or take a bit of reset dmg) and if they block the shot, you can force more shave dmg with d1 shield bash.

If your feeling risky, you can also try and reset combos with b13 df1mb (works midscreen too). The problem here, is they can poke after the 3, or block/punish the df1. AND the df1 won't set them up for optimal meterless dmg combo.

My go to combo is (optional d2) f23 ji2 3 db1 mb b3.
I think this is easy to hit confirm and the second-best dmg combo you can get off of these starters. It also leads me to various set ups.
1) dash in, jump in, you'll run under them, and then jump over for a cross up right as they get up.
2) jump in, neutral jump, you'll land right on top of them, very ambiguous and hard for me to tell which side I'll land on.
3) f2 ender, dash in, ji3 reverse fly cancel, avoids most wake ups, and sometimes lets you jump back on top of them for another combo.
4) f2 also leads to a cross up jump itself.

I like to do 21 after jump ins (only d it vs WoWo if you have trait). You don't have to worry about crossing your own inputs up. its hit confirm able into df1mb. OR, block confirm able into the forced shave dmg of d1 shield bash.

Also, after raw b3->ji3 and df1mb, I sometimes do shimmy step into 111 bf2 ji insta-flight-cancel, dash in, its a fun cross up (or non cross up if you want it to be) that they have to tech roll out of, or block.

13 leaves you in the air (hence the fly cancel) allowing you do use some arial intractables after 13. (such as the cable on the corner of the bat cave. the cable the alien spaceship. aligator/antelope animals in the corners of gorila city/swamp. the vine in gorilla city as well. and the tree outside of arkahm. the orbs/statue in atlantis.) fun stuff
 
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so, how do i deal with beetles that keep looping 13~fly j2, it felt like i couldnt let go of block.
Either an 8 frame standing jab, or a good d2 can interrupt the j2. (So for Batman d2, Firestorm 1, and Ivy just fucking hold that)

If he does 132 instead of 13~fly youre gonna eat some Beetle foot no matter what, but its unsafe for Beetle so check him on it when you can.

Also by "good" d2 I mean fast. WoWo's d2 is good, but loses on this I'm pretty sure. But her 8 frame standing jab beats it.
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
Either an 8 frame standing jab, or a good d2 can interrupt the j2. (So for Batman d2, Firestorm 1, and Ivy just fucking hold that)

If he does 132 instead of 13~fly youre gonna eat some Beetle foot no matter what, but its unsafe for Beetle so check him on it when you can.

Also by "good" d2 I mean fast. WoWo's d2 is good, but loses on this I'm pretty sure. But her 8 frame standing jab beats it.
what if he does ji1 instead, thats faster too right? whats a character like darkseid to do? i can only seem to d1 my way out but only if i block the 2nd hit of 13 crouching, i swear its almost like a block infinite vs him :/.
 

pfiidud3

Apprentice
what if he does ji1 instead, thats faster too right? whats a character like darkseid to do? i can only seem to d1 my way out but only if i block the 2nd hit of 13 crouching, i swear its almost like a block infinite vs him :/.
13fc2 you have to d2 before the 2 hits.

13fc1 you have to d1/d2 right after the 1 hits
BUT! On a read, he can do 13fc1 bf2mb and punish you for doing so. its a shame thats not + on block or he would be insane!!!!!!!!!

Its a really good block string. I like to go straight into it after corner shenanigans. Its super easy to hit confirm into full 300+ meterless combo into a reset. And like you said, its not shabby on block.

I simply time hitting 2 in 13fc2. But, i do find hitting 13fc (hold down while mashing 1) helps me get the frame perfect timing for that option. You just have to be ready to stop mashing and do a follow up right away.
 
lol, I just tested it in practice and yeah, Darksied really has to hold that shit.

j1 doesn't jail into any high's I believe so you can d1 the chain there.

I think if you d1 him during the flight it's pretty unreliably. The d1 was whiffing if I did it perfectly in the blockstun buffer window, and was hitting if I was late a couple of frames.

Best option I suppose is d1 check to beat high's after j1 to stop the loop.