25 full roster with the added TYM most voted returning characters

[Vslayer]

Fixed

am triggered tbh

she's the scream queen, ya can't just toss her aside like a dirty rag D:

 

[mattteo]

Damn bro, I was trying to give you the win but you made me do it. Popularity level-

#18 Sonya
#17 Goro
#13 Johnny
# Havik?

http://www.dorkly.com/post/57393/toplist-results-the-20-greatest-mortal-kombat-kharacters-of-all-time

Not a couple hundred, or thousand, but 900,000 votes (as in almost one million votes). Small sample sizes are meaningless, that you were right about.

Top Ten has votes of mass volume as well, where Johnny is #6 and Sonya is #9, and Goro is #18.

https://www.thetoptens.com/mortal-kombat-characters/

Ranker has over 163,300 votes. Johnny is #11, Sonya #15, Goro #17. Havik?? #52.

https://m.ranker.com/list/all-mortal-kombat-characters-list-of-mk-characters/video-game-info

I was talking about polls in the last year that have at least thousands of votes and you give me polls from 2013 on that dorkly link and ranker which has been registering votes for 15 years.

Obviously the original era characters had much more time to be voted there. And the poll in 2013 was just after the MK9 game, where all of those featured.

But I urge you to find another poll in the last year with thousands of votes except the 2 above. And why did in the last year Fujin and Kenshi and Havik and Frost and Tanya get more votes than Sonya and Jax and Kano and Goro? All of these last 4 being original charcaters and in MKX, while Fujin, Havik or Frost were not.

It's because they were given a little bit of development in the comic or story mode and people just fell in love with them. From that little development. Think of what will happen if they're made playable, they would push top 10.

I will take that beer on a raincheck cause I see you don't have any recent polls to show, just old 6 years old ones with only the original characters in them.

The above 26 ranking I made stands and is pretty much the opinion of thousands of people in the last year, not just 15 votes on TYM.

You told me there was no way Havik would get more votes than Goro, ever, in any poll. I proved you wrong.

 

[Atriox]

It's a very good roster but I highly doubt that Cassie is the only youngin to return from X. And I'm almost 100% sure that Kotal will return as well, he's too important. Other than that I love this roster!

 

[Lokheit]

Honestly, the more I think about it, the more I think there has to be more base characters, like 30 or so.

Looking at all of the possible combinations, with the characters we already know are in... you can't really tell the story with so few characters.

Kotal's crew needs continuity (and maybe a mopping from Shao Kahn?): At least Kotal and maybe Erron? D'Vorah helping Kronika?

The NPC MKX revenants need some representation as part of the story probably will be an assault on netherealm: We know about Kabal, Smoke might be another one with the enenra thing... maybe Sindel too? She was too important in MK9 and was a fightable NPC in MKX.

It wouldn't make sense for most of the kombat kids to skip this, I think at least 2 or 3 of them should be there for continuity.

Kenshi and his son have the Daegon sub-plot, but maybe that will be explored on MK12?

Noob and Jade both are very relevant as both have been doing stuff behind the scenes and are heavily hinted at.

Then supposedly we're getting more new faces...

There's no room for everything you need to continue MKX story unless you focus on a very small portion of it.

 

[Atriox]

Honestly, the more I think about it, the more I think there has to be more base characters, like 30 or so.

There's no room for everything you need to continue MKX story unless you focus on a very small portion of it.

Unless there's barely any older returning characters. Then the size could be enough, I really really hope not though.

 

[Mind Flex]

This Roster is Amazing. I think we get all these characters eventually but sadly some will be DLC.

 

[geogeolivero]

am triggered tbh

she's the scream queen, ya can't just toss her aside like a dirty rag D:

Yes totally, can you image the hair animation, sound effects and don't forget the scream. Look at Canary's scream in IJ2, they can reuse al lot and make it better then Canary. I think everyone will love the new Sindel.

 

[D-Que Beats]

Take Havik and weak ass Sereena out lol

 

[SaltShaker]

I was talking about polls in the last year that have at least thousands of votes and you give me polls from 2013 on that dorkly link and ranker which has been registering votes for 15 years.

Obviously the original era characters had much more time to be voted there. And the poll in 2013 was just after the MK9 game, where all of those featured.

But I urge you to find another poll in the last year with thousands of votes except the 2 above. And why did in the last year Fujin and Kenshi and Havik and Frost and Tanya get more votes than Sonya and Jax and Kano and Goro? All of these last 4 being original charcaters and in MKX, while Fujin, Havik or Frost were not.

It's because they were given a little bit of development in the comic or story mode and people just fell in love with them. From that little development. Think of what will happen if they're made playable, they would push top 10.

I will take that beer on a raincheck cause I see you don't have any recent polls to show, just old 6 years old ones with only the original characters in them.

The above 26 ranking I made stands and is pretty much the opinion of thousands of people in the last year, not just 15 votes on TYM.

You told me there was no way Havik would get more votes than Goro, ever, in any poll. I proved you wrong.

LolWut? Should have took the beer bruh, or just went down swinging. Nevertheless, I'm slow at work so I'll provide more rationale here.

1) Only one poll is December 2013 (back then your character scored low), one poll is during MKX pre-release (scored low again), and one poll is open as in you can go vote right now. (continuing to score low, ranked #52 out of 160k votes). This was to highlight to you that at no point and time were the "old characters" ever "not wanted" compared to the obscure ones. The overwhelming majority of polls have a start/end date. For example, you cannot vote on the 2013 poll, as it was a months long poll that closed near the end of that year. Then the results are tallied from the votes. So you end up counting those votes, and seeing how popular the Sonya or Goro or Johnny characters are in comparison to Havik. The other two polls obviously have the Kombat Kids on them, so how would you assume they are from 2013 lol.

You can vote on the ongoing poll however. Maybe your vote will rise Havik from #52 to #51. I'm thinking of giving him a vote myself just to help you out. That's how nice of a guy I am.

2) Sample size matters. You yourself said this earlier when telling someone that one poll was too small in comparison to your poll. Now I have shown you multiple significantly larger polls than yours.

Polls with hundreds of thousands of votes, and one with nearly a million votes. You cannot say "but my ant sized poll has Sonya and Goro at the bottom, why do they keep returning". Of course an insignificant fraction of the sample size can turn in any random variable, however the larger the test population, the more accurate the results. To continue this debate, your response has to be "Hey SaltShaker, what about this poll that has 100k votes with Havik in the top 20". If not, the exact same criticism you gave another person about the size of their poll data falls back directly on you.

3) The casual fanbase doesn't care about the characters you think they do. Fujin had all the "love" you can think of, and on TYM during MKX people here were saying he should replace Raiden's spot in the game, but a lot of casuals could care less about him. This is why a guy like Shao Kahn is never playable until now and has skipped multiple games, but still scores high in all the polls. When mentioning MK11 is coming out do you know what they say? They say "Is my boy Johnny still in the game" or "did they showcase Kitana yet? Let me know when they do". Do you know what they don't say? "Man I really hope they include Havik this year".

I think you're out your depth here bro lol. Personally, I would love to see a guy like Mavado remade into a current game, but understand that the character is in the minority of desired ones. We have to hope that NRS takes a risk on the character(s) we want brought back. You can't argue the masses want to see original characters replaced by obscure relatively unknown ones. This is factually inaccurate. Unless of course you can show a rankings list, with 100k votes or more, at any point in history, that has either Havik in the top 20 of most popular characters or in the top 20 of most wanted characters. Deep down, you know this is not possible.

Or is it?

 

[MindlessGod98]

As a Kano main from the late years of mkx, I have to say I am still hoping that his son will make a spot on the roster. Erron Black is an extremely close second

 

[mattteo]

LolWut? Should have took the beer bruh, or just went down swinging. Nevertheless, I'm slow at work so I'll provide more rationale here.

1) Only one poll is December 2013 (back then your character scored low), one poll is during MKX pre-release (scored low again), and one poll is open as in you can go vote right now. (continuing to score low, ranked #52 out of 160k votes). This was to highlight to you that at no point and time were the "old characters" ever "not wanted" compared to the obscure ones. The overwhelming majority of polls have a start/end date. For example, you cannot vote on the 2013 poll, as it was a months long poll that closed near the end of that year.

This....is exactly what I'm saying. You don't seem to understand that it actually goes AGAINST your rationale BECAUSE those polls are from 2013 and the ranker poll has been going on since there were only original charcaters that it got nearly a million votes. Can't add up all those voted cause people didn;t have in 2005 or in 2011 the same opinion they have today.

Search for polls from the last year, I told you. Or better yet, make one yourself. I bet you that never ever will Goro rank higher than Havik if you go past 1000 votes. Never. Bet you a friendly beer on that

 

[SaltShaker]

This....is exactly what I'm saying. You don't seem to understand that it actually goes AGAINST your rationale BECAUSE those polls are from 2013 and the ranker poll has been going on since there were only original charcaters that it got nearly a million votes. Can't add up all those voted cause people didn;t have in 2005 or in 2011 the same opinion they have today.

Search for polls from the last year, I told you. Or better yet, make one yourself. I bet you that never ever will Goro rank higher than Havik if you go past 1000 votes. Never. Bet you a friendly beer on that

You remind me a lot of someone who used to post here often. -.-

Alright I will simplify this in a way that you can't get the answer wrong. MKX sold over 5 million copies, agreed? Do you think if you poll those buyers, all 5 million of those vastly in the majority of casual players, and ask them who do they want in the next game, they would say "Havik, Reiko, Shujinko and Fujin" over "Sonya, Goro, Kitana, and Johnny"?

Which answer seems more likely to you if you poll buyers of MKX?

 

[mattteo]

Alright I will simplify this in a way that you can't get the answer wrong. MKX sold over 5 million copies, agreed? Do you think if you poll those buyers, all 5 million of those vastly in the majority of casual players, and ask them who do they want in the next game, they would say "Havik, Reiko, Shujinko and Fujin" over "Sonya, Goro, Kitana, and Johnny"?

Good question. And I have just the answer: I think MK11 would also sell over 5 million copies even if it had "Havik, Reiko, Shujinko and Fujin" instead of "Sonya, Goro, Kitana, and Johnny".

People will be fans of whatever characters NRS makes cool and gives them. But NRS should make fans for some of those other characters too and the only way of doing this is to make them playable. If they do this, I guarantee you that in a poll 4 years from now, those "Sonya, Goro, Kitana, and Johnny" are gonna have a hard time getting picled by casuals.

 

[SaltShaker]

Good question. And I have just the answer: I think MK11 would also sell over 5 million copies even if it had "Havik, Reiko, Shujinko and Fujin" instead of "Sonya, Goro, Kitana, and Johnny".

People will be fans of whatever characters NRS makes cool and gives them. But NRS should make fans for some of those other characters too and the only way of doing this is to make them playable. If they do this, I guarantee you that in a poll 4 years from now, those "Sonya, Goro, Kitana, and Johnny" are gonna have a hard time getting picled by casuals.

Will it sell the same amount no matter who you include? That's the million dollar question. A question that NRS themselves would have to take the financial risk on. Tekken 7 or MKX is about the closest you can do, but what you suggest could be devastating to casual sales. Do you remember SC4 and SC5 for example? What happens when you try to get too cute with the roster?

SoulCalibur 5 has now sold 1.56 million copies worldwide since its release in February 2012.

That's fewer than SoulCalibur 4, which notched up more sales in less time: 2.3 million in seven months.

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-02-06-soulcalibur-5-sales-arent-as-strong-as-soulcalibur-4s

The number one complaint was that the roster removed fan favorites (even though they kept others like Mitsurugi, Ivy, Nightmare, etc who were deemed bigger favorites). The ones deemed less desirable like your Sonya and Goro comments caused mass uproar with so many "if character X isn't in I won't buy it" words, which turned out to be true. If you google "SC5 characters" or SC5 roster" all you see is disgust from casual gamers from article to article, comment section to comment section. No one is talking about graphics or gameplay, they're all talking about the characters they missed out on. Namco missed out on a lot of money so what did they do? Return the majority of the characters in SC6.

Over 5 million MKX sales, and Evo the Superbowl of fighting games had what? 1200 people in 2015 for MKX? Casual gamers are here for the gore and the fatalities, not for the 2 frame punish window. While we were on forums complaining about a game that had the Kombat Kids and all the parents, the casual gamer was like "wow it's so cool to have Cassie and Sonya, time to fatality the mom!" and "Wow Goro is playable?! Time to punchwalk". You're slightly correct about if they include characters from the gone era they will become more liked over time, but I think you are overstating it. Kenshi was in MK9, MKX, and possibly returning again, yet doesn't crack any top scores in polls over old favorites. I doubt that would change if he returns once again.

SF will almost always have Ken, Ryu, Chun-Li, Guile, Zangief, Dhalsim. Tekken will almost always have Jin, Kazuya, Heihachi, Devil Jin, Asuka (all five of them are related lolz), a Chang, Nina, King, Yoshi. SC will almost always have Mitsurugi, Ivy, Astaroth, Nightmare, Siegfried, Maxi, Kilik, Sophitia. And MK will almost always have Liu, Kitana, Sonya, Johnny, Scorpion, Sub-Zero, Raiden, Kung Lao. They are staples of the franchise.

I think you're mixing the reason why these characters return so often (massively desired by casuals which leads to profits) with the hardcore base wanting something fresh (fractional amount of players who buy the game regardless of characters).

 

[mattteo]

It wouldn't sell if it didn't have Scorpion and Sub-Zero and Noob Saibot. But there'a big difference between those and "Sonya, Goro, Kano and Jax".

By the way, MKX sold even without Noob Saibot, who is top 5 most wanted.

 

[SenSx]

Honestly, the more I think about it, the more I think there has to be more base characters, like 30 or so.

Looking at all of the possible combinations, with the characters we already know are in... you can't really tell the story with so few characters.

Kotal's crew needs continuity (and maybe a mopping from Shao Kahn?): At least Kotal and maybe Erron? D'Vorah helping Kronika?

The NPC MKX revenants need some representation as part of the story probably will be an assault on netherealm: We know about Kabal, Smoke might be another one with the enenra thing... maybe Sindel too? She was too important in MK9 and was a fightable NPC in MKX.

It wouldn't make sense for most of the kombat kids to skip this, I think at least 2 or 3 of them should be there for continuity.

Kenshi and his son have the Daegon sub-plot, but maybe that will be explored on MK12?

Noob and Jade both are very relevant as both have been doing stuff behind the scenes and are heavily hinted at.

Then supposedly we're getting more new faces...

There's no room for everything you need to continue MKX story unless you focus on a very small portion of it.

They need more characters to tell a story, but they will probably use NPC again.
They only said there won't be fightable NPC you can't play, but cinematic NPC are there for sure.
I expect many characters from MKX to be unplaybale this time.

There could be 1 or 2 more characters, but I don't expect 30 at all.
And NRS has always revealed the total number of fighters on their select screens from the start.
Besides they have those variations moves to make and balance, all those cosmetic elements, and on top of that the younger and older selves probably for each character.

I have a hard time to believe they could do all that for 30 characters.

 

[VSC_Supreme]

As far as the discussion going on here for the relevancy of the 3D characters, I think after MKX there isn't much doubt that NRS is capable of making these characters interesting, most of them were conceptually sound, but executed awfully. MKX introduced a lot of new characters and I think most of them landed well enough, give or take a couple of the combat kids.

I do think it's important to take note of the comic though, it's what built a lot of the popularity for the newcomers such as Kotal, Erron, etc, and for "returning" characters like Reiko. Without the comic I'm not sure the character popularity would have stuck, especially with how disappointed some of us were with these characters in the MKX story.

Unfortunately with most fighting game rosters not named smash ultimate, someone is going to be disappointed because their favorite character isn't here.

 

[pure.Wasted]

Looking at all of the possible combinations, with the characters we already know are in... you can't really tell the story with so few characters.

Characters don't need to be on the base roster to appear in the story mode. They can either have story cameos and be added later as DLC (see: Tanya, Bo'Rai Cho in MKX) or just be complete NPCs (see: Fujin, Rain, Baraka, Sareena, Sindel, Stryker, Nightwolf, Smoke, Kabal, Frost, Li Mei in MKX). And some might inexplicably disappear completely (see: Jade).

I wouldn't get my hopes up like that if I were you.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Reiko and Havik are shit throwaway characters and it's not only known by the people who put these rosters together, but by the writers.

In the MKX comics, Reiko was built up to be important. But oh no he turned out to be a little bitch and Havik was the main villain. Oh, nevermind. Havik was a little bitch too and gets his head stomped in by Quan Chi(one of the only decent post MK3 characters). I wouldn't expect their perception to get any better if they were put in these new games as MK11 and the MKX comics have the same writer so they would probably get thrown in the dumpster where they belong once again.

 

[VSC_Supreme]

Reiko and Havik are shit throwaway characters and it's not only known by the people who put these rosters together, but by the writers.

In the MKX comics, Reiko was built up to be important. But oh no he turned out to be a little bitch and Havik was the main villain. Oh, nevermind. Havik was a little bitch too and gets his head stomped in by Quan Chi(one of the only decent post MK3 characters). I wouldn't expect their perception to get any better if they were put in these new games as MK11 and the MKX comics have the same writer so they would probably get thrown in the dumpster where they belong once again.

I honestly think its a result of the writers never doing anything more than that with the villains, its been the same shit since forever. Shao Kahn was behind Shang Tsung all along, but it was actually puppeteered by Shinnok, who was really being manipulated to giving up his amulet by Quan Chi, while Kronika was planning the whole thing.

The Reiko and Havik twists in the comic were bunk as well, that's when it all went downhill.

 

[pure.Wasted]

I wish MK11 was just a tournament. No villains who have secretly been behind everything for the past 10 games... just a tournament to, let's say, decide the fate of Edenia. That would have been sick.

MK11's story might end up being sick as well, but it's veering dangerously close to some trope territory that I'm not a huge fan of.

 

[HeavyNorse]

I wish MK11 was just a tournament

I'm personally just so over the whole "tournament" story for fighting games. It's been done to death.

 

[pure.Wasted]

I'm personally just so over the whole "tournament" story for fighting games. It's been done to death.

I don't give a flying fuck about fighting games that aren't NRS so the only tournament stories I've seen in the last 30 years are MK1 and MK2, and MK9's retelling of MK1 and MK2. Not exactly drowning in original content here.

Curious where you've been overexposed though. I saw playthroughs of all contemporary fighters story modes: Tekken 7, sf5, mvci, dbzf. None of them featured any tournaments even in passing. What did I miss?

 

[xXRagingFlameXx]

I'm personally just so over the whole "tournament" story for fighting games. It's been done to death.

I actually wish there was MORE tournament. I don't mind the random fights, but I enjoyed the 'spectacle' of the tournaments in MK9. The crowd. It just felt cool to me. I hope there's an alternate Shang Tsung's Courtyard stage where it's not in ruins and the monks are alive, clapping and shit and watching the battle take place.
Just felt cool to me.

In MKX it was kinda weird, especially with the stages. It's like, there's this intense battle going on between Shinnok and Raiden and everyone in the back is just going about their business. You think they'd at least be looking at the fight, you know?

In MK11, in the Black Dragon Fight Club stage, it makes sense. There are a ton of people freaking out and watching the fight go down. I like stuff like that. If these literal GODS are fighting in the middle of the street, people wouldn't just be chilling at their food stand.

 

[HeavyNorse]

What did I miss?

The 25 years of fighting games all being about tournaments, apparently.
Just don't want them to go back to that premise.

Just felt cool to me.

I'm just bored of it, really.