The Patch's Real Injustice: Superman's breath still positive on block

[Solid]

Dudes and I mean Superman mains, hear me out. These people creating these threads don't want to be helped. They just want Superman to be nerfed so they can have an easier time fighting him. Leveling up, figuring their own characters dirt and finding out ways to setting it up, are out of the question for them. I stopped argueing and explaining to them because it is a huge waste of time. Please don't respond to them anymore because they are NOT asking for help. All they are really doing is crying for nerfs so they can continue with their scrubby ways to no end. Their opinion doesn't seem to change even with all the clear counterpoints to their biased look and advice they are getting. It is all pointless. One more thing I ask is just to destroy them any chance we get, being in tournaments or online. If a scrub can't adapt to a stupid footsie tool I say abuse it for the win and let them keep crying to deaf ears. I'm out.

Btw scrubs don't tag me with a response cause I am done responding to your srubby selves. Stay Free.

 

[chores]

Does he really need this?

 

[Son ov Timett]

Why don't you tell us?
I'm a little perplexed on how to get out of this for characters like Grundy.
Edit: Well SHEEIT!! After 10 minutes of training I realized that if I (the Grundy) time my backdash just right, the f2 whiffs BUT I still have to block the 3. .

There's a gap (no idea how many frames exactly, but it's substantial), if you're spaced properly to where the f2 whiffs, you can interrupt with your own offense before the 3 hits. Credit - SatsuiYesHadou who showed me this (and kicks my ass constantly without looping anything but skill.)

Supes f23 string is fine, he actually does need it. If anything, increase trait cool down, problem solved.

I wonder what these kids did against "Kabal?" Oh yea that's right, dropped the game 2 months in. <Zing>

 

[ll Nooby ll]

There's a gap (no idea how many frames exactly, but it's substantial), if you're spaced properly to where the f2 whiffs, you can interrupt with your own offense before the 3 hits. Credit - SatsuiYesHadou who showed me this (and kicks my ass constantly without looping anything but skill.)

Supes f23 string is fine, he actually does need it. If anything, increase trait cool down, problem solved.

I wonder what these kids did against "Kabal?" Oh yea that's right, dropped the game 2 months in. <Zing>

Thank you for answering. I will take your word for it when you say he needs it.
I'm going to start utilizing this, but even then I feel it's still going to be hard for Grundy since he actually wants to get in close, but gets zoned out and F23ed. Thanks again.

 

[Compbros]

Why don't you tell us?
I'm a little perplexed on how to get out of this for characters like Grundy.
Edit: Well SHEEIT!! After 10 minutes of training I realized that if I (the Grundy) time my backdash just right, the f2 whiffs BUT I still have to block the 3. So now, taking into account that I (the Grundy player mind you) got my first backdash to work (and if the superman doesn't time his f2 to catch my backdash attempt) , I can backdash for a SECOND time and the 3 will whiff as well. And now where both back at neutral.

And don't ask about Grundy armor, because Supes is floating in the air, if I do walking corpse it will absorb the f2 then the grab will whiff and then the 3 will hit. My only viable option is to do an armor trait, but again, Supes can read this and punish with a full combo. Not to mention that Supes can cancel into his trait and blow up any armor attempts made by any character.

Played casuals with Tyrant this weekend and he beat F23, breath with a MB B3 in the gap between the breath and the next F23, which is what I've suggested people start experimenting with. He was playing Grundy the entire time (played about 15 or so matches) and rarely did he succumb to the pressure of F23, breath.

 

[ll Nooby ll]

Played casuals with Tyrant this weekend and he beat F23, breath with a MB B3 in the gap between the breath and the next F23, which is what I've suggested people start experimenting with. He was playing Grundy the entire time (played about 15 or so matches) and rarely did he succumb to the pressure of F23, breath.

Well I know armor can work. But even then superman doesn't have to do another f2 and if he does that, Grundy just wasted a bar for nothing. Also if superman has trait active, there's nothing Grundy can do.

 

[xQUANTUMx]

Well I know armor can work. But even then superman doesn't have to do another f2 and if he does that, Grundy just wasted a bar for nothing. Also if superman has trait active, there's nothing Grundy can do.

Grundy wasted a bar for nothing bc the player made a bad read and the superman player made a good one. Nothing to do with superman. As previously mentioned, tyrant read Compbros and adjusted. Trait is used best mid combo, I've rarely seen a supes player just Yolo activate trait...his trait doesn't even land THAT much damage anymore, and considering Grundy can still take up to 65% from you chain grabbing, supes' trait is meh. Be glad the corner got nerfed, and rightly so, that damage was retarded with the F2D1's


Sent from my iPhone

 

[ll Nooby ll]

Grundy wasted a bar for nothing bc the player made a bad read and the superman player made a good one. Nothing to do with superman. As previously mentioned, tyrant read Compbros and adjusted. Trait is used best mid combo, I've rarely seen a supes player just Yolo activate trait...his trait doesn't even land THAT much damage anymore, and considering Grundy can still take up to 65% from you chain grabbing, supes' trait is meh. Be glad the corner got nerfed, and rightly so, that damage was retarded with the F2D1's


Sent from my iPhone

I understand that, but the fact that that it is so easy for superman to get the f23 blocked. Also if I let the b3 go all superman has to do is nothing then punish. I know grundys damage is great, but he needs a bar to do it. That's what I meant by that.

 

[xQUANTUMx]

I understand that, but the fact that that it is so easy for superman to get the f23 blocked. Also if I let the b3 go all superman has to do is nothing then punish. I know grundys damage is great, but he needs a bar to do it. That's what I meant by that.

Gotcha . I understand your perspective. Keep in mind also that superman also needs 1 bar and does not go that high. His meterless is pretty meh


Sent from my iPhone

 

[Compbros]

Supes meterless is only around 30 percent, he needs bar to do anything damaging.

 

[The Gabriel]

Supes meterless is only around 30 percent, he needs bar to do anything damaging.

that's not much of a relevant critique for any character considering the abundance of meter in this game, and 30 percent is actually great damage for meterless anyway.

 

[Compbros]

that's not much of a relevant critique for any character considering the abundance of meter in this game, and 30 percent is actually great damage for meterless anyway.

I was responding to the "I know grundys damage is great, but he needs a bar to do it" thing. It's the same for Superman and many other members of the cast.

 

[Solid]

Please dont insult me. I am stating what is obvious and I didnt disrespect any of you. If you have the balls to insult someone on here try to make an argument. I hope the mods will deal with you. Karried

 

[Solid]

You are the dumbest motherfcker so far in this thread, and that's saying a lot.

os, 12 minutes ago Report

Please dont insult me. I am stating what is obvious and I didnt disrespect any of you. If you have the balls to insult someone on here for no reason you shouldnt be on these forums. I hope the mods will deal with you. Karried

 

[Euphoric]

I don't even know what's going on.

os, 12 minutes ago Report

Please dont insult me. I am stating what is obvious and I didnt disrespect any of you. If you have the balls to insult someone on here for no reason you shouldnt be on these forums. I hope the mods will deal with you. Karried

 

[Raynex]

It's threads like these that keep me from posting as much as I used to. You guys should have stopped feeding the troll 6 pages ago.

F23 is probably the best string in the game, but it has its weaknesses. Some characters can deal with it exceptionally well, others can't (diverse match-ups surprise surprise). To all the regular posters in the Supes boards: don't add fuel to the fire, ignore shit like this in the future. This thread isn't about constructive dialogue or debate; this is about Gabriel's dissatisfaction with Ares / Superman. The dude is shooting down all helpful advice.

We should make one thread for "How to beat F23" and leave it at that because this is getting ridiculous.


edit:

It's ok man people are stupid and don't know how to block a laser and then punish as he's coming down from it. It's just to hard to walk in patiently, block an air laser and duck a heat zap smh

In many cases you can just jump heat vision (both ground and air) and avoid it altogether. Like I've been saying for weeks its hitbox deteriorates and the lasers will pass through you near the end of its active frames. Only time you really have to block it is if you're close, and then you can punish him if he doesn't [MB].

omg.....sigh no you cannot d2 or d3 on reaction. The best you can hope for is to trade and that's if it's on the frame perfect. The move has to be 7 frames or faster AND be able to hit superman. You are terribly misinformed please just stop

Flash can D2 to interrupt. F23~Breath, [Flash D2 here] F23~etc

The move doesn't have to always be 7 frames. F2 can lose to moves that lower a character's hurtbox (thereby negating difference in frames), Flash's D2 is one of them. Stop arguing with Superman mains in the Superman board who developed and created Superman combos / tech / strats. Accept that you're doing it wrong and try again. My training partner plays Flash and has been doing this to me since day 1.

 

[Compbros]

It's threads like these that keep me from posting as much as I used to. You guys should have stopped feeding the troll 6 pages ago.

Some people are merely misinformed and this thread has been shown to inform people that his breath is nowhere near the mess people believe it is.

 

[The Gabriel]

It's threads like these that keep me from posting as much as I used to. You guys should have stopped feeding the troll 6 pages ago.

F23 is probably the best string in the game, but it has its weaknesses. Some characters can deal with it exceptionally well, others can't (diverse match-ups surprise surprise). To all the regular posters in the Supes boards: don't add fuel to the fire, ignore shit like this in the future. This thread isn't about constructive dialogue or debate; this is about Gabriel's dissatisfaction with Ares / Superman. The dude is shooting down all helpful advice.

Please point me to one piece of helpful advice in this thread. It's basically superman mains saying over and over stuff that either doesn't work (just d1! just dash back!) or is completely impractical (just push block!).

Seriously, there is only *one* thing I can do, and this is meter burn 3 if I know he is going to do another f23 after the breath (and if I have meter). If he baits the next f23, or does trait instead, then I've just wasted a meter and brought on punishment.

It's ridiculous. At the start of a match, I can know 100% that superman is going to do f23, *and I am completely powerless to do ANYTHING about the opening gambit*. The whole point of fighting games, the whole theory behind their competitive nature, is that you figure out what the opponent is going to do so you can respond/punish accordingly. This entire building block flies out the window with Superman, who is *already* overpowered from a variety of standpoints *without* the f23 string.

So please, be helpful to me - start of match. superman is going to f23. I know he's going to f23. What do I do?

 

[Compbros]

Please point me to one piece of helpful advice in this thread. It's basically superman mains saying over and over stuff that either doesn't work (just d1! just dash back!) or is completely impractical (just push block!).

Seriously, there is only *one* thing I can do, and this is meter burn 3 if I know he is going to do another f23 after the breath (and if I have meter). If he baits the next f23, or does trait instead, then I've just wasted a meter and brought on punishment.

It's ridiculous. At the start of a match, I can know 100% that superman is going to do f23, *and I am completely powerless to do ANYTHING about the opening gambit*. The whole point of fighting games, the whole theory behind their competitive nature, is that you figure out what the opponent is going to do so you can respond/punish accordingly. This entire building block flies out the window with Superman, who is *already* overpowered from a variety of standpoints *without* the f23 string.

So please, be helpful to me - start of match. superman is going to f23. I know he's going to f23. What do I do?

How does backdash/d1 (if your character can) not work? Tyrant did it to me, people in casuals did it to me, people online have done it to me. How is pushblock impractical considering how much meter you build in this game and that it gets Supes off you? You can't just use it all the time, you have to be smart about it.


If the Superman reads what you were doing and punishes it then they made a good read just like if you think they're going for another F23 and blow them up then you made a good read.

Jump, backdash, attack, there's a multitude of things to do. F23 doesn't propel Supes halfway across the screen and cover all jump space, it's got an 8 frame start up, pick something that beats it.

 

[The Gabriel]

How does backdash/d1 (if your character can) not work? Tyrant did it to me, people in casuals did it to me, people online have done it to me. How is pushblock impractical considering how much meter you build in this game and that it gets Supes off you? You can't just use it all the time, you have to be smart about it.

As the person who I quoted stated, I use Ares. He cannot backdash or d1 the string. A few other characters are also incapable. Jumping back doesn't work at all either, and actually leads to a full combo from superman because f23 anti-airs.

Pushblock is impractical because you can't waste one bar of meter for zero damage every time he wants to do a regular string. Do I really have to explain that to you? And this is why you obviously dodged my point about the start of the match (when you have no meter).

If the Superman reads what you were doing and punishes it then they made a good read just like if you think they're going for another F23 and blow them up then you made a good read.

Not sure what this has to do with what I wrote. I already explained that the only way to blow up the f23 is to meter burn 3 the second rep - but if he doesn't go for the second rep in order to bait out the meter burn, you've wasted a meter and are gonna get blown up for it.

Jump, backdash, attack, there's a multitude of things to do. F23 doesn't propel Supes halfway across the screen and cover all jump space, it's got an 8 frame start up, pick something that beats it.

Can't jump, can't backdash. 8 frame start-up for a standing normal that covers that much distance is insanely fast. There is nothing that beats it. That's the whole point.

 

[Compbros]

As the person who I quoted stated, I use Ares. He cannot backdash or d1 the string. A few other characters are also incapable. Jumping back doesn't work at all either, and actually leads to a full combo from superman because f23 anti-airs.

Pushblock is impractical because you can't waste one bar of meter for zero damage every time he wants to do a regular string. Do I really have to explain that to you? And this is why you obviously dodged my point about the start of the match (when you have no meter).
Not sure what this has to do with what I wrote. I already explained that the only way to blow up the f23 is to meter burn 3 the second rep - but if he doesn't go for the second rep in order to bait out the meter burn, you've wasted a meter and are gonna get blown up for it.


Can't jump, can't backdash. 8 frame start-up for a standing normal that covers that much distance is insanely fast. There is nothing that beats it. That's the whole point.

Just tested that, crouching jab beats it. I'll do more testing but it seems to work, it just needs to be close. If it's at the edge of the string/breath you can stand jab and it trades/beats the string. Also, why not just get hit by breath and get knocked back? Why not start a string or try to jab out in case they go trait/something besides breath and just take the breath if they use that?

No, DON'T do it every single time. If he's abusing it, push block and do your own pressure/zoning/whatever to put yourself into an advantageous position. It's to get him off you so you can get into your stuff, not to just be like "F23" "pushblock" "f23" "pushblock".


Just said crouching jab beats it but I gotta do more testing.


Edit: I can record it if you like and you can tell me what I'm doing wrong and why I can beat it.


Edit 2: I just punished it from d1 for 26 percent meterless without even playing Ares, am I missing something here?

 

[KDZ]

You are the dumbest motherfcker so far in this thread, and that's saying a lot.

YOU are the the fucking problem with competitive gaming. Every player like you. Who thinks adapting is impossible, just nerf it until I can easily beat it.

 

[Apoc]

This Gabriel guy must have been raped by some Supes player, most likely humiliated that he needs to open up a thread on how "op" a string is, not every character is the same, you being an ares player nullify Supes zoning, let Supes have the string pressure.

And I tested Ares against this claimed broken string and he can d1 effectively, not to mention that as many have stated a Supes going for a 2nd string+breath is a gamble, so if it was working against you, why would the guy stop, YOU are the bad one that allows it.

This reminds me of Doomsday early release, dude seemed OP as fuck, for many nubs(most likely YOU) he still is, +frames on like 6 different moves with good mix ups, people don't bitch you know why? BECAUSE GOOD PLAYERS ADAPT.

 

[Compbros]

Just got done playing Alucard, he blew up F23 breath everytime I did it except once. Stop complaining and learn.

 

[Solid]

I don't even know what's going on.

this Gabriel guy attacks me and insults me for no reason in this thread. I never mentioned him or attacked him in any post to provoke this. I don't think you guys should allow this without taking some action against him. He even liked your post smh. It's like he can go calling anybody dumb motherf'er for free. I can't accept this stuff especially without any provocation. Only on the Internet can people to this stuff.