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Guide Catch Me If You Can -- The Flash General Discussion Thread

Redk9

Redk9

Mortal
Konqrr said:
Double dive kick midscreen combos... the better ones that end in 13 for hard knockdown setups... you know, the good ones? Have you read the last 3 pages of the BA combo thread? lol
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Black Adams combo's really aren't as difficult as the flash's.
 
S

shoshinsha

Apprentice
So I've been playing around with a defensive strategy revolving around trait. It's a LITTLE gimmicky, but I've had some decent success with it.

Basically, you do a defensive shake when you either read an attack or are blocking a string you know you can interrupt. You have to pause a split second to let the attack whiff through your shake, and then you cancel shake into db3, which is i6. You then have enough trait time left that you can get 4 or 5 df1's in, ending with a 3~bf2 for hard knockdown. This is basically a no-meter counter for around 40% health. If you have full meter, you can end with 3~super for 60% damage. That's even more situational, but it's a great way to end a round quickly.

You can do similar to the above when you read and shake a projectile, but you have to use bf2 or dd2~f3 and then it's a bit trickier to figure out how to get the spacing for the juggle.

Just thought I'd share. Try it out and lemme know what you think!
 
Xenrail

Xenrail

Apprentice
shoshinsha said:
So I've been playing around with a defensive strategy revolving around trait. It's a LITTLE gimmicky, but I've had some decent success with it.

Basically, you do a defensive shake when you either read an attack or are blocking a string you know you can interrupt. You have to pause a split second to let the attack whiff through your shake, and then you cancel shake into db3, which is i6. You then have enough trait time left that you can get 4 or 5 df1's in, ending with a 3~bf2 for hard knockdown. This is basically a no-meter counter for around 40% health. If you have full meter, you can end with 3~super for 60% damage. That's even more situational, but it's a great way to end a round quickly.

You can do similar to the above when you read and shake a projectile, but you have to use bf2 or dd2~f3 and then it's a bit trickier to figure out how to get the spacing for the juggle.

Just thought I'd share. Try it out and lemme know what you think!
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why would anyone who's in range for an uppercut be using projectiles?
 
S

shoshinsha

Apprentice
You use the uppercut option when your shake makes them whiff a melee attack. You use the charge option when your shake makes them whiff a projectile from mid range.
 
S

shoshinsha

Apprentice
You'd be surprised how effective it is when timed right. But that's not what I meant. I'm talking about a few specific situations:

1. Against lunging attacks (Superman's f2 for example) or jump-ins. When you know your opponent's aggressive and is going to try to pressure you, the shake->trait->i6 uppercut is surprisingly effective at interrupting.

2. When you're being block pressured with a string that you know has a gap in it.

3. When you read a big attack like an armored b3 or something.

Please try it out before knocking it via theory craft.
 
Xenrail

Xenrail

Apprentice
shoshinsha said:
You'd be surprised how effective it is when timed right. But that's not what I meant. I'm talking about a few specific situations:

1. Against lunging attacks (Superman's f2 for example) or jump-ins. When you know your opponent's aggressive and is going to try to pressure you, the shake->trait->i6 uppercut is surprisingly effective at interrupting.

2. When you're being block pressured with a string that you know has a gap in it.

3. When you read a big attack like an armored b3 or something.

Please try it out before knocking it via theory craft.
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i never said i was knocking it. i'm just saying it isn't very practical vs good players because the timing is way too strict. if you fat finger something on accident, say for example while superman's f2 is still going through your speed dodge you'll eat a full punish and waste your trait.

i've done speed dodge xx trait xx RMS f3 / uppercut into full strings before, but i don't use it with speed dodge unless i make a fantastic read say for example on an interactable
 
DGOD PSYCHO

DGOD PSYCHO

#YOLOSWAGMUFFIN
Xenrail I actually tested shoshinsha theory on speed dodging lights like Supermans F21 string.
he's actually right. its pretty effective, I actually tried it on a couple of good superman players, and I ended up getting full combo punishes because they were thrown off.

You can also Speed dodge certain wake up attacks that arent punishable, like KF's slide. you can speed dodge and punish with the MB. same with cyborgs wake up. etc.
Now as for trait cancelling, yeah dude that shit works. you gotta time it correctly though..
 
WaywardStranger

WaywardStranger

Boob
Speed dodge can stop--and make punishable--nearly any one-hit attack that isn't an overhead (I can't think of an example that beats it). It'll even stop Bane's charge with level-three venom. It's only a matter of time before it's put to good use interrupting strings, i.e. in those same frame gaps out of which smart players already backdash.

I came across this tech early. It's difficult to employ, for sure, but it's absolutely viable tech on a MU to MU basis.
 
DGOD PSYCHO

DGOD PSYCHO

#YOLOSWAGMUFFIN
WaywardStranger said:
Speed dodge can stop--and make punishable--nearly any one-hit attack that isn't an overhead (I can't think of an example that beats it). It'll even stop Bane's charge with level-three venom. It's only a matter of time before it's put to good use interrupting strings, i.e. in those same frame gaps out of which smart players already backdash.

I came across this tech early. It's difficult to employ, for sure, but it's absolutely viable tech on a MU to MU basis.
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I just wanted to stay, theres no point of phasing banes charge. nuetral jump, Slow down time, full combo punish.. ;)
 
WaywardStranger

WaywardStranger

Boob
DGOD PSYCHO said:
I just wanted to stay, theres no point of phasing banes charge. nuetral jump, Slow down time, full combo punish.. ;)
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If you Speed Dodge Bane's charge he stops directly in front of Flash in a stunned state, waiting to be punished. With all due respect ;), there is no simpler way to full-combo punish the charge attack. Moreover, Flash does the most damage when he initiates his trait mid-combo. Your way, as outlined above, requires the use of Trait in order to punish in the first place. That doesn't count as a full-combo punish in my book.

Full deconstruction available upon request.
 
Xenrail

Xenrail

Apprentice
WaywardStranger said:
If you Speed Dodge Bane's charge he stops directly in front of Flash in a stunned state. With all due respect ;), there is no simpler way to full-combo punish the charge attack. Moreover, Flash does the most damage when he initiates his trait mid-combo. Your way, as outlined above, requires the use of Trait in order to punish in the first place. That doesn't count as a full-combo punish in my book.

Full deconstruction available upon request.
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speed dodge is the best option if he venom charges you about mid screen. you can reaction dodge it and full combo punish immediately after. neutral jumping it would be a waste because he would charge to the end of the screen. neutral jump at max screen would allow a full punish though.
 
DGOD PSYCHO

DGOD PSYCHO

#YOLOSWAGMUFFIN
WaywardStranger said:
If you Speed Dodge Bane's charge he stops directly in front of Flash in a stunned state, waiting to be punished. With all due respect ;), there is no simpler way to full-combo punish the charge attack. Moreover, Flash does the most damage when he initiates his trait mid-combo. Your way, as outlined above, requires the use of Trait in order to punish in the first place. That doesn't count as a full-combo punish in my book.

Full deconstruction available upon request.
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oh really? thats interesting. I'll have to try that ;)
 
Xenrail

Xenrail

Apprentice
well, today was a pretty crucial day for Flash. After some testing ares, shazam, raven can all effectively mitigate on knockdown Flash's pressure with his 50/50, resets etc due to added invincibility frame on their teleports. Also even if you see the teleport coming, you cannot punish it on reaction. They can completely cock block Flash's pressure and corner control by using this wakeup.

Sinestro's arachnid sting is completely safe on reversal and wakeup if you account for online lag. otherwise you can punish it with 6f lightning uppercut.

Once again there are no downsides to spamming these wakeups against Flash.

Flash just got moved down the tier list to B--.
 
AndyrooxDS

AndyrooxDS

Fully charged
Could i have a overview on the flash please, involving where you think he places on a tier list atm and his pros n cons.
much appriciated.
 
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