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Guide Catch Me If You Can -- The Flash General Discussion Thread

II TH4 K1NG II

II TH4 K1NG II

Noob
I only use flashs trait in combos to carry them over to the corner then I start spamming d12 df1 mb, 11,11,11,112bd3 or use the b21 string as the starter to mix it up a bit.
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
LEGEND said:
Flash doesn't need any Alts imo, i don't think he has a single bad match-up. Possibly some 4-6s, but its too early to tell

My only real alternate character that is any good atm is Green Arrow, and so far i don't see any match-ups where going with him over the Flash is a good idea.
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What about grundy?

Picked up flash but because I hate his normal costumes I waited till I unlocked his elseworlds costume.

Why is this section half-dead?
 
LEGEND

LEGEND

YES!
Qwark28 said:
What about grundy?
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its alittle awkward, but you have all the tools you need. You can come in with B22 for free alot of the time and if grundy uses armor you can cancel out to Sonic pound, Flying Uppercut or bounce cancel

Reacting to swamp hands is something you need to get used to so you can get wiff punishes on it, or at least free pressure

Time loop is very good against grundy as well, you pretty much gee a free 50/50 every time you use it. Or you can use it to capitalize of wiff punishes more
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I really think the biggest thing in this MU is just looking out for WC when you are attacking. Second most important part is making Swamp Hands wiff
Qwark28 said:
Why is this section half-dead?
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I haven't played the character really at all this week so i have had nothing to contribute. Been focusing on sinestro lately
can't speak for everyone else though. Don't know whats going on there
 
Xenrail

Xenrail

Apprentice
I don't understand for a character that shares similar abilities like others only his are punishable.

Lightning uppercut - Punishable on block (similar to WW's uppercut except her is nearly impossible to react to in time to punish)
Lightning dash - Easily punishable on block (similar to Shazam's version except his is safe on block and it's also fullscreen unlike flash's who has trouble dealing with projectiles)
Sonic Pound - Punishable on block, too much recovery frames for a mixup string.
d2 - has terrible reach and is not a viable choice for anti air. safe on block
d3 - his best low reach ability but is punishable on block compared to others.
b22 - startup seems too long. i can't punish unless i predict a string/special and startup ahead of time
d12 - d1 has terrible reach, spam isn't as fast as other character d1.
113 - haven't really found a practical use most of the time though i use it time to time with no success against better players. They usually anticipate an overhead (f21) and then block low after to counter that string.

the only safe wake up for flash is df1. his f21 strings also get countered by a lot of wakeups. d12 seems alright, but it's reach is horrible
for the most part flash's normals are sub par at best.
d12 xx df3 is a great mixup to mess with their mind (low, low, overhead)
f21 xx df1 on block makes you appear to be vulnerable. opponents like to stop blocking after df1 and respond with their counter. after df1 delay/stagger then db3. connects most of the time

the best midscreen combos i found so far for 1 meter is 41-44%. using more than one meter seems to be a completely waste (it's usually 1-2% extra damage)
the best corner combo i found so far for 1 meter is 41-43%.
best midscreen combo for 1 meter+trait is 54%
overhead and trait for 62%
transition combos for 39-40%+
 
Hiltzy85

Hiltzy85

I'm THAT fast
Can anybody give a rundown of what projectiles you can actually avoid using running man stance? In my experience, it seems really inconsistent, in that sometimes they go over my head when I'm in the stance standing still, sometimes they go over me when I'm running, and sometimes projectiles that I can crouch normally hit me in the stance.
 
Konqrr

Konqrr

MK11 Kabal = MK9 Kitana
DGOD PSYCHO Here's the video:


Lightning Charge punishes all backdashes, you just can't do it too early.

By following their dash you can punish with:

- f21 on characters that have short backdashes
- b22 on everyone else

You should be punishing with b22 anyways as the damage is always higher.

Once you punish them for backdashing a couple times, they will think twice about doing it and it opens up your pressure game.
 
Xenrail

Xenrail

Apprentice
Konqrr said:
DGOD PSYCHO Here's the video:


Lightning Charge punishes all backdashes, you just can't do it too early.

By following their dash you can punish with:

- f21 on characters that have short backdashes
- b22 on everyone else

You should be punishing with b22 anyways as the damage is always higher.

Once you punish them for backdashing a couple times, they will think twice about doing it and it opens up your pressure game.
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great video but requires some intense reading.

b22 xx LKDC into b22 sonic pound mb punish is also punishable.

they can avoid dashing during your LKDC and punish you there, so still 50/50.

most players who confront flashes who try to constantly string will attempt to backdash, so this tip would probably be better utilized here. at the same time, some players like using wakeups or d1
 
DGOD PSYCHO

DGOD PSYCHO

#YOLOSWAGMUFFIN
Konqrr said:
DGOD PSYCHO Here's the video:


Lightning Charge punishes all backdashes, you just can't do it too early.

By following their dash you can punish with:

- f21 on characters that have short backdashes
- b22 on everyone else

You should be punishing with b22 anyways as the damage is always higher.

Once you punish them for backdashing a couple times, they will think twice about doing it and it opens up your pressure game.
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This is practical in a match?
I don't really think so Konqrr. And its not a matter of punishing opponents on back dash, even if it can be done. You can't do that on reaction, you can do that on a guess. Dashing right into your opponent is too risky. Its not even worth it at all. Flashs lightning charge is so negative. its not even worth using. At all. this is not In match/in-game probable.
His strings with mids that are put as mids are not even true mids.. this should be fixed no matter what bro.
He can use better advantage.
A 6F down one. ( it has barely any reach and he is the flash.)
Improvements to his chip.
and his projectile shake needs to be able to be used on reaction.
in a match, reaching with 15+ frame start ups is impossible.
i tried what you did just now, and if you don't get it within 4-5 frames you're off, and getting full combo punished. 85% of the time they block. I get that you are trying to put a side to the argument, but please hear me out. he doesn't have any match up better than 5-5. and what he has just doesn't stack up to the other characters and you know it. He has to chase you like a dog and take 15-20% chip before even getting any sort of pressure, which can now be dashed out of and be 85% of the time be safe. This is not in match probable.. imagine mis reading a back dash, and you went for a lightning charge for punish..
imagine mis reading a back dash, you did a D1D2 and they escaped, and are zoning you.
Imagine mis reading a back dash, forward dashed into your opponent and got full combo punished. its too risky. way too risky. it doesn't make any sense. Xenrail LizardLard
I took flash to 1st place 3 times in a row i know what im talking about. guess why? they all said " i only lost to yo because i have no idea how to play vs flash." ...
 
Konqrr

Konqrr

MK11 Kabal = MK9 Kitana
It is what it is... if your opponent backdashes after one of your moves to avoid pressure, make a read (guess) that he will do it next time and punish him for it.

If you don't want to take the risk, then block after your string and if they backdash hit them with LC like shown in the video.

Of course the timing is tight and it's difficult to do. Did you expect to land it in the first few tries? It takes practice.

I absolutely agree that Flash needs some buffs.

You should try Black Adam. Most of his best combos are very difficult and require a ton of practice to be able to do them in a match.
 
DGOD PSYCHO

DGOD PSYCHO

#YOLOSWAGMUFFIN
Konqrr said:
It is what it is... if your opponent backdashes after one of your moves to avoid pressure, make a read (guess) that he will do it next time and punish him for it.

If you don't want to take the risk, then block after your string and if they backdash hit them with LC like shown in the video.

Of course the timing is tight and it's difficult to do. Did you expect to land it in the first few tries? It takes practice.

You should try Black Adam. Most of his best combos are very difficult and require a ton of practice to be able to do them in a match.
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:( you really didn't read what I said about reading. It's impossible. man.. trust me what you are saying is not practical in a match, no one can do that unless its luck. You're talking about combos. Black adam is easy mode, i can do them. But please stop trying to compare adam to flash or any other character. Flash has NO projectiles and does the lowest chip in the whole game. and his speed dodge is useless. I appreciated the video and you make some great points, but trust me this is what it is. What you are doing is not practical in a in game match. Combos that you practice and can do, practical. Reads that can cost you the match, that you have to hit within 5 frames? really now? :/ I hope you will come to realize later in the game once people know how to fight flash people will be begging for a buff. I assure you i know what I am talking about in regards of flash I play him at a very high level..
 
LizardLard

LizardLard

Mortal
I'm going to make a short video tomorrow showing some things that I have talked about. This whole thing has kind of unnecessarily exploded and I want to clear a few thihgs up.
 
DGOD PSYCHO

DGOD PSYCHO

#YOLOSWAGMUFFIN
LizardLard said:
I'm going to make a short video tomorrow showing some things that I have talked about. This whole thing has kind of unnecessarily exploded and I want to clear a few thihgs up.
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The mod showed abusive power and closed the thread for no good reason. the thread needs to be unlocked. Thats an important thread.
 
LizardLard

LizardLard

Mortal
DGOD PSYCHO said:
The mod showed abusive power and closed the thread for no good reason. the thread needs to be unlocked. Thats an important thread.
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Haha ya it actually pissed me off so much because I had just finished typing this massive thing and then I went to submit it and...thread closed. Pretty lame.
 
SaJa

SaJa

FH_FenriR
Konqrr said:
You should try Black Adam. Most of his best combos are very difficult and require a ton of practice to be able to do them in a match.
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They aren't as hard as flash trust me. I can constantly do every BA's combos online. I can't with the flash (df1 MB, d2, b3 is the hardest b3 of the game and I also play Lobo. His ground pound, dash, 3, 2, charge 32% is out of online). BA is also top tier. He is just 100x easier to play for better results. ^^
The only bad thing BA has is a small reach for all his normals. Just like the flash beside his b2.

I'm also agree with your video, but the point is that even on read, Flash takes risks compare to other good characters.
 
DGOD PSYCHO

DGOD PSYCHO

#YOLOSWAGMUFFIN
I play flash at high level, but this player didn't know how to fight me.
@57:39 flash vs supes.
He didn't zone, didn't back dash my strings, didn't punish etc..
Now look at this.
@52:09
harley player wasn't so good, but escaped all of my pressure. and you could see i tested every option.
he even reacted to punish my lightning charge mid start up.
if he were to zone me, block charges, punish, flash is free. understand at what I am saying now, Konqrr i will make more videos. (i've won 3 locals already, 1st, trying to go to a major)
http://www.twitch.tv/mr_swizzer/b/403511761
 
DGOD PSYCHO

DGOD PSYCHO

#YOLOSWAGMUFFIN
Spitfire Riggz said:
Do you mention you have won 3 tournaments placed 1st in every other post?
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No. Just for the flash stuff because everything he does is a gimmick and I'm trying to get my point across that he needs to be given a first aid kit. i don't know how else to explain my point but i will keep trying until its given. I'll take as much heat as possible but i wont insult anyone. I must get this done the right away.
 
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