Match-up Discussion Kung Lao Match-Up Chart December 2012

[Big Pampering]

Pig beat Brady last time they played and it was recorded. It may be a 6-4 idk, I just really hate Mileena and she is really tough in my opinion when I use Kung Lao

for it to be a real 6-4 you do need to maxamise youre damage, that means on a blocked roll you need to do specific punish combo, the damage is one of the biggest reasons why it would be kung lao favor. f3 to get in and you will be point blank range, low hat is safe on block against mileena. the thing you need to keep in mind, all she really has is d4. so she is eventually going to have to standup to pressure you with her strings or jump anything else that she does is unsafe. once she stands up she WILL have to deal with your 7 frame jab. some mixups I use are 24 overhead-24 low hat. 24 into standing 3(hits mid). and you can also cancel the standing 3 into lowhat.

another thing I use in this matchup is if I knock the mileena player down I will make it look as if I am going to pressure her and instead use an ex teleport, if she did a wakeup roll you can use the overhead off of the teleport to punish her roll for 37%. if she didnt do a wakeup attack you can whiff the grab and continue your offense.

 

[Axel_Redd]

21212 is punishable by lift....but i believe ermac only has a couple of frames to execute it, gotta check the data again. if he doesnt get it perfect, then he'll eat a full combo from it.

i still say kung vs ermac is 6-4 for the most part. the only thing he has over kung is his damage. If you hesitate, kung lao will find away to get in. and when he does, ermac is gonna have problems.

 

[YOMI DJT]

it wont save her but I was just saying if mileena players made better use of their low hitbox they would do better. also your match vs pig at dallas, the way you connected 24 on mileena shouldnt be happening all that often at all, Pig was probably doing a d4 and doing a backdash after it, which made him vulnerable to standing 2.

that's fine because even if mileena use her hitbox better they still are going to lose to a lao that knows. There is no way that the matchup is even it needs to be changed 6-4 MINIMUM lao wins it.

 

[YOMI DJT]

sonya beats lao 6-4
lao beats smoke 7-3

 

[Big Pampering]

that's fine because even if mileena use her hitbox better they still are going to lose to a lao that knows. There is no way that the matchup is even it needs to be changed 6-4 MINIMUM lao wins it.

im fine with 6-4 you got me convinced, pig is probably the only one who can make it almost look 5-5. Ive never had any trouble with mileena but if I watch pig, I feel like I dont play the right mileena's, but her options are probably just limited.

 

[YOMI DJT]

im fine with 6-4 you got me convinced, pig is probably the only one who can make it almost look 5-5. Ive never had any trouble with mileena but if I watch pig, I feel like I dont play the right mileena's, but her options are probably just limited.

her options are limited vs lao. its a bad mu for mileena.

 

[xInfra Deadx]

21212 is punishable by lift....but i believe ermac only has a couple of frames to execute it, gotta check the data again. if he doesnt get it perfect, then he'll eat a full combo from it.

i still say kung vs ermac is 6-4 for the most part. the only thing he has over kung is his damage. If you hesitate, kung lao will find away to get in. and when he does, ermac is gonna have problems.

Just looked...You got ONE frame to punish.

 

[Death]

lao players just need to learn the mileena mu. mileena is not a safe character at all. all her specials punishable on block by lao. too much upplaying of mileena vs lao

Most KL players still don't know how to play their character lol

I am surprised that king is even bringing up the teleport. Mileena keep away and up close game is so bad. Just walk up to her and do whatever u want

 

[YOMI DJT]

Most KL players still don't know how to play their character lol

I am surprised that king is even bringing up the teleport. Mileena keep away and up close game is so bad. Just walk up to her and do whatever u want

its a free W for lao this match is not debateable. I would even agree with 7-3 lao. mileena doesn't go even with lao aha.

 

[Axel_Redd]

i wonder tho....i wonder why sonya would be a 4-6 for lao.

 

[Metzos]

When you Kung Lao gets in from a tele or dive kick he is most likely going to standing~2, which will beat Ermac's throw. If he is going to throw hats it is going to be to trade, not just throw hats in open space while Ermac isn't doing anything. If Ermac isn't doing anything than Kung Lao is most likely going to just dash in. If 21212 is punishable by lift than that could be a game changer, but if it is not punishable by lift than Ermac is in some big trouble. 1o% chip damage plus half a bar of meter built for Kung Lao, 34% on hit if Ermac doesn't block it. That means every time Kung Lao gets in he builds a ton of meter and chip damage for free, but I'm not for sure if 21212 is punishable or not by Ermac

Agreed with all you said. As for the MU though, we'll just have to agree to disagree then.

 

[SquirtMcGirt]

FOREVER KING hay man sup? Long time no see lol

 

[pboardplayer]

Ive always believed this was 6-4, I just dont say it cuz ppl here are divas and think Kung lao is way better than he is.

pboardplayer maybe could chime in?

Sorry about the super delayed response. I am not on the here as much as I should be. I think the quan lao match-up is easily 5-5....with a tag line of "really annoying for kung lao". I wouldn't say 6-4...because lao can hold his own in this mu. If the quan player is patient and knows how to expose lao with his ultra fast uppercut. quan can pretty much duck and uppercut EVERYTHING lao does...from his 1121, 21 and his teleport. The lao player must take a different approach. No teleports and no randomness its a much more methadical approach. Picking and choosing when to rush down, when to back off and when to use meter. Because 1 screw up=death.(if quan has meter) To sum it up, quan prevents lao from being lao.

Like I said, thats just from my experiance in playing good quan players who know that mu. 5-5(super annoying for kung lao)

 

[pboardplayer]

Agreed with all you said. As for the MU though, we'll just have to agree to disagree then.

This is just my opinion. I use ermac as a secondary to kung lao. I know the lao match up very well. I think ermac does very very well against lao. He shuts lao down. Consider this....

if lao teleports....ermac can uppercut...to lift and get 30 percent or more everytime so the teleport is null i that mu. Ermacs force push prevents lao from dive kicking in and starting pressure. With this you create a chicken game keeping lao at full screen....he will be cautious to teleport and dive kick in and be constantly holding block..wating for a force push....in which the ermac player can dash in and throw or pressure. Blocked dive kick=48 percent or more. blocked spin equals 40 percent and up too. Also ermac can duck and uppercut all of laos strings...such as 1121 and 21. So it can be difficult to pressure him. Ermac just has to be patient.

And YES ermac can punish 212121. with a 12 lift. It is my personal opinion that ermac has an advantage in that mu...I would label it a 6-4 ermacs favor. However this is just my opinion from experiance. Does anyone have some new light on the subject? Thoughts anyone?

 

[Metzos]

This is just my opinion. I use ermac as a secondary to kung lao. I know the lao match up very well. I think ermac does very very well against lao. He shuts lao down. Consider this....

if lao teleports....ermac can uppercut...to lift and get 30 percent or more everytime so the teleport is null i that mu. Ermacs force push prevents lao from dive kicking in and starting pressure. With this you create a chicken game keeping lao at full screen....he will be cautious to teleport and dive kick in and be constantly holding block..wating for a force push....in which the ermac player can dash in and throw or pressure. Blocked dive kick=48 percent or more. blocked spin equals 40 percent and up too. Also ermac can duck and uppercut all of laos strings...such as 1121 and 21. So it can be difficult to pressure him. Ermac just has to be patient.

And YES ermac can punish 212121. with a 12 lift. It is my personal opinion that ermac has an advantage in that mu...I would label it a 6-4 ermacs favor. However this is just my opinion from experiance. Does anyone have some new light on the subject? Thoughts anyone?

Thank you. Couldnt have put it better myself. But i wouldnt go as far and say its a 6-4 Ermac though. KL is still dangerous when he gets in. And i agree with you that all of KL's starting pressure strings can be interrupted with uppercuts or down pokes. Even his low hat pressure is full combo punishable on block now. People underestimate Ermac cause he has no armor. That is ignorance. He is super solid and people have just started to see that. If he had armor on top of everything else he would be for sure top 10 (although in my book he is top 10) and very close to being top 5 imo.

 

[Big Pampering]

Sorry about the super delayed response. I am not on the here as much as I should be. I think the quan lao match-up is easily 5-5....with a tag line of "really annoying for kung lao". I wouldn't say 6-4...because lao can hold his own in this mu. If the quan player is patient and knows how to expose lao with his ultra fast uppercut. quan can pretty much duck and uppercut EVERYTHING lao does...from his 1121, 21 and his teleport. The lao player must take a different approach. No teleports and no randomness its a much more methadical approach. Picking and choosing when to rush down, when to back off and when to use meter. Because 1 screw up=death.(if quan has meter) To sum it up, quan prevents lao from being lao.

Like I said, thats just from my experiance in playing good quan players who know that mu. 5-5(super annoying for kung lao)

if you know he is going to uppercut, duck it and 21 punish it.

 

[Axel_Redd]

kung lao beats ermac 6-4, and goes 5-5 with sonya

 

[DemoniChris]

quan chi at at least 5-5

 

[Axel_Redd]

quan chi at at least 5-5

quan is a 4-6 vs lao....when lao can spin all your mixups, ur in some serious trouble.

 

[DemoniChris]

quan is a 4-6 vs lao....when lao can spin all your mixups, ur in some serious trouble.

yes he can spin out of overhead but not out of low. either he commits to blocking low or goes for a risky spin that can get him blown up. can't spin out of traps either

 

[Owerbart]

You act like I'm only an online player and have no offline experience whatsoever. I know the fuckin difference lol. I have dabbled my feet a little here in there in the offline tournament scene.

Anyways, obviously Kung Lao wins the matchup up close which you already stated before. Kung Lao is considered one of the hardest characters in the game to keep out and zone, if it is tough for Freddy/Kabal/Kenshi to zone Kung Lao than what makes Ermac any special? One blocked TKP equals dive kick in or f3 roll in. One read fireball equals Kung Lao teleport 3 on reaction or just dive kick over. Kung Lao has to play smart in the matchup and can't teleport all over the place like in some match ups because Ermac easily punishes, but it still not that difficult for Kung Lao to get in and start his offense. Most of Ermac's normals are too slow to compete with Kung Lao and Ermac has no armor. So once Kung Lao gets in, he is in for a while and can harass Ermac with 1121 and 21 strings. I'm not even sure if Ermac has anything fast enough to punish 21212

Because TKP has active frames on the whole hitbox instantly. it's not a ball which needs to travel some part of the screen to actually connecting with the opponent. Also he doesn't need to engage in the guessing game as he can play it safe and backdash, and lift KL's ass.

21212 on block can be punished by 1 lift or 12 lift

 

[TargetAudience]

Sonnya vs KL is deff 7-3 on this bitch favor. she outzones him, outpokes him and everything she does is safe with huge range on her retarded fast normals.

I think its funny how some people like to called us scrubs because we struggle vs sonnya yet they dont use KL vs sonnya they rather use sonnya vs sonnya lol... also u can uppercut in between 12 overhead or ex catwell.

 

[Illmatix]

ok so let's talk about johnny cage vs kung lao.... i just started using kung against my bro's johnny and my god.... kung lao's zoning is underrated ! you got those low hats to make him jump, that long range overhead if he tries to crouch block in, and if you AA him with it it sends him full screen. if he approaches on the ground you got 24 overhead which out footsies f3, on hit sends him full screen and on block he cant't do shit cuz you can spin him on reaction. also he can't corner me because of ex tele lol. i think forever king is right dont try to pressure johnny, zone him out it's pretty hilarious.

 

[TargetAudience]

ok so let's talk about johnny cage vs kung lao.... i just started using kung against my bro's johnny and my god.... kung lao's zoning is underrated ! you got those low hats to make him jump, that long range overhead if he tries to crouch block in, and if you AA him with it it sends him full screen. if he approaches on the ground you got 24 overhead which out footsies f3, on hit sends him full screen and on block he cant't do shit cuz you can spin him on reaction. also he can't corner me because of ex tele lol. i think forever king is right dont try to pressure johnny, zone him out it's pretty hilarious.

6-4 jcs favor.

 

[Illmatix]

6-4 jcs favor.

dude try it some time it's kinda fun, and i want to see a good johnny vs. a good lao zoning him out. dude seriously, it's actually quite braindead to zone him out... kung has so many tools.