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Kitana General Discussion

John_NX

John_NX

Your circumstances are dire!
Dramatique said:
So i've been playing strictly fan-fare recently, and there is my thoughts on how to make this character viable:
First off all NRS really need to nerf Highborn chip damage and fix on block framedata, it's really weird to play when you nor your opponent know if + or -, makes no sense. Just random.

About Fan-Fare and in general buffs
- b1 11 frames from 13, we already have one of the slowest d1 in the game, so our primary punisher move shoudn't be that slow, not to mention game literally filled with characters that have 6f d1 THAT also have better mid and on top of that can also zone with you.
-bf3 being able to amplify on block
-FIX b231 WHIFF ISSUES FOR GOD SAKE
-opponent not being able to breakaway from fan-lift

Those little tweaks and buffs will really make her solid character in my opinion.

In General i hope they will also make pokes more minus on block for all characters, like being -2 after 6f d1 is pretty bullshit i think.
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Spot on!
 
Nevan_PTF

Nevan_PTF

All your mains belong to me!
John_NX said:
Unbreakable damage
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I don't think making a launch-able move to have unbreakable properties, is a good idea or is what that variation really need. Giving her that would create a problem, because NRS would have to make adjustments to the rest of the launchers to be unbreakable. That would help some characters, like Skarlet, Kitana, just to name a few, but it would make others really powerful, like The Spins Kabal, eating a shit ton of damage everytime he touches you.

A universal change that could be reasonable, would be to let you break away after a determined amount if hit count on the combo. This would be a good change, enabling more characters to guarantee unbreakable damage and also create mindgames around when to break away and how to deal with it.

Sry for my take being more generic and not fully centered on Kitana.
 
DarksydeDash

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
Nevan_PTF said:
I don't think making a launch-able move to have unbreakable properties, is a good idea or is what that variation really need. Giving her that would create a problem, because NRS would have to make adjustments to the rest of the launchers to be unbreakable. That would help some characters, like Skarlet, Kitana, just to name a few, but it would make others really powerful, like The Spins Kabal, eating a shit ton of damage everytime he touches you.

A universal change that could be reasonable, would be to let you break away after a determined amount if hit count on the combo. This would be a good change, enabling more characters to guarantee unbreakable damage and also create mindgames around when to break away and how to deal with it.

Sry for my take being more generic and not fully centered on Kitana.
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It's because Kitana has to rely on your opponent to make the mistake and even if they do, they get out of jail for free. Another thing that Highborne negates entirely.
 
DarksydeDash

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
Zviko said:
Again, how? Fan lift would still lift them up right? Which means the very next attack would make them airborne which means they can breakaway. Also you can get 20% unbreakable already in every variation.
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Ymwith the proposed change, they cant break away from the first hit. IA Amp fan toss, dash d2, would all be unbreakable.

Any string into lift, would allow more damage since air fans are unbreakable as well.

Even something simple as string, lift, d2, is basically 20% if we had this change.
 
M2Dave

M2Dave

Zoning Master
Juxtapose said:
I still don't understand the desire to nerf Highborn. Why nerf something that's working well?
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So Kitana can be utilized according to some people's subjective opinion of "good" and "fun", but what they fail to realize is that Highborn is arguably as effective as Kitana will ever be in this game.

People want combos, for example, yet jab punishes aside, the grounded resets with razors are much better than any traditional 30% combo, particularly in this game where the wake up attacks are numerous.
 
Zviko

Zviko

Warrior
DarksydeDash said:
Ymwith the proposed change, they cant break away from the first hit. IA Amp fan toss, dash d2, would all be unbreakable.

Any string into lift, would allow more damage since air fans are unbreakable as well.

Even something simple as string, lift, d2, is basically 20% if we had this change.
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But with all that you are assuming they will breakaway so you never do the optimal. It's like yeah, they can't breakaway but you'll always do like 5% less because of it or you'll do pretty much the same as now if you go for optimal but they breakaway. So is it really a buff? I just don't see it.
 
Juxtapose

Juxtapose

Master
M2Dave said:
So Kitana can be utilized according to some people's subjective opinion of "good" and "fun", but what they fail to realize is that Highborn is arguably as effective as Kitana will ever be in this game.

People want combos, for example, yet jab punishes aside, the grounded resets with razors are much better than any traditional 30% combo, particularly in this game where the wake up attacks are numerous.
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Right, but that's what I mean. Why nerf Highborn at all?

Fan-fare can have adjustments made to it, and after time if it proves that Highborn becomes god-tier as a result of global changes to the character, then rebalance it. Why pre-emptively nerf it at all? That's just silly talk.
 
John_NX

John_NX

Your circumstances are dire!
Arqwart said:
B14 Razor. B14 sai cancel. D3. Grab. B14 razor. 12 razor punish. B14 razor. B231 razor. Razor razor.

Razor.
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Hey you forgot some things! 12 sai cancel. F234 sai cancel. F234 razor. B1 sai cancel. F2 sai cancel. All of the above into teleport to catch them poking. Highborn in a nutshell :)
 
Arqwart

Arqwart

D'Vorah for KP2 copium
John_NX said:
Hey you forgot some things! 12 sai cancel. F234 sai cancel. F234 razor. B1 sai cancel. F2 sai cancel. All of the above into teleport to catch them poking. Highborn in a nutshell :)
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I will admit that I have unironically used razors at a distance when I have someone in the corner just to either catch a forward roll attempt out of the corner or to simply fuck with them. It's amazing how many people will just straight up freeze after getting up.
 
armani

armani

Mortal
I think a good remedy to the unbreakable lift vs breakable lift argument is to add a meter burn property to lift, maybe a cool spinny animation too; akin to Kung Lao’s amplified spin. at least at that point it can be used as a situational tool rather than an easy path to guaranteed damage. would definitely help out fanfare & fearless.
 
xWildx

xWildx

What a day. What a lovely day.
There is no “argument” for allowing people to breakaway from lift or not. The fact of the matter is Kitana is the only one who’s capture state you can break away from.

Cetrion geyser? Sub freeze in the air? Nomad dash? None of these other capture moves behave this way, why does Kitana’s?

It’s not even a matter of damage to me at this point, it just annoys the fuck out of me how inconsistent things are in the design of this game.
 
Zviko

Zviko

Warrior
xWildx said:
There is no “argument” for allowing people to breakaway from lift or not. The fact of the matter is Kitana is the only one who’s capture state you can break away from.

Cetrion geyser? Sub freeze in the air? Nomad dash? None of these other capture moves behave this way, why does Kitana’s?

It’s not even a matter of damage to me at this point, it just annoys the fuck out of me how inconsistent things are in the design of this game.
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There are arguments for those though. Cetrion has to amplify it to get a launcher. Ice ball doesn't even do any damage if you don't amplify it. And if you could breakaway from Nomad dash it wouldn't affect Kabal at all. He wouldn't really lose a lot of damage for that. Exactly the same as Kitana.

It would be better if they just reduce the damage scaling from fan lift. Nothing else would really buff that move.
 
xWildx

xWildx

What a day. What a lovely day.
Zviko said:
There are arguments for those though. Cetrion has to amplify it to get a launcher. Ice ball doesn't even do any damage if you don't amplify it. And if you could breakaway from Nomad dash it wouldn't affect Kabal at all. He wouldn't really lose a lot of damage for that. Exactly the same as Kitana.

It would be better if they just reduce the damage scaling from fan lift. Nothing else would really buff that move.
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Point being, a capture state is just that, a capture state. You’re just arguing semantics.
 
Zviko

Zviko

Warrior
xWildx said:
Point being, a capture state is just that, a capture state. You’re just arguing semantics.
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Not true at all. Everyone gets that "capture state" differently and everyone gets something different from it. And it's balanced based on the whole character not just that move specifically. Kabal is probably way above Fan Fare and Fearless right? If they make Nomad dash the same as fan lift, do you really think he'd fall down the tier list to Kitana level? I don't think so. This is not the buff you want.
 
xWildx

xWildx

What a day. What a lovely day.
Zviko said:
Not true at all. Everyone gets that "capture state" differently and everyone gets something different from it. And it's balanced based on the whole character not just that move specifically. Kabal is probably way above Fan Fare and Fearless right? If they make Nomad dash the same as fan lift, do you really think he'd fall down the tier list to Kitana level? I don't think so. This is not the buff you want.
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It’s almost as if typing things out on this forum means absolutely nothing when people just start to argue for no reason, put words in your mouth, and spout off annoying, hyperbolic bullshit.
 
EMPRESS_SunFire

EMPRESS_SunFire

Regina George of discord
Zer0_h0ur said:
Watched Sunfirexo on exhibition last night on Ragnarok's stream, she has such a clean kitana.
I noticed as fearless or fanfare after B141 on block, she'd instantly shorthop (either U2 or U3) couldn't tell which one. Thing is, this clipped a guy as an anti-air twice who tried to jump in on her off blocked B141
Is this some known Kitana tech? Was this a flawless block OS? She DID flawless block off blocked B141 later in the set. Kinda cool that shorthop would cover a jump in.
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Thank you!! and yeah, that was definitely a flawless block u2 attempt lol
 
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