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MK11 Kano Discussion

Wallach

Noob
I'm a little confused about what people are saying about B1. This does not feel like a hit-confirmable button to me. The upside I guess is that nobody's punishing B1 into knife toss, but it doesn't feel like the most compelling way to dissuade D1 mashers. If it were hit-confirmable B1 into amp ball would give you a decent knockdown which would make more sense to me.
 

DubiousShenron

Beware my power.
After playing strictly Dirtbag variation I would suggest 2 things.

Make 241 cancellable for more damaging confirms and combos and also make chemical burn safer on block like -12.

Anyone agree this would fix his problems?
 

Trevor

Mortal
I just noticed that I never do that kick followup after I land F4. I'm not talking about the crushing blow, I'm referring to the regular punt kick he does after the overhead. How is that done?

I'm referring to this one on the ripper loadout:
 
I just noticed that I never do that kick followup after I land F4. I'm not talking about the crushing blow, I'm referring to the regular punt kick he does after the overhead. How is that done?

I'm referring to this one on the ripper loadout:
That is F43. Your variation needs manhandled (like Ripper) to get that string. I'm pretty confident you need to followup your F4 with 3 to get the krushing blow as well.
 

Red Hood MKX

Mercenary dog
Ok guys we need to stop with the kano up play in this tread. Its good to be optimistic but its gonna bite us in the butt in the long run. Kano has some glaring weaknesses as a character.

Sonic fox said so himself he said kano is the second worse character in the game after dvora i couldn't agree more. Their is really no reason to use kano. most of the cast does everything he can but better we need to get our heads out of the sand and start asking for buffs asap or were gonna be looking at another cybernetic kano all over again.

Im still gonna use him no matter what but he needs help. Anyone who says different is in denial.

Just buffs like making his standing 2 a mid

Give us 1 more hit of b3 that way we can stagger it etc

And completely rework dirtbag its probably the worse variation in the game
 

Trevor

Mortal
Ok guys we need to stop with the kano up play in this tread. Its good to be optimistic but its gonna bite us in the butt in the long run. Kano has some glaring weaknesses as a character.

Sonic fox said so himself he said kano is the second worse character in the game after dvora i couldn't agree more. Their is really no reason to use kano. most of the cast does everything he can but better we need to get our heads out of the sand and start asking for buffs asap or were gonna be looking at another cybernetic kano all over again.

Im still gonna use him no matter what but he needs help. Anyone who says different is in denial.

Just buffs like making his standing 2 a mid

Give us 1 more hit of b3 that way we can stagger it etc

And completely rework dirtbag its probably the worse variation in the game
I say all he needs is snakebite on his ripper loadout wiht the extising moves. Being able to do highdamage combos out of 11 starters would be more than enough for me. His mixup game is pretty damn good as it is. It's his combo potential that is highly nerfed by the lack of combo extenerds that start with 1 for the punishes.
 
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Trevor

Mortal
That is F43. Your variation needs manhandled (like Ripper) to get that string. I'm pretty confident you need to followup your F4 with 3 to get the krushing blow as well.
I use ripper, as I am sure the tournent players are forced to use ripper or dirtbag as well, or they are allowed to use custom? My point being. This works with ripper then, right?
 

DubiousShenron

Beware my power.
Ok guys we need to stop with the kano up play in this tread. Its good to be optimistic but its gonna bite us in the butt in the long run. Kano has some glaring weaknesses as a character.

Sonic fox said so himself he said kano is the second worse character in the game after dvora i couldn't agree more. Their is really no reason to use kano. most of the cast does everything he can but better we need to get our heads out of the sand and start asking for buffs asap or were gonna be looking at another cybernetic kano all over again.

Im still gonna use him no matter what but he needs help. Anyone who says different is in denial.

Just buffs like making his standing 2 a mid

Give us 1 more hit of b3 that way we can stagger it etc

And completely rework dirtbag its probably the worse variation in the game

Dirtbag is underpowered but the concept is there.

It’s when you start saying stuff like ‘make s2 a mid’ that I start to question your integrity. Making s2 a mid doesn’t fit the game meta and it also won’t do anything to make him better or worse..

Edit: kano needs a variation with snakebite or magnetic trap and he’s good. One last thing is that it’s laughable you respect Sonics evaluation of any character or tier list considering he’s laughably wrong everytime.
 
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Dirtbag is underpowered but the concept is there.

It’s when you start saying stuff like ‘make s2 a mid’ that I start to question your integrity. Making s2 a mid doesn’t fit the game meta and it also won’t do anything to make him better or worse..
So I guess everyone else can have integrity except for Kano. Making S2 would complete his meta and make him 1000x better. Have you played the character?
 

DubiousShenron

Beware my power.
So I guess everyone else can have integrity except for Kano. Making S2 would complete his meta and make him 1000x better. Have you played the character?
Yes dude please don’t get smart. You condition the opponent to block and then s2 is a mid on block...that’s how the game works. So clearly you’re playing him wrong. They could buff the hitbox on s2 to hit a character like crouching Sonya cause it currently whiffs on breathing hurtboxes.

This discussion forum was going well let’s not get bogged down on small details that don’t really matter
 
I use ripper, as I am sure the tournent players are forced to use ripper or dirtbag as well, or they are allowed to use custom? My point being. This works with ripper then, right?
The tournaments I have seen require players to use the two tournament variations and not customs.
Yep, you can use F43 with Ripper. I am not an advanced player but I've gotten good mileage out of it.
 

Red Hood MKX

Mercenary dog
Yes dude please don’t get smart. You condition the opponent to block and then s2 is a mid on block...that’s how the game works. So clearly you’re playing him wrong. They could buff the hitbox on s2 to hit a character like crouching Sonya cause it currently whiffs on breathing hurtboxes.

This discussion forum was going well let’s not get bogged down on small details that don’t really matter

Dude seriously our fastest safe mid is 16 frames are you kidding me. Lui kang and jax all have 9 frame mids its not breaking the game. we need something better than b3 im sorry.

Like i said most of the cast does everything Kano can but better if you disagree with me i might have to question your integrity. This kano up play needs to stop its gonna hurt us kano mains in the long run.
 
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Deleted member 5032

Guest
I don't know what ya'll are talking about. I've been playing the game almost non-stop since release, using Kano almost exclusively. I've played some great players, including @Eldriken's ridiculous Skarlet. If Kano is low-tier, that makes this the most balanced fighting game to have ever been made, because right now I think Kano has the tools to deal with any matchup that I've come up against. Does he have some 6/4s? Definitely, but I haven't played anything I felt was even close to a 7/3, and I'm the guy who made a post about how Cheetah literally can't beat Batman in I2 (and I stand by it...).
  • His overhead starter is mildly reactable, but only -7. Combined with his b4, this gives him a 100% safe 50/50 game.
  • In a game where the current meta is d1d1d1d1, Kano's Rack Off parry absolutely destroys people's ability to play the way they're used to. That parry is one reason I think he can't be bottom-tier. When you're in a d1 war, just cancel your d1 into Parry and watch the opponent defeat themselves.
  • Between his parry, low starters, overhead, and command grab, his oki game is straight-up bananas. I get a lot of flawlesses without my opponent ever getting a chance to take a turn. Every time I get a knockdown (and with that b4, I'm getting knockdowns all damn day) my opponent has to guess between all that crap. If they guess correctly, I either eat an armored wakeup or am left slightly negative on block.
  • His knife is a decent projectile, and is excellent at making the opponent respect your ranged options.
  • If you're complaing about his high starters, just use jp's and jk's to jail your opponent into standing guard. Jumping attacks are bonkers in this game. The least plus I've been after a blocked jumping attack is +8. The most I've gotten from a late JK is +15. So use that shit! Are you getting anti-aired? Then Air Ball those bitches until they learn your air game cannot be contested.
 

DubiousShenron

Beware my power.
Dude seriously our fastest safe mid is 16 frames are you kidding me. Lui kang and jax all have 9 frame mids its not breaking the game. we need something better than b3 im sorry.

Like i said most of the cast does everything Kano can but better if you disagree with me i might have to question your integrity. This kano up play needs to stop its gonna hurt us kano mains in the long run.
I play the game competitively but I use dirtbag unlike all you guys so my opinion may be irrelevant. I been having a good time with him.

I wanna know what everyone else thinks
 

Trevor

Mortal
In a game where the current meta is d1d1d1d1, Kano's Rack Off parry absolutely destroys people's ability to play the way they're used to. That parry is one reason I think he can't be bottom-tier. When you're in a d1 war, just cancel your d1 into Parry and watch the opponent defeat themselves.

Wait, his rack off parry works on d1? I thought it only worked on standing moves? that is awesome!
 
I play the game competitively but I use dirtbag unlike all you guys so my opinion may be irrelevant. I been having a good time with him.

I wanna know what everyone else thinks
My Co
I play the game competitively but I use dirtbag unlike all you guys so my opinion may be irrelevant. I been having a good time with him.

I wanna know what everyone else thinks
He's not bad, it's just that he has a lot of glaring problems. However, the upplay is nice, at least we're not toxic about this character.
 
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Deleted member 5032

Guest
Wait, his rack off parry works on d1? I thought it only worked on standing moves? that is awesome!
It works on all mid, high, and overhead normals and even a lot of specials. It also works on throws. It won’t work on lows, projectiles, FB, or jumping attacks. It even works on wakeup attacks.
 
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Trevor

Mortal
It works on all mid and high normals and even a lot of specials. It also works on throws. It won’t work on lows, projectiles, FB, or jumping attacks. It even works on wakeup attacks.
Holy crap, the conditioning is unreal with that. I have had trouble due to some d1 spammerrs so far but knowing this is going to condition the crap out of them lol. D1 is the only poke that helps them avoid my pressure at times.
 
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Deleted member 5032

Guest
Holy crap, the conditioning is unreal with that. I have had trouble due to some d1 spammerrs so far but knowing this is going to condition the crap out of them lol. D1 is the only poke that helps them avoid my pressure at times.
Exactly. You have to make them afraid of parry and then you can get away with murder. Anytime they start getting poke-happy again, just start canceling into parry on block.
 

Trevor

Mortal
I love Kano, he is the most fun character without a doubt, and his combos are stylish as hell with lumbar. All I hope for is a loadout that includes Snakebite for Ripper and he would be a monster.
 

Paul the Octopus

Slow Starter
I don't know what ya'll are talking about. I've been playing the game almost non-stop since release, using Kano almost exclusively. I've played some great players, including @Eldriken's ridiculous Skarlet. If Kano is low-tier, that makes this the most balanced fighting game to have ever been made, because right now I think Kano has the tools to deal with any matchup that I've come up against. Does he have some 6/4s? Definitely, but I haven't played anything I felt was even close to a 7/3, and I'm the guy who made a post about how Cheetah literally can't beat Batman in I2 (and I stand by it...).
  • His overhead starter is mildly reactable, but only -7. Combined with his b4, this gives him a 100% safe 50/50 game.
  • In a game where the current meta is d1d1d1d1, Kano's Rack Off parry absolutely destroys people's ability to play the way they're used to. That parry is one reason I think he can't be bottom-tier. When you're in a d1 war, just cancel your d1 into Parry and watch the opponent defeat themselves.
  • Between his parry, low starters, overhead, and command grab, his oki game is straight-up bananas. I get a lot of flawlesses without my opponent ever getting a chance to take a turn. Every time I get a knockdown (and with that b4, I'm getting knockdowns all damn day) my opponent has to guess between all that crap. If they guess correctly, I either eat an armored wakeup or am left slightly negative on block.
  • His knife is a decent projectile, and is excellent at making the opponent respect your ranged options.
  • If you're complaing about his high starters, just use jp's and jk's to jail your opponent into standing guard. Jumping attacks are bonkers in this game. The least plus I've been after a blocked jumping attack is +8. The most I've gotten from a late JK is +15. So use that shit! Are you getting anti-aired? Then Air Ball those bitches until they learn your air game cannot be contested.
In my experience, the advantage on hit was too little from almost all knockdowns to enforce any real oki mid screen. I think I tested b4, command grab, and Kano ball, and the opponent holding back on wake up or backdashing got them out of everything Kano would attempt on knockdown. I was forced to dash up and then do something, but that’s a bit of a gimmick, since your opponent can move well before you in that scenario (your advantage on hit is not enough to dash and then do a button).

In the corner, the oki is good, but Kano has subpar corner carry.

Am I missing something? I thought his oki was good too at first but then I played a strong Cetrion player who just held back or back dashed on knockdown every time.
 
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Deleted member 5032

Guest
In my experience, the advantage on hit was too little from almost all knockdowns to enforce any real oki mid screen. I think I tested b4, command grab, and Kano ball, and the opponent holding back on wake up or backdashing got them out of everything Kano would attempt on knockdown. I was forced to dash up and then do something, but that’s a bit of a gimmick, since your opponent can move well before you in that scenario (your advantage on hit is not enough to dash and then do a button).

In the corner, the oki is good, but Kano has subpar corner carry.

Am I missing something? I thought his oki was good too at first but then I played a strong Cetrion player who just held back or back dashed on knockdown every time.
I dunno, I just dash and mix on knockdown. I can usually take someone to the corner very quickly, or I'll make them back into the corner. Either way, I haven't had any issues mixing people midscreen or in the corner, and then keeping them mixed once I get that knockdown.
 

Paul the Octopus

Slow Starter
I dunno, I just dash and mix on knockdown. I can usually take someone to the corner very quickly, or I'll make them back into the corner. Either way, I haven't had any issues mixing people midscreen or in the corner, and then keeping them mixed once I get that knockdown.
I think you’re opponents are being too respectful. You can react to Kano doing a dash up mix and react with a button. I don’t know the exact frames but just tried recording it and it seems pretty easy if you’re ready for it.

Kano can probably do some counter play - maybe he can get away with more overheads if the opponents is looking for a dash, but it doesn’t seem particularly strong imo.
 
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Deleted member 5032

Guest
I think you’re opponents are being too respectful. You can react to Kano doing a dash up mix and react with a button. I don’t know the exact frames but just tried recording it and it seems pretty easy if you’re ready for it.

Kano can probably do some counter play - maybe he can get away with more overheads if the opponents is looking for a dash, but it doesn’t seem particularly strong imo.
I mean, just like anything else in fighting games you can’t be mindless about it. All I know is I’ve had a ton of success with it, regardless of how respectful the opponent is.