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General/Other - Shinnok Shinnok General Discussion Thread

ArmedCalf

I guess I play Necromancer now.. PSN: ArmedCalf
Well she can only jump over HS if she makes a crazy read and executes it properly- it's a huge risk.

And the punishment or pressure of HS on block with f1 is extremely risky and hard to execute as well with the block stun.

Most characters can try to pressure with run up, but no body tries it because it's extremely risky

I've always personally thought d'vorah was a 7-3 match up in his favor, but I use Bone Shaper.

Kung jin's stolen move is garbo as well.
I don't play BS:/ Also, D'vorah has a way easier time pressuring after HS because she has a solid run speed and an advancing mid. Kung Jin's move is lovely! It's a mix-up and it's safe. Far better than say Jacqui, Goro, Takeda, Jason, D'vorah, Raiden, Predator etc.
 
Well she can only jump over HS if she makes a crazy read and executes it properly- it's a huge risk.

And the punishment or pressure of HS on block with f1 is extremely risky and hard to execute as well with the block stun.

Most characters can try to pressure with run up, but no body tries it because it's extremely risky

I've always personally thought d'vorah was a 7-3 match up in his favor, but I use Bone Shaper.

Kung jin's stolen move is garbo as well.

Boneshaper is definitely a different matchup from impostor. There's a good chance he wins that but impostor doesn't have the same range or meter building options.
 
I don't play BS:/ Also, D'vorah has a way easier time pressuring after HS because she has a solid run speed and an advancing mid. Kung Jin's move is lovely! It's a mix-up and it's safe. Far better than say Jacqui, Goro, Takeda, Jason, D'vorah, Raiden, Predator etc.
BS's game should'not be too much different vs D'vorah. I don't think Shinnok should be doing HS vs most of the cast unless he has a bar of meter. F1 doesn't really change that.

I doubt it's better than Goro's unblockable or Takeda and predator's vortex off of mimicry. KJ's steal is average at best.
 

ArmedCalf

I guess I play Necromancer now.. PSN: ArmedCalf
BS's game should'not be too much different vs D'vorah. I don't think Shinnok should be doing HS vs most of the cast unless he has a bar of meter. F1 doesn't really change that.

I doubt it's better than Goro's unblockable or Takeda and predator's vortex off of mimicry. KJ's steal is average at best.
Definitely better than Goro's scaled stomp that you can only whiff to be a little plus and Predator's invisibility that makes a 50/50 harder to see at the cost of not being able to use mimicry for 10 seconds. Maybe not Takeda though you got me there.
 
Definitely better than Goro's scaled stomp that you can only whiff to be a little plus and Predator's invisibility that makes a 50/50 harder to see at the cost of not being able to use mimicry for 10 seconds. Maybe not Takeda though you got me there.
You can't use mimicry after using predator's invisibility? I'll have to check on that one.

And goro's stomp is still fairly plus on hit and a hard knockdown last time I checked, so you can't completely discount that one.

It's been awhile since I took imposter seriously, but every is talking about how good he is so maybe I'll give him another try. He still doesn't seem as solid as BS, though.
 

legion666

Champion
It feels 5-5 to me. She can jump over hellsparks with her high jump arc if she spaces herself correctly and after a blocked hellspark she can run and punish with f1 or at least start pressure.

Edit: Her stolen move is also complete trash
Again you can still vortex herby whiffing the move)
 

legion666

Champion
You have enough time to to wiff your attacks and then go for a string or grab but you don't have enough time for a jump in for the unfuzzyable. A grounded oh or low is fuzzyable.
It takes 41 frame to whiff the stolen Oviposter Charge, Mimicry's hitstun lasts 104 frames, you have 63 frames to do whatever! It is definitely enough to make the mix up unfuzzyable. Even 20 frames would be enough as the overhead would be guaranteed and you can always delay the low)
 
It takes 41 frame to whiff the stolen Oviposter Charge, Mimicry's hitstun lasts 104 frames, you have 63 frames to do whatever! It is definitely enough to make the mix up unfuzzyable. Even 20 frames would be enough as the overhead would be guaranteed and you can always delay the low)
Yeah your definitely right. I tried this off of f224 and it gives me enough time to wiff the attack and time a 50/50 with a b3 or delayed low. How would you end your combos in order to ensure you have enough space? This doesn't work for me in the corner and optimal bnbs leave them too close.
 

legion666

Champion
Yeah your definitely right. I tried this off of f224 and it gives me enough time to wiff the attack and time a 50/50 with a b3 or delayed low. How would you end your combos in order to ensure you have enough space? This doesn't work for me in the corner and optimal bnbs leave them too close.
Of course you have to adjust your BnBs for specific match ups. You loose damage but gain the right spacing. In the corner it is usually isn't worth it (you basically spend meter to do 20+% damage and gaining the space to whiff stolen moves but taking your opponent out of the corner, while you can do like 40+% for a bar, keeping them in the corner but having to deal with an oki situation) For match ups like Sonya, D'vorah, Kenshi, Kung Jin, sometimes Jax etc. I go for these midscreen:
F4xxHell Sparks MB the 3rd spark, walk back a bit then standing 4xx Mimicry
B3, F224xxMimicry is standard - it is the best meterless overhead option into Mimicry anyway and it gives space to whiff moves.
 
Of course you have to adjust your BnBs for specific match ups. You loose damage but gain the right spacing. In the corner it is usually isn't worth it (you basically spend meter to do 20+% damage and gaining the space to whiff stolen moves but taking your opponent out of the corner, while you can do like 40+% for a bar, keeping them in the corner but having to deal with an oki situation) For match ups like Sonya, D'vorah, Kenshi, Kung Jin, sometimes Jax etc. I go for these midscreen:
F4xxHell Sparks MB the 3rd spark, walk back a bit then standing 4xx Mimicry
B3, F224xxMimicry is standard - it is the best meterless overhead option into Mimicry anyway and it gives space to whiff moves.
I get that losing damage is the result of spacing mimicry. S4 mimicry works well. It's better to lose 4% then keep these trash stolen moves. Thanks.
 

legion666

Champion
I get that losing damage is the result of spacing mimicry. S4 mimicry works well. It's better to lose 4% then keep these trash stolen moves. Thanks.
Ok! I think I have found a better combo for whiffing stolen moves and it does 1% more than f4xxHell Sparks MB 3rd spark, 4xxMimicry))

It is F4xxHell Sparks MB 1st spark, Ji2xxAir Tricky Portal, NJP, 4xxMimicry (22% and 29% with the damage boost)
In order to whiff Kung Jin's cartwheel you have to hit the standing 4 as early as possible and do the stolen cartwheel as soon as you can after recovering from Mimicry, so that Kung Jin doesn't step in the range of the cart wheel being tranced) most of other useless moves whiff just fine)
 

ArmedCalf

I guess I play Necromancer now.. PSN: ArmedCalf
Word on the street is Necromancer can hold up while doing df4 for a new brutality. Haven't tried it yet though
 

zaf

professor
what is the unfuzzyable mix up you guys talk about off a jump in ? is it just delayed F4 and B3 oh ?