General/Other - Smoke XL Robo Smoke Discussion Thread

[Syknis]

Vortex is gender specific, female characters eat the B1 smoke bomb meterless

Last night I was getting away with having no meter and going into b3 smoke bomb :0

 

[Smarrgasm]

For people who are fuzzying f13 and b1 have a similar time frame. It would be like how quans used to use 12 as their low cause it was safer and hit closer to the timing of their b2.

 

[Altsa]

Guys I feel bad when I loop the vortex more than 2 times...

 

[xKhaoTik]

b1 x sb connects on low blocking males and females, exception being bigger hitbox characters. If you want to guarantee the combo, opponent is mashing buttons, then you can do spear or ex sb.

Edit: I was testing on Sub Zero who's hitbox, is apparently, small enough for it to work on. My fault on not checking other males @boba_buster

Okay then why go invisible at all then?

It seems like you guys are trying to come up with way too much fancy/technical stuff just to do the same exact vortex. For what? Going invisible and then doing b1 ex sb is a waste of 2 bars when I can just do 3 phase b1 exsb for a bar. Going invisible and then doing b1 sb on a female is a waste of a bar when I can just do 3 phase b1 sb for a METERLESS VORTEX.

Just keep it simple. No reason to spend extra bars, stamina or none of that stuff just to get the same results. It's lame to me.

@EMPEROR PRYCE I get what you're saying but smoke is a vortex character. If I end combos with F21 ex invis, not only do I not get the vortex, but I'm giving my opponent the chance to breathe. Once I get my vortex going, I'm going to keep doing it until it stops, especially since it's safe and one of the options leaves me +8.

 

[boba_buster]

Okay then why go invisible at all then?

It seems like you guys are trying to come up with way too much fancy/technical stuff just to do the same exact vortex. For what? Going invisible and then doing b1 ex sb is a waste of 2 bars when I can just do 3 phase b1 exsb for a bar. Going invisible and then doing b1 sb on a female is a waste of a bar when I can just do 3 phase b1 sb for a METERLESS VORTEX.

Just keep it simple. No reason to spend extra bars, stamina or none of that stuff just to get the same results. It's lame to me.

@EMPEROR PRYCE I get what you're saying but smoke is a vortex character. If I end combos with F21 ex invis, not only do I not get the vortex, but I'm giving my opponent the chance to breathe. Once I get my vortex going, I'm going to keep doing it until it stops, especially since it's safe and one of the options leaves me +8.

Dude if you got smoke figured out and know the best way to play him jus stop discussing it with us . That's okay we will find more stuff while ur stuck on day one game plans. No offense but that is the wrong thought pattern to have when we're trying to find tech etc.

 

[boba_buster]

And we are trying to find a way to use invis without using 2 bars that's the whole point

 

[xKhaoTik]

Dude if you got smoke figured out and know the best way to play him jus stop discussing it with us . That's okay we will find more stuff while ur stuck on day one game plans. No offense but that is the wrong thought pattern to have when we're trying to find tech etc.

I'm not stuck on day 1 stuff but I'm just saying I don't see the whole point of the whole invisibility thing. Doesn't make sense to me.

Sometimes keeping it simple it what you need to do. Reminds me of IGAU when people were doing unnecessary stuff with Frost and Batgirl, yet Fox and I kept it simple and were recognized as the best for the characters.

Nothing wrong with finding tech. Hell I just posted tech yesterday. But this ex invisibility stuff b1 exsb stuff is just LOL to me.

 

[boba_buster]

It jus takes time , and everything should be hashed out , think about the pressure that ice clone puts on ppl even tho all u gotta do is block low and react to the oh . That's the same thing invis can do for smoke midscreen

 

[Scott The Scot]

especially since it's safe and one of the options leaves me +8.

Some people can jump out of a blocked mixup and punish. Cassie can Ex Flip to punish it. Characters with fast NJP's like Quan chi can punish it like that. To punish them for trying to punish you, you need to use a bar on Ex Smoke Bomb in order to beat NJP's but you're still open to being armoured. Anybody with armour can punish Smoke for it.

Edit: I mean between the oh/low and smoke bomb.

 

[xKhaoTik]

It jus takes time , and everything should be hashed out , think about the pressure that ice clone puts on ppl even tho all u gotta do is block low and react to the oh . That's the same thing invis can do for smoke midscreen

Definitely not the same thing lol.

Ice clone is a physical attack that keeps you trapped because of the freezing effect is causes, leaving you open for a combo. Because of that, it gives sub the opportunity to do a low, OH or even grab. Same with Bo's fart.

Smoke's ex invis is not even close to that. You use it to cause the opponent to panic, and probably cause them to make a mistake, and capitalize on it. You are not going to use it the same way sub using ice clone, or even how reptile uses his ex invisibility.

It's like you're missing the point. This game is highly meter dependant because breakers are such an important tool. So smoke using ex invisibility in a vortex situation just seems stupid to me. It's going to be the same vortex regardless, and since he gets a meterless vortex on females, I seriously don't see the point to it.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Some people can jump out of a blocked mixup and punish. Cassie can Ex Flip to punish it. Characters with fast NJP's like Quan chi can punish it like that. To punish them for trying to punish you, you need to use a bar. Anybody with armour can punish Smoke for it.

Quan can njp sb? Or the gap in between b1/b3 sb?

But yea I knew about armoring the gap or cassie punishing it. Very few characters can punish the actually sb tho. I guess I shouldve said mildly safe, like Kitana's shadow kick and stuff lol

 

[boba_buster]

I know it doesn't work the same way as clone , I was jus trying to think of something to compare to it that induces panic and makes the opponent make a mistake , either way I was just making the point that we should be looking for new things not ignoring them cuz they seem off putting at first glance

 

[Scott The Scot]

Quan can njp sb? Or the gap in between b1/b3 sb?

But yea I knew about armoring the gap or cassie punishing it. Very few characters can punish the actually sb tho. I guess I shouldve said mildly safe, like Kitana's shadow kick and stuff lol

He can NJP between the gap.

If anybody has an armoured launcher then uh-oh lol. But some characters just have to hold it. I don't think anybody can backdash and punish thankfully lol.

 

[MajinBerserker]

The opponent still has to:
-Guess right on the 50/50
-React in time
-Have meter if they want the armor option

 

[boba_buster]

I hate to be the one to say it but if we don't find someway to utilize smokes invisibility isn't he just a lower damage version of inferno?

 

[boba_buster]

Let me rephrase that , he would be a safer version of no variation scorpion

 

[xSamuel]

Personally, I was just testing stuff for those who weren't able to test it at the time. It's a new character so people are just testing to see what he/they can do @xKhaoTik

 

[Groove Heaven]

So is 3~smoke toward totally necessary? Raw 3 seems to work just as fine as far as my testing goes. If you don't wanna sacrifice corner position or stamina, doesn't 3 into the mixup work almost as well? You're still +29 and b3 and b1 both reach the opponent. I feel like I'm missing something, though.

 

[xKhaoTik]

So is 3~smoke toward totally necessary? Raw 3 seems to work just as fine as far as my testing goes. If you don't wanna sacrifice corner position or stamina, doesn't 3 into the mixup work almost as well? You're still +29 and b3 and b1 both reach the opponent. I feel like I'm missing something, though.

It's not necessary. I just to it to build meter. He's still plus enough to get a guaranteed 50/50.

That's just me tho. I do float njp with kitana midscreen in combos when I could just do njp lol. Not necessary at all but it builds meter

 

[MajinBerserker]

Building meter and a free side switch definitely give it purpose. You mayyyyy run into a stamina issue from time to time, but that's no big issue since his follow up combos can be made stamina-less.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Personally, I was just testing stuff for those who weren't able to test it at the time. It's a new character so people are just testing to see what he/they can do @xKhaoTik

I know, I get it.


Look at it in this scenario:

You're fighting sub and he does an ice ball. You ex tele on reaction and hit. That's a bar right there but that's fine. Do whatever combo you want into a spear. Then you do ex invisibility. That's another bar. Then you do b1 ex sb, but it's blocked. That's 3 bars gone in less than 20 secs. See what I mean? Or what if sub decided to ex slide b1 ex sb and he had aura on? That's a full combo we have to eat and we can't break.

Just trying to put things into perspective

 

[Bomborge]

I hate to be the one to say it but if we don't find someway to utilize smokes invisibility isn't he just a lower damage version of inferno?

Wut? no, stahp. You're reaching everywhere so people will actually listen to you

 

[boba_buster]

Wut? no, stahp. You're reaching everywhere so people will actually listen to you

Lol

 

[boba_buster]

Wut? no, stahp. You're reaching everywhere so people will actually listen to you

Easy to say that but was it really that incorrect?

 

[IsrA9x19]

i dont think invisibility is a useless tool , but for sure its not needed for the vortex and sometimes its a waste of meter
I think the best way to use it is if your opponent is guessing right everytime , in that ocassion it makes sense to me to spent a meter .