General/Other - Smoke XL Robo Smoke Discussion Thread

[Bomborge]

How are you guys approaching the neutral? That's where I'm struggling for the most part with smoke. Especially up close since his pokes kinda aren't that good.

 

[Harlequin969]

How are you guys approaching the neutral? That's where I'm struggling for the most part with smoke. Especially up close since his pokes kinda aren't that good.

B214 to be plus and then do a d1, Should put you at enough advantage to do a f13 which I cancel into smokeball usually. That's one way at least.

 

[JesterSMX]

Can you please explain how we do the invisible vortex again is it a 1 frame link ? Does it guantantee 50/50 after ex invisibility

j2 leaves you at +50 and the recovery frames for the ex invis is 41. That leaves you 9 frames to jail him. F1 is 8 frames and leads to f12 which is a low option or f1 ex db4 gives you the overhead option for a vortex. I'm working on other setups to hit confirm a crossup before putting yourself out there with a fully punishable option.

 

[Red Hood MKX]

j2 leaves you at +50 and the recovery frames for the ex invis is 41. That leaves you 9 frames to jail him. F1 is 8 frames and leads to f12 which is a low option or f1 ex db4 gives you the overhead option for a vortex. I'm working on other setups to hit confirm a crossup before putting yourself out there with a fully punishable option.

Ok i see good stuff bro preciate the tech.

 

[Azmodeus]

i havent messed around with smoke yet, just Sektor, but from what i've seen, all of them have identical OH (B1) right?

yes, but smokes can't be meterburned like CSZ's or Sektors, so he has to commit to either something unsafe or EX smoke bomb

 

[Paper-Moon]

yes, but smokes can't be meterburned like CSZ's or Sektors, so he has to commit to either something unsafe or EX smoke bomb

so its the same treatment as the others, its unsafe on block, the only difference is some can extend the combo on hit.. Sektor has to EX straight rocket to make it safe as well.. not sure of the button after the b1 is also punishable, still the point is the same.

 

[Azmodeus]

so its the same treatment as the others, its unsafe on block, the only difference is some can extend the combo on hit.. Sektor has to EX straight rocket to make it safe as well.. not sure of the button after the b1 is also punishable, still the point is the same.

yeah basically.

 

[Gafar_NN]

Guys, can you help vs alien? If I do vortex b3, smoke bomb and he block low he can do d,f-3 and punish me, if I do b1 ex-bomb, he can do same shit with armor, so I don't have save vortex vs him?
So much gaps in smoke strings

 

[EMPEROR PRYCE]

Why does everyone think gaps kill a character?

Prepatch Tanya had gaps in her delayed rekkas and we all see how much those gaps held her down.

Anyway, aside from the gaps I'm almost positive the frame data for triborg is wrong. Not all of it, but there's some weird stuff about it.

 

[Harlequin969]

Why does everyone think gaps kill a character?

Prepatch Tanya had gaps in her delayed rekkas and we all see how much those gaps held her down.

Anyway, aside from the gaps I'm almost positive the frame data for triborg is wrong. Not all of it, but there's some weird stuff about it.

What do you mean in regards to the wonky frame data?

 

[Yinze]

Smoke bomb needs to be faster. Impossible to deal with good zoning

 

[iamShorteh]

Smoke bomb needs to be faster. Impossible to deal with good zoning

Against good zoners, I've found smoke away/towards more useful than smoke bomb. In the zoning perspective I see Smoke Bomb as more of a way to keep the opponent in check at full screen, and bait them to move. Against vertical projectile moves that can be low-profiled Smoke Bomb could still be used. If they have a slow start-up, you could even B21.

 

[nugava]

yes, but smokes can't be meterburned like CSZ's or Sektors, so he has to commit to either something unsafe or EX smoke bomb

b1 EX smoke bomb has a gap. You can do b1 EX spear, which is safe on block and has no gap, but doesn't lead to a vortex and doesn't do as much damage...

 

[EMPEROR PRYCE]

What do you mean in regards to the wonky frame data?

I'm at work right now so I can't quote numbers correctly to support my beliefs.

I'll make another post once I'm home and have labbed more

 

[boba_buster]

End in spear exinvis s3 for the invis vortex

 

[EMPEROR PRYCE]

Has any one else comboed b1 into smoke bomb meterlessly midscreen randomly?

I'll be playing matches and sometimes it'll work and sometimes it won't.

Normally it works after the hit stun of an attack before.


I can't seem to replicate it in the lab tho

 

[Icefyre]

Has any one else comboed b1 into smoke bomb meterlessly midscreen randomly?

I'll be playing matches and sometimes it'll work and sometimes it won't.

Normally it works after the hit stun of an attack before.


I can't seem to replicate it in the lab tho

It's only consistent after a knockdown in my experience so far with it, though I haven't explored it as much as I should have. For instance, try using b1xxdb1 as they are getting up from the fall of another smoke bomb. That's not optimal, of course, but it gets the point across I think.

 

[EMPEROR PRYCE]

It's only consistent after a knockdown in my experience so far with it, though I haven't explored it as much as I should have. For instance, try using b1xxdb1 as they are getting up from the fall of another smoke bomb. That's not optimal, of course, but it gets the point across I think.

I know you can combo it meterlessly from a meaty.

I'm just saying I've had it happen randomly in situations where the opponent was still standing.

 

[boba_buster]

It will combo on females if they are low blocking

 

[Icefyre]

Guys, can you help vs alien? If I do vortex b3, smoke bomb and he block low he can do d,f-3 and punish me, if I do b1 ex-bomb, he can do same shit with armor, so I don't have save vortex vs him?
So much gaps in smoke strings

Personally, I don't feel like the numerous gaps he has is a hinderance. It allows you to bait armor moves and punish with smoke forward or smoke away, depending on the reversal you're trying to bait.

His phase is very strong, in my opinion, and it seems to be pretty crucial to his gameplay, even outside of baiting reversals and whiff punishing strings/projectiles.

 

[xKhaoTik]

How are you guys approaching the neutral? That's where I'm struggling for the most part with smoke. Especially up close since his pokes kinda aren't that good.

F1 is a damn good poke. 8f advancing far reaching string that can easily be hitconfirmed into sb or ex tele for a vortex. It's a high tho so it can be ducked. F4 is a 10f advancing mid that reaches far as well. Either do f4d1, f43 or f42 (F43 and f42 has a gap tho). And of course, b21


On another note, I'm not a fan on ex visibility for a vortex. Spend a bar to turn invisible and then spend another bar to combo off of b1? 2 bars is kinda a waste, especially if b1 is blocked.

 

[EMPEROR PRYCE]

F1 is a damn good poke. 8f advancing far reaching string that can easily be hitconfirmed into sb or ex tele for a vortex. It's a high tho so it can be ducked. F4 is a 10f advancing mid that reaches far as well. Either do f4d1, f43 or f42 (F43 and f42 has a gap tho). And of course, b21


On another note, I'm not a fan on ex visibility for a vortex. Spend a bar to turn invisible and then spend another bar to combo off of b1? 2 bars is kinda a waste, especially if b1 is blocked.

I am a VERY firm believer in ex invisibility but not to 50/50 with. End restands in f21 ex invisibility, leaves you in perfect b21 whiff punish range and anti air range. Cab also block if opponent has advancing armor (which is normally negative on block regardless)

The invisibility is used to provoke a reaction out of your opponents, because they literally can't see you they don't know how to approach. Normally people press buttons and I get the FREE-EST of b21 whiff punishes which can lead to 30+ meterlessly.

I highly suggest trying this and seeing what you can make of it. I believe it is worth a bar.

 

[ShaolinGunFu]

Smoke towards/away is a useful tool but the implications of it costing stamina has made me put some thought into the rest of his game. Ive tried to subtract almost every run cancel especially towards the end of combos and Im willing to not have optimal damage if it means holding on to it. Ive been caught with my stamina pants down not being able to breaker way too many times so far.

 

[zaccbarias]

hi guys, dunno if this has been posted but, after f21, you can delay the 3, and 4 part of the string to the point that it wont combo anymore, basically leading into more mixup game, from there, you can also delay phase and even delay teleport to mixup the low that can be done at the end of the string. This also works upon whiffing the f21 or the f21 being blocked , the down side is you cannot do this mechanic after a spear restand.

 

[boba_buster]

F1 is a damn good poke. 8f advancing far reaching string that can easily be hitconfirmed into sb or ex tele for a vortex. It's a high tho so it can be ducked. F4 is a 10f advancing mid that reaches far as well. Either do f4d1, f43 or f42 (F43 and f42 has a gap tho). And of course, b21


On another note, I'm not a fan on ex visibility for a vortex. Spend a bar to turn invisible and then spend another bar to combo off of b1? 2 bars is kinda a waste, especially if b1 is blocked.

Check the combo thread for my idea on one bar invis vortex on males and females