Match-up Discussion KILLER FROST - Official Community Match-Up Discussion

[Sultan]

Who do you guys think is a good compliment to Frost? I've been thinking about Deathstroke.

He forces characters like Cyborg and Martian to respect him - our definite bad match-ups. I also struggle against Bane personally, and I feel Deathstroke demands Bane's respect as well.

My only issue is that I know he doesn't fare well against Flash, and I could see that match-up developing into a rough one for Frost as the game develops more...

 

[astronout]

My only issue is that I know he doesn't fare well against Flash, and I could see that match-up developing into a rough one for Frost as the game develops more...

Deathstroke or Batgirl would be your best bet. Also KF does just fine against Flash. what exactly are you having trouble with in that MU?

 

[Vak Phoenix]

Who do you guys think is a good compliment to Frost? I've been thinking about Deathstroke.

He forces characters like Cyborg and Martian to respect him - our definite bad match-ups. I also struggle against Bane personally, and I feel Deathstroke demands Bane's respect as well.

My only issue is that I know he doesn't fare well against Flash, and I could see that match-up developing into a rough one for Frost as the game develops more...

flash whiffs alot... and try zoning.. he will charge into u and parry him. d1 works wonders and try to bait his wakeup (upward charge) and punish with 111.
p.s icebergs are great too.

 

[Sultan]

Deathstroke or Batgirl would be your best bet. Also KF does just fine against Flash. what exactly are you having trouble with in that MU?

Inexperience and XBL mostly, lol. I can't consistently anti-air him online and his dash is that much more stupid. I see the match-up as even on paper, I just have my doubts in practice, but I've only really played one ten game set online against a good Flash, so there's certainly a lot for me to learn still.

 

[RiBBz22]

Who do you guys think is a good compliment to Frost? I've been thinking about Deathstroke.

He forces characters like Cyborg and Martian to respect him - our definite bad match-ups. I also struggle against Bane personally, and I feel Deathstroke demands Bane's respect as well.

My only issue is that I know he doesn't fare well against Flash, and I could see that match-up developing into a rough one for Frost as the game develops more...

I play Frost, BG, and DS and I feel fine with it. TBH DS is more for fun and I really think I am fine with KF and BG.

 

[astronout]

Inexperience and XBL mostly, lol. I can't consistently anti-air him online and his dash is that much more stupid. I see the match-up as even on paper, I just have my doubts in practice, but I've only really played one ten game set online against a good Flash, so there's certainly a lot for me to learn still.

backdash all of his jump in as they dont jail. if he commits to certain strings you can whiff punish them. D2 beats his jump in attacks 70% of the time, the other 30% it'll trade. I normally don't MBF3 his jump ins in this specific MU as J2 is 2 hits i believe. backdash after a blocked slide as all of his follow ups will whiff unless he commits to a lightning charge which would be a huge risk on his part. pushblock his frame traps if you don't feel like guessing.

 

[Madog32]

Who do you guys think is a good compliment to Frost? I've been thinking about Deathstroke.

He forces characters like Cyborg and Martian to respect him - our definite bad match-ups. I also struggle against Bane personally, and I feel Deathstroke demands Bane's respect as well.

My only issue is that I know he doesn't fare well against Flash, and I could see that match-up developing into a rough one for Frost as the game develops more...

I'd agree with most of what was said. Flash can be a pain in the ass, but it shouldnt be a bad matchup. Bait his charge with daggers and parry it, or MB parry into F3 (I tried capitalizing on a TA j3 after a MB Parry on his charge, but the timing is REALLY tight to land a J3 into U3 on him the way he's frozen for some reason - so I just go with F3 punish.) Also - backdash is definitely your friend in this matchup. I can't alway backdash AND punish due to still getting bopped out of slide when trying to come in and punish his whiffed attacks, but at least you're out of his pressure.

Also - I've been using standing 2 quite a bit in this matchup. Flash loves to start with his low string, and standing 1 whiffs on him while he's doing it. But a standing 2 will not and will often catch him after he's blocked one of your D1's. It also spaces him out enough that even if he blocks your 2, he's no longer close enough to try coming in low again.

I'm no expert in this MU and I get bodied by @SEV every single time I play him - but these are the things I've taken away from the sets that have helped to improve my gameplay. Perhaps some of it will help you as well

 

[Sultan]

Two match-up things

Versus Aquaman's trait: after a mb.freeze, if Aquaman trait's up, you get a guaranteed mb.freeze reset because he restarts the combo counter while being immobile.

Versus MMH's oh teleport: instead of back dashing to force a whiff, I've found IA back dash works better because Frost has no grounded hitbox, so she avoids the splash effect (the main reason why back dashing isn't super effective versus oh tele. Regular forward dash is still superior.

 

[Pan1cMode]

Two match-up things

Versus Aquaman's trait: after a mb.freeze, if Aquaman trait's up, you get a guaranteed mb.freeze reset because he restarts the combo counter while being immobile.

Versus MMH's oh teleport: instead of back dashing to force a whiff, I've found IA back dash works better because Frost has no grounded hitbox, so she avoids the splash effect (the main reason why back dashing isn't super effective versus oh tele. Regular forward dash is still superior.

This still gets caught by low tele though

 

[Sultan]

This still gets caught by low tele though

Yes and no. It can avoid low tele... but that's borderline impossible to do intentionally.

 

[Pan1cMode]

Yes and no. It can avoid low tele... but that's borderline impossible to do intentionally.

That's what I meant haha.

It's kinda sad that I go "wtf?" when tele whiffs because I'm so used to it hitting everywhere on screen hahaha.

 

[RiBBz22]

Two match-up things

Versus Aquaman's trait: after a mb.freeze, if Aquaman trait's up, you get a guaranteed mb.freeze reset because he restarts the combo counter while being immobile.

Versus MMH's oh teleport: instead of back dashing to force a whiff, I've found IA back dash works better because Frost has no grounded hitbox, so she avoids the splash effect (the main reason why back dashing isn't super effective versus oh tele. Regular forward dash is still superior.

Eh, I just always keep MB B3 ready for when I see him go into the ground. I get blown up too much for trying to do stuff to that teleport on reaction (at least online).

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

What should I know for the DD matchup? Parry lots?

 

[Pan1cMode]

What should I know for the DD matchup? Parry lots?

Yeah, you can parry shoulder and d1. If you parry him with trait activated you waste out DD's trait.

Daggers are also useful as they hit twice. MB f3 anti-airs body splash from all distances.

Use trait charge to bait doomsday into coming in when he might wanna turtle.

 

[Sultan]

What should I know for the DD matchup? Parry lots?

Parry to establish the meta. A smart Doomsday will try to bait it, which is your opportunity to escape pressure/punish their staggered offense.
Master reacting to venom with Parry.
Abuse slide, his options suck.
Obviously, punish his dashing in with d1/slide/etc.
Obviously, make sure your anti-airs are on point. Doomsday's jump arc is meh and he doesn't have good aerial options so he's a sitting duck to trip guard slides.
Make him think about jumping with daggers and iceberg abuse.
d1 doesn't care about his trait.

Don't jump around.
Master stuffing/baiting his wake-ups...

Yeah...

 

[RiBBz22]

What should I know for the DD matchup? Parry lots?

@Ne'er-do-well explained some good points about the matchup. Parry is your best friend here to keep DD from going HAM which is pretty much what all DD's want to do. DD's will still try to do venom up close, but even from point blank range you can parry it on reaction because the first hit is a little bit delayed...so get used to the window that you have to punish. d1 being +2 on block is really good for being able to pressure DD on trait and can frustrate your opponent into pushing buttons to get out which means a potential parry opportunity.

Another thing I like to try against DD's trait if I am feeling saucy is mixing between 111~slide parry, d1 111~slide parry, d1 22~slide parry, f113~slide parry ... you can hit confirm this into an even better f113 d1 111 slide parry and most of the time after a successful parry you will be able to combo off it. This used to be so good for me in the MU when KF could F3 two times off of a MB parry when DD had trait...it was so freaking godlike. Also, you can do some other stuff off the d1 like a neutral jump into more f113 pressure and just end in slide if you don't get a hit since she owns the post-slide game.

From long range you are pretty free to chuck daggers, and the only thing you have to be concerned with is MB supernova which you can punish about 500 different ways (dash forward slide and slide slide both do the trick...but lbsh slide slide just looks swag...obviously mb b3 is an option too). Iceberg isn't much of a factor in the MU so I wouldn't really advise using it much. I think he get's a free trait activation off of a blocked one so really no point.

Also, you wouldn't think trait charge would be very effective since DD is all about rushdown...but when DD does not have trait or meter he will be looking to turtle. You can charge trait for free and just react to whatever option he chooses to close the gap. Once you have parry on the verge of activation you are set up for some HUGE punishes off of your parry so make him pay once it is loaded. Also, another good way to build trait is to end a combo off the 50-50 with 11b24 instead of meterless vortex which pushes DD nearly full screen and lets you charge about 75% of your trait for free.

 

[LionHeart]

I know this is somewhere buried in this thread, but do you guys think that MMH bodies KF?

I honestly think its 4.5-5.5 (if not even) MMH but then again I have very little high level MMH XP so I need your opinion on this.

 

[Madog32]

I wouldn't say he BODIES her - but a good one definitely has an advantage. His zoning game keeps her locked down most of the time worrying about pillars or a tele on reaction to slide, so you're left to play extremely defensive and patiently. Capitalizing on every punish you do manage to get it key. I like to charge trait and walk in slowly if he's trying to zone you out. MBParry into trait punishes are helpful in evening out the damage difference. Learn the meterless vortex to punish a (typical) Push wakeup. It has helped me a ton! (I think @RiBBz22 has a video clip in the tech thread.)

It's a tough one. But I'd say I've had more issues against a good Cyborg or Zod than I have against MMH lately (since I've been applying the things above to the MMH matchup)

Good Luck...and

EDIT: I did not realize that was a link to a MylesWright thread :-/ I feel like I've inadvertently fed the troll, even after successfully restraining myself from replying in that thread yesterday...

 

[RiBBz22]

I know this is somewhere buried in this thread, but do you guys think that MMH bodies KF?

I honestly think its 4.5-5.5 (if not even) MMH but then again I have very little high level MMH XP so I need your opinion on this.

Offline the MU is a ton easier. You have to over-respect the hell out of the overhead teleport and it forces you to walk back more often since you simply just have less time to react. This really sets up a strong zoning game against Frost. Once you work your way in I think she wins up close, but it is a pain in the ass to get there and stay there IMO. It is really necessary to learn the ranges of MMH's pillars to have success moving in on him. MB pillar is stupid and there is just nothing you can do about that besides respect it since it is pretty OP.

 

[LionHeart]

Offline the MU is a ton easier. You have to over-respect the hell out of the overhead teleport and it forces you to walk back more often since you simply just have less time to react. This really sets up a strong zoning game against Frost. Once you work your way in I think she wins up close, but it is a pain in the ass to get there and stay there IMO. It is really necessary to learn the ranges of MMH's pillars to have success moving in on him. MB pillar is stupid and there is just nothing you can do about that besides respect it since it is pretty OP.

I only play offline at my local scene.

You can, I believe, iceberg on reaction if he tries to do that projectile thing. When you see the start of the animation you have time to interrupt him with MB Iceberg into combo (depends on range obviously). This makes him a lot more cautious when he's zoning.

Orbs are another thing though... Regular ones not so much and if you are within slide range, you can launch him into a full combo during his recovery animation, if you read a normal orb. MB Orbs are a pain, on the other hand.....

If I see him do OH Tp and I have 1 bar available, I just do MB B3, J3, U3, U3, 11b2~slide, 22~Iceberg for 45% of his life (found that one during a match, is there a higher damaging one?), so he can't just abuse OH Tps...

Online, I imagine is a different story....

 

[Pan1cMode]

I only play offline at my local scene.

You can, I believe, iceberg on reaction if he tries to do that projectile thing. When you see the start of the animation you have time to interrupt him with MB Iceberg into combo (depends on range obviously). This makes him a lot more cautious when he's zoning.

Orbs are another thing though... Regular ones not so much and if you are within slide range, you can launch him into a full combo during his recovery animation, if you read a normal orb. MB Orbs are a pain, on the other hand.....

If I see him do OH Tp and I have 1 bar available, I just do MB B3, J3, U3, U3, 11b2~slide, 22~Iceberg for 45% of his life (found that one during a match, is there a higher damaging one?), so he can't just abuse OH Tps...

Online, I imagine is a different story....

b3(MB), ji3, u3, 2, u3, 11b2~bd3, 3~db2

 

[RiBBz22]

I only play offline at my local scene.

You can, I believe, iceberg on reaction if he tries to do that projectile thing. When you see the start of the animation you have time to interrupt him with MB Iceberg into combo (depends on range obviously). This makes him a lot more cautious when he's zoning.

Orbs are another thing though... Regular ones not so much and if you are within slide range, you can launch him into a full combo during his recovery animation, if you read a normal orb. MB Orbs are a pain, on the other hand.....

If I see him do OH Tp and I have 1 bar available, I just do MB B3, J3, U3, U3, 11b2~slide, 22~Iceberg for 45% of his life (found that one during a match, is there a higher damaging one?), so he can't just abuse OH Tps...

Online, I imagine is a different story....

Yeah you can iceberg him out of his zoning tools offline. And yes MB B3 punishes are the best to use online and the reason why you will be forced to hold back more times than you would want in the MU.

 

[AK cyusstrike]

ill be posting some of my online kf casual play on my you this a recent vid newly uploaded these will be from the ps4 side
opinions and critiques are welcome as well as tips you can follow the channel for mor vids ill be uploading also I stream my matches at twitch.tv/cyusstrike1

Injustice Gods Among Us Ultimate Edition Cyusstr…:

 

[LionHeart]

b3(MB), ji3, u3, 2, u3, 11b2~bd3, 3~db2

Been trying this since you posted it and it seems dmg is same as with b3(MB), ji3, u3, 2, u3, 11b2~bd3, 22~db2 I've been using (44%?). Only difference is your version puts him fullscreen.

Do we really want him there?

Discuss....

 

[Pan1cMode]

Been trying this since you posted it and it seems dmg is same as with b3(MB), ji3, u3, 2, u3, 11b2~bd3, 22~db2 I've been using (44%?). Only difference is your version puts him fullscreen.

Do we really want him there?

Discuss....

There's no difference between 22 and 3 (except for positioning) but I find 3~db2 easier to hit.

Your first combo didn't have the 2 inbetween the u3s, that's the only real difference between the two combos tbh.