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General/Other KILLER FROST - General Discussion Thread

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
Hey guys. I ran a set yesterday against Noobe's DD and got beat pretty bad. I think I could have done a lot better offline because I had issues with d1 shake, and was stubbornly trying to block it on reaction without much success...Anyways, what are you guys doing to blow up body splash? I was trying to properly hit the D2 early without much success so I had to switch over to MB F3 when I saw it coming out. What else are you guys doing? What about back dashing it and going into the 50-50 as soon as DD lands?
 

ApocaLips

Kombatant
If he does it too early, you can d1 before he can follow up with a string, or you can parry which eliminates most of his pressure options. Other than that, I d2 very early and it usually works. Easier than batman's j2 for sure.

How was the connection? Big latency affects AAs in this game pretty hard.
 

ApocaLips

Kombatant
7-3 doesnt mean unwinnable. People really lose sight of what the numbers mean. It just means a 70-30 slant at perfect matchup knowledge.
 

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
7-3 doesnt mean unwinnable. People really lose sight of what the numbers mean. It just means a 70-30 slant at perfect matchup knowledge.
Yeah, I don't have much DD competition. I have bodied pretty much every other one I've played, but Noobe was tough to deal with and you are right I do not have in-depth enough knowledge of the MU.
 

ApocaLips

Kombatant
Yeah, I don't have much DD competition. I have bodied pretty much every other one I've played, but Noobe was tough to deal with and you are right I do not have in-depth enough knowledge of the MU.
I didn't say you don't have MU knowledge. I'm just saying it's definitely possible to lose a 7-3.

In your case, things would have been different if you landed those AAs. If you did, it would have been vortex city for him every time instead of a combo against you. I don't know what the online conditions were like, so i cant say whether you would have hit them or not.
 

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
I didn't say you don't have MU knowledge. I'm just saying it's definitely possible to lose a 7-3.

In your case, things would have been different if you landed those AAs. If you did, it would have been vortex city for him every time instead of a combo against you. I don't know what the online conditions were like, so i cant say whether you would have hit them or not.
Yeah, I know you weren't. Is the best way just to suck it up and MB F3?
 

RunwayMafia

Shoot them. Shoot them all.
How are you even supposed to block D1~EarthShake? I played Noobe tonight and won 1 game...it was terrible. Admittedly I have never played a good DD...but I couldn't get anything going. I didn't block a single earth shaker...he kept throwing me a ton...I got a few parries out but meh. Also, I would d2 when he would do that belly move...and no....ugh.
 

xKhaoTik

The Ignore Button Is Free
Man I wanna play noobe now lol.

But anyways, there's no reason to block low against DD unless he's doing any version of earthshaker. Its much easier blocking d1~ES standing since you only have to block low once the low comes, rather than blocking the d1 low, then stressing yourself to block high and low very quickly.

Also, when it comes to his belly flop, d2 does work very well but if I feel like my d2 won't work, I just push block him.
 

Rickyraws

This mean you don't like me?
Man I wanna play noobe now lol.
Me too. I'm actually a little confused, DD is a very free match up. Even if you just block high against earthshaker, the low does little damage. I never try anti airing the body splash, maybe I should, but I always just backdash and I'm at a distance where the only thing that can hit me is Venom.

RiBBz22
Also, when pressuring DD, expect him to wakeup with Supernova, as was evidenced in the video. While you can MB F3 it, I'm sure you know both Supernovas are full combo punishable. You can also almost always tell when he's gonna d1 earthshaker, usually after a dash. Parry that mother lover, and the subsequent time he comes near you via he will either raw ES or attempt to grab. Adjust accordingly

Also, even during TFC, I've noticed a lot of Frosts getting hit by MBVenom. Simply blocking it grants him advantage, but into what? D1 ES? That can be parried or MB F3'd, grab can be MBF3d. It appeared they blocked the first and attempted to parry in between the gap to little effect. There's enough delay even online to see when he hasn't MB'd it and STILL punish with 111, at least from my experience. Also, don't attempt to air to air him. In footsie range Venom is EXACTLY WHAT HE WANTS YOU TO JUMP AWAY/INTO due to it hitting you out of the air and putting you into the corner. And from the little I saw of the video, he never really even attempted to reverse your wakeup, which is a whole other thing to go over.

I think the main issues with DD arise NOT from effectively blocking ES, but from how he gains his momentum. Some DD use Venom if you don't parry it or punish the non MB Venom effectively, others with their body splash. Again, backdashing works wonders for me. When he knocks you full screen or after a clash, he will almost always trait. Quick fingers will have your iceberg beat this, and after a clash he may attempt to simply Supernova you to deal with this. I wouldn't expect him to have much meter after a clash, but that's subjective. You can dagger/ iceberg him when he's traited far away, and he may attempt to supernova. Stopping him in his tracks at least twice with either, may cause him to supernova, which can easily be forward dashed and sometimes even punished due to the two aforementioned attacks chipping his trait time. It may be due to the fact that I play on the cesspool that is XBL full of players attempting to exploit 'cheap tactics' to the fullest, but I have very very large amounts of success against DDs, (I will refrain from naming tourney players, however noobe's pretty much the only DD who plays online that I haven't played)but that doesn't mean it can't go sour when he gets momentum. And THAT'S what I think the main problem is. We can all sit here are dilly dally about what to do, but I think more DD experience will show you that your success hinges on stopping his momentum and realizing what he can and can't do, which is why most top players keep stressing 'I think Doomsday is a craaaazy good character that is only going to go lower and lower on the tier list the more people learn to play against him.' He isn't the most versatile, I don't think.

I'm by no means the voice of authority on anything, in pretty much any sense, but the last time I played PL on his stream he constantly switched between EIGHT characters even while the stream and myself were begging him for his DD. He refused saying how bad a MU it was for DD. After some lying to the tune of saying I'm not familiar with the MU and so he shouldn't worry(I'm going to hell, aren't I?) he finally brought him out for one match and never again throughout our ~34 matches.

Put the word out to Mr. Noobe. I want his blood.

Two weeks later:
After setting up a session with Mr. Noobe, Rickyraws proceeded to get bodied so bad he quit Injustice. He now scurries to TYM in an attempt to figure out how to delete prior posts.
 

NRF CharlieMurphy

Kindergarten Meta
Man I wanna play noobe now lol.

But anyways, there's no reason to block low against DD unless he's doing any version of earthshaker. Its much easier blocking d1~ES standing since you only have to block low once the low comes, rather than blocking the d1 low, then stressing yourself to block high and low very quickly.

Also, when it comes to his belly flop, d2 does work very well but if I feel like my d2 won't work, I just push block him.
What do you do when he starts tossing his sweep out?