Match-up Discussion Green Arrow Matchup Discussion

[Red Reaper]

so who do you guys counter pick with? who do you feel covers his bad match ups??? i am quite liking batgirl personally

I'm going to pick up Batman for real this time because he has answer for everything..
Arrow apparently shares the bad match up of Aquaman with him but I'm pretty sure it's not that bad for Batman. That's the only real bad match up he's got anyway..

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

I played two good Zods yesterday. Jailhouse and Pig. Both bodied my arrow and went even with my Grundy.

His trait makes arrows life hell. you cant load arrows and even if you do, you still lose the zoning game. Up close his parry plus trait make it very difficult for Arrow.

Pig has played Chris G often so I don't feel terrible about it.

 

[ando1184]

Ok, just gonna go ahead and apologize because I know this has probably been covered earlier on in this thread but I have a newborn and don't have time to read through it. Can anyone give me some tips on the GA vs batman, superman, green lantern, nightwing, and hawkgirl matchups? I have the most trouble vs those characters online and Idk if it's just online or what? I get bodied by a non-stop attacking and jumping batman, f2,3 spamming n zonin supes, same with GL but its b1,3 n zonin, n hawkgirl just runs n runs then I get clobbered by dive kicks and ex moves, n nightwing....is nightwing and that staff shit is stupid. Sorry this is asking a lot in one post.

 

[Scoot Magee]

I played two good Zods yesterday. Jailhouse and Pig. Both bodied my arrow and went even with my Grundy.

His trait makes arrows life hell. you cant load arrows and even if you do, you still lose the zoning game. Up close his parry plus trait make it very difficult for Arrow.

Pig has played Chris G often so I don't feel terrible about it.

The amount of matchup experience I'm lacking in this game is insane. I only really know how to play against the top characters. I desperately need experience vs sinestro, zod and a bunch of others.

 

[Scoot Magee]

Ok, just gonna go ahead and apologize because I know this has probably been covered earlier on in this thread but I have a newborn and don't have time to read through it. Can anyone give me some tips on the GA vs batman, superman, green lantern, nightwing, and hawkgirl matchups? I have the most trouble vs those characters online and Idk if it's just online or what? I get bodied by a non-stop attacking and jumping batman, f2,3 spamming n zonin supes, same with GL but its b1,3 n zonin, n hawkgirl just runs n runs then I get clobbered by dive kicks and ex moves, n nightwing....is nightwing and that staff shit is stupid. Sorry this is asking a lot in one post.

I'll start with nightwing. You have to cancel any blocked d1 into a savage blast when he is in staff mode otherwise he will take all the momentum with his d1 pressure. If he manages to start pressuring you you should push block as soon as you can and release a normal green arrow to check any advance he tries to follow up with. If it hits it gives you a chance to try and pressure him or load an arrow. If you have a life lead I would load fire arrows and keep out.

When he starts using his EX ground pound from far you have to respect the next one after blocking it. Once he uses a normal one you can get a free dash after it and a chance to get a fire arrow on screen. Just remember to respect his EX pound and dash after blocking his normal one. Also keep an eye out for his staff kick move, it advances him forward and has an insane hit box. You can crouch under it and punish but it can be tough sometimes because of how far it travels. Throwing out random high arrows is a good way to check that.

I think it's a 5/5 match up. If you have any specific questions on the match I'll try to help you.

Against GL, he does have a great footsie tool with b13 that leads to free chip from chain gun. After the chip damage you have to respect his option to lift (from that range I don't think GA can punish it on block) which in turn checks you and can lead to another b13, jump ins and ect. You really have to block well and play patient in this match. This is why most people say you shouldn't play the close range game against GL but I really don't agree that that's the case. GA cannot win this match by just trying to zone with fire arrows and ect.

The great thing about this match up with GA is that GL's d1 does not have enough reach to interrupt d1 arrow which is huge. You still have to be wary of b13 when you push him out a little but he will respect the option of d1 xx whatever more than other characters. When they respect the d1 cancel you can do a raw d1 into f2 mix up. If you push him back enough that he can safely do a back one you can MB b3 on read and punish for nice damage, if you have an ice arrow stocked you can end with that, reload ice arrow and 50/50 with f2d1 low ice and f2d13 ice for another 23% if you guess right. If he decides to push block you in that mixup it works out great because he really needs his meter.

On knockdown against GL respect his lift. If you have time to cross him up with J3 before he can wake up lift you should go for it. it's a good way to keep pressure after a knockdown at low risk. On your knockdown you still have to respect lift. Try not to be predictable with wake up savage blast because you will get punished big time. Just play patient and block, good blocking is a huge key to winning this match.

Once you secure a nice life lead that's when I think it's best to stay out with fire and electric arrows. Make him try to come to you but don't get cornered. Also be careful of meter burn rockets, one good one can turn the match around quickly.

IMO this match might be a 5/5, maybe a slight advantage to GL but I don't know for sure. When good power character stages come into play though the advantage goes to GL 6/4 I think.

Edit

Regarding GL's b13 rocket, its pretty much a guess when you think it's coming but when you do guess right dash in under it and pressure or throw. I haven't been able to punish it but it might be punishable. If you do end up blocking it he's at a huge advantage so you have to respect his next move. The good thing about that though is that the rocket has a lot of push block so you can actually back dash a followup b13. He has other options like lift to cover that though so be careful.

 

[Chongo]

Regarding Flying Grayson, you can duck and punish since it's a high, or you can get a free d1 check since it's -3.

Scoot covered up everything else haha.

 

[ando1184]

I'll start with nightwing. You have to cancel any blocked d1 into a savage blast when he is in staff mode otherwise he will take all the momentum with his d1 pressure. If he manages to start pressuring you you should push block as soon as you can and release a normal green arrow to check any advance he tries to follow up with. If it hits it gives you a chance to try and pressure him or load an arrow. If you have a life lead I would load fire arrows and keep out.

When he starts using his EX ground pound from far you have to respect the next one after blocking it. Once he uses a normal one you can get a free dash after it and a chance to get a fire arrow on screen. Just remember to respect his EX pound and dash after blocking his normal one. Also keep an eye out for his staff kick move, it advances him forward and has an insane hit box. You can crouch under it and punish but it can be tough sometimes because of how far it travels. Throwing out random high arrows is a good way to check that.

I think it's a 5/5 match up. If you have any specific questions on the match I'll try to help you.

Against GL, he does have a great footsie tool with b13 that leads to free chip from chain gun. After the chip damage you have to respect his option to lift (from that range I don't think GA can punish it on block) which in turn checks you and can lead to another b13, jump ins and ect. You really have to block well and play patient in this match. This is why most people say you shouldn't play the close range game against GL but I really don't agree that that's the case. GA cannot win this match by just trying to zone with fire arrows and ect.

The great thing about this match up with GA is that GL's d1 does not have enough reach to interrupt d1 arrow which is huge. You still have to be wary of b13 when you push him out a little but he will respect the option of d1 xx whatever more than other characters. When they respect the d1 cancel you can do a raw d1 into f2 mix up. If you push him back enough that he can safely do a back one you can MB b3 on read and punish for nice damage, if you have an ice arrow stocked you can end with that, reload ice arrow and 50/50 with f2d1 low ice and f2d13 ice for another 23% if you guess right. If he decides to push block you in that mixup it works out great because he really needs his meter.

On knockdown against GL respect his lift. If you have time to cross him up with J3 before he can wake up lift you should go for it. it's a good way to keep pressure after a knockdown at low risk. On your knockdown you still have to respect lift. Try not to be predictable with wake up savage blast because you will get punished big time. Just play patient and block, good blocking is a huge key to winning this match.

Once you secure a nice life lead that's when I think it's best to stay out with fire and electric arrows. Make him try to come to you but don't get cornered. Also be careful of meter burn rockets, one good one can turn the match around quickly.

IMO this match might be a 5/5, maybe a slight advantage to GL but I don't know for sure. When good power character stages come into play though the advantage goes to GL 6/4 I think.

Edit

Regarding GL's b13 rocket, its pretty much a guess when you think it's coming but when you do guess right dash in under it and pressure or throw. I haven't been able to punish it but it might be punishable. If you do end up blocking it he's at a huge advantage so you have to respect his next move. The good thing about that though is that the rocket has a lot of push block so you can actually back dash a followup b13. He has other options like lift to cover that though so be careful.

Awesome! thanks for this man, now these matchups will be much more bareable and I have been able to dash the rocket and get a d1, arrow combo starter. I havent tried to see if f2 will punish it though. The NW stuff is a great help too bro, I didn't think that his staff kick was punishable after a successful duck because of how far away it goes. What are you punishing with, d2, d1, naked arrow?

 

[Scoot Magee]

Awesome! thanks for this man, now these matchups will be much more bareable and I have been able to dash the rocket and get a d1, arrow combo starter. I havent tried to see if f2 will punish it though. The NW stuff is a great help too bro, I didn't think that his staff kick was punishable after a successful duck because of how far away it goes. What are you punishing with, d2, d1, naked arrow?

D2 can work as a punish and naked arrow is good too, if you have other arrows ready it's even better.

 

[ando1184]

D2 can work as a punish and naked arrow is good too, if you have other arrows ready it's even better.

cool thanks for the info man. Anyone else have any info on the other MU's, batman, superman, hawkgirl? Also, how are you guys handling Killer Frost?

 

[Scoot Magee]

Lex beats ga terribly IMO from my experience so far. I'll post why I think so tomorrow most likely. If anyone has opinions about the match post them up.

 

[ando1184]

I've been getting beat by MMM quite a bit lately. I'll always take the 1st life bar but he has so many tools to come back in the end. Does anybody have any good understanding of this MU yet?

 

[Red Reaper]

Lex beats ga terribly IMO from my experience so far. I'll post why I think so tomorrow most likely. If anyone has opinions about the match post them up.

Hmmm... I wonder why?

 

[Red Reaper]

I've been getting beat by MMM quite a bit lately. I'll always take the 1st life bar but he has so many tools to come back in the end. Does anybody have any good understanding of this MU yet?

I use MMH (if that's what you meant)...

He does have a lot of tools. You would have to be more specific though on what's giving you trouble.

 

[Jimmypotato]

Lex beats ga terribly IMO from my experience so far. I'll post why I think so tomorrow most likely. If anyone has opinions about the match post them up.

It is def tougher then I thought it would be, I've only played one, shadowbeatz but he seems pretty decent and has alotta nasty nasty set ups.

What I had to start doing was shooting a shit load of arrow, normal or any type, you are not doing damage with the normal ones but you are stopping him from getting his shit out, then you gotta try load some special ones when you get the chance.

Trying to get in close and do D1~arrow anything will just get blown up if they know they can corpse charge after blocking the D1.

I started baiting the corpse charge by just doing d1 and blocking.

I wanna play this match more though because they feel really hype and just have a ton of shit going on in them when I was playing them.

and by shooting lots of arrows, I mean, like a fuckin fuck ton of them lol. once he has trait out though you are fucked when he starts those set ups.

Arrow is slowly slipping down the tier list further, needs more buffs.

 

[Jimmypotato]

Regarding Flying Grayson, you can duck and punish since it's a high, or you can get a free d1 check since it's -3.

Scoot covered up everything else haha.

depends where you do the grayson from, Dick can get his D1 out first most times and stuff arrows d1 if the move wiffs.

 

[Red Reaper]

It is def tougher then I thought it would be, I've only played one, shadowbeatz but he seems pretty decent and has alotta nasty nasty set ups.

What I had to start doing was shooting a shit load of arrow, normal or any type, you are not doing damage with the normal ones but you are stopping him from getting his shit out, then you gotta try load some special ones when you get the chance.

Trying to get in close and do D1~arrow anything will just get blown up if they know they can corpse charge after blocking the D1.

I started baiting the corpse charge by just doing d1 and blocking.

I wanna play this match more though because they feel really hype and just have a ton of shit going on in them when I was playing them.

and by shooting lots of arrows, I mean, like a fuckin fuck ton of them lol. once he has trait out though you are fucked when he starts those set ups.

Arrow is slowly slipping down the tier list further, needs more buffs.

Him being able to Charge after D1 isn't something I'd worry too much about. It's somewhat a 50/50 and it kan skew in Arrow's favor since he gets a full kombo for baiting it out.

I remember getting hit by stuff against EMPEROR_THEO . lol. Pretty fun. A lot of it though is just unfamiliarity with the character in my opinion though...

Arrow doesn't seem any different from my previous judgement. Mid tier character that loses to top tiers.

 

[Scoot Magee]

Hmmm... I wonder why?

I posted some of my thoughts in the lex thread.

http://www.testyourmight.com/threads/lex-luthor-matchup-discussion.29216/page-9

 

[Scoot Magee]

Him being able to Charge after D1 isn't something I'd worry too much about. It's somewhat a 50/50 and it kan skew in Arrow's favor since he gets a full kombo for baiting it out.

I remember getting hit by stuff against EMPEROR_THEO . lol. Pretty fun. A lot of it though is just unfamiliarity with the character in my opinion though...

Arrow doesn't seem any different from my previous judgement. Mid tier character that loses to top tiers.

Charging after a d1 is a risk reward but he can just interrupt with his own d1.

 

[Red Reaper]

Charging after a d1 is a risk reward but he can just interrupt with his own d1.

Not a big deal. A lot of characters kan...

 

[ando1184]

I use MMH (if that's what you meant)...

He does have a lot of tools. You would have to be more specific though on what's giving you trouble.

Well, yes his tools are a problem due to so many. When I'm zoning its fine for the most part and it's easier to bait out the teleports from full screen. However when he activates trait, I'm gettin hit and combo'd half screen. I don't own him yet and don't know his frames nor what is really punishable. His cross up jmp1 or 2, idk it's the downward kick and it catches me a lot too, even tho I will block the opposite direction. I only play online and that could be an issue too I guess. How are u guys punishing or adding pressure vs his "safe" teleport? A lot of MM players backdash after that move n I dash in and f2d13 n sometimes it hits and sometimes it whiffs? That's all I can think of at the moment, thoughts?

 

[Scoot Magee]

Not a big deal. A lot of characters kan...

Yeah I didn't argue that. I'm just stating that its a better option than corpse charge.

 

[ando1184]

Has anyone played anymore of the superman matchup, or do u guys just counter pick? I ask bc I think I learned something about zoning supes. I was fighting my friend online and he zones a lot until he absolutely has to come in. Well both of the standing lasers have relatively long startup so full screen as GA I can just press and hold 4 n wait until it looks like he's gonna shoot then release a fire or elect arrow. I played this way yesterday and beat out supes standing lasers without trades and kept pressure. This matchup i used to think was nearly unwinnable as GA, but after seeing this I think we can deal with this matchup more easily, especially once that crouching arrow patch comes in.

 

[ando1184]

Ok I was just having a mirror and mid screen after a BG bounce I did 22 freeze jmp 2,111 for super reset and da last 1 hit, on recovery the other GA did super as well. Mine hit but nothing happened, da blast was right on em . Yet his super worked n lost da match. Was it previously stated that GA's super beats GA's super anywhere? Things like this is why I think super could b a little bit better, I've done this to other characters, minus superman, and my super always beat theirs out since I did it first. Does sum1 know why this happened? Also during this matchup, it becomes a zoning fest, so at first I lost 3 straight. I used fire n ice arrows but the tide was turned when I switched to electric, those arrows are a godsend guys.

 

[shaowebb]

Ok I was just having a mirror and mid screen after a BG bounce I did 22 freeze jmp 2,111 for super reset and da last 1 hit, on recovery the other GA did super as well. Mine hit but nothing happened, da blast was right on em . Yet his super worked n lost da match. Was it previously stated that GA's super beats GA's super anywhere? Things like this is why I think super could b a little bit better, I've done this to other characters, minus superman, and my super always beat theirs out since I did it first. Does sum1 know why this happened? Also during this matchup, it becomes a zoning fest, so at first I lost 3 straight. I used fire n ice arrows but the tide was turned when I switched to electric, those arrows are a godsend guys.

No clue on the super thing, but yeah I love those electric arrows. There a good middle ground between fire and ice and can be used to zone or hit confirm/extend combos. It feels like I get more openings when I use them than with other arrow loadouts.

 

[Scoot Magee]

As people learn to fuzzy guard arrows f2d1 mixups they will only be useful with ice arrows. The only reason why is because you can f2d1 jump ice or low ice to counter the fuzzy timing. I've been having good success with the other arrows in the f2d1 string but its only because people are guessing instead of blocking low~high~low.

What's bad about this is the f2d1 string is almost useless if you don't have an ice arrow ready. When you do have an ice arrow ready you're options on getting in are limited. This makes it very hard against characters like black Adam.