"Prepare to be Astounded!" - Zatanna General Discussion Thread

[omegapr1me99]

Haha just had someone send me a hate message saying Zatanna is op as hell. Morons.

 

[Pan1cMode]

Haha just had someone send me a hate message saying Zatanna is op as hell. Morons.

Lol sif. Zatanna is not OP

 

[1man3letters]

LMFAO the swag of using ekoms dna srorrim then the bike in wayne manor is too much

 

[Tony at Home]

OK, I found an AWESOME setup using smoke and mirrors.

End any combo with 223 and cancel that into smoke and mirrors. Choose either the right or the left one, NOT the middle.

Immediately after smoke and mirrors, do a teleport on the ground. If you chose the clone that was closest to the downed enemy, teleport behind, if you chose the clone furthest from the enemy, teleport in front. In either case, your opponent will stand up with a clone on either side of him/her.

I tested this on Lex's Corp Charge, which is a ridiculously fast wakeup, and it's very possible to do this before the Corp Charge comes out. Of course, if you tele'd in front, the corp charge will hit you, but not if you teleported behind. It's a guessing game, but the opponent pays much more dearly for guessing wrong then you do.

I have not yet been able to test how beneficial it would be to MB the tele in response to an enemy that sees this and gets up using d1 pokes.

Still, I'm convinced this is a GREAT setup. And there's surely sooooo much more ways to mess up an enemy with Smoke and Mirrors.

I'll try making a video on this setup after work today.​

 

[uhfutzafooken]

Even with her handicaps this chick is so much fun to play. She's definitely not a character you can derp around with and win you have to be always thinking about your next setup, and you have to have solid defense and patience since you won't be anti-airing or poking out of anything when not in hat stance.

Speaking of hat stance I think its main use is meter building (at least that's how I like to use it). The projectiles are good in certain match ups and the chip is great but the fact that you should constantly be doing special moves that build a ton of meter with a trait that has only a 5 second cooldown is the biggest bonus imo. I use trait as much as possible even if I only get a couple moves off cause I know I'm getting it back in no time and that's precious meter that zatanna needs for just about everything.

I'm also having trouble with the teleport input. Most of the time nothing comes out I don't even jump.

EDIT: I think characters with multi-hit projectiles kinda wreck trait. You can't absorb all of them so you either have to block and lose trait or teleport behind them which is unsafe and even if you meter burn to make it safe you're still in hat stance up close which is not the best place to be. And you just burned meter in a stance where you should be building it.

 

[1man3letters]

OK, I found an AWESOME setup using smoke and mirrors.​

​

End any combo with 223 and cancel that into smoke and mirrors. Choose either the right or the left one, NOT the middle.​

​

Immediately after smoke and mirrors, do a teleport on the ground. If you chose the clone that was closest to the downed enemy, teleport behind, if you chose the clone furthest from the enemy, teleport in front. In either case, your opponent will stand up with a clone on either side of him/her.​

​

I tested this on Lex's Corp Charge, which is a ridiculously fast wakeup, and it's very possible to do this before the Corp Charge comes out. Of course, if you tele'd in front, the corp charge will hit you, but not if you teleported behind. It's a guessing game, but the opponent pays much more dearly for guessing wrong then you do.​

​

I have not yet been able to test how beneficial it would be to MB the tele in response to an enemy that sees this and gets up using d1 pokes.​

​

Still, I'm convinced this is a GREAT setup. And there's surely sooooo much more ways to mess up an enemy with Smoke and Mirrors.​

​

I'll try making a video on this setup after work today.​

tech roll denies this setup everytime.
when opponent tech rolls he's up and recovered before s&m is recovered, if u tele then. bad times are coming

 

[nightE89]

Yeah Im starting to see this chick as a gorilla style character tag em up and get out with high execution imo a C.Viper style character which I can def dig it, def keepin her as my second main

 

[xWildx]

I've been resetting combos with j2,2. The 2 leaves Zatanna at +23 according to the frame data, that's enough for a b1 and b2 that the opponent must respect. Technically, you could loop into this until you run out of meter, similar to Killer Frost. On block you can make either option safe by canceling into a MB Kick, which will build back meter while dealing heavy chip.

An example of all this would be: j2, b1u3, j2, 223 MB Puppet, j22 (resets), b21 MB Kicks, b3, j3 Dive Kick. If they guess wrong after the reset you've taken nearly an entire lifebar away from them for only 2 bars. The dive kick puts them far away, so you can begin a zoning game with trait, throw out a MB flame, teleport in after a connected ring toss, etc.

 

[Tony at Home]

tech roll denies this setup everytime.
when opponent tech rolls he's up and recovered before s&m is recovered, if u tele then. bad times are coming

Can you give a concrete example of a tech roll that will punish this?

How many frames does the move after the tech roll have to be to catch her before she teleports?

Id understand if maybe the Flash could tech then get a lightning dash punish, but I have some doubts a good portion of the cast cannot.

 

[uhfutzafooken]

I've been resetting combos with j2,2. The 2 leaves Zatanna at +23 according to the frame data, that's enough for a b1 and b2 that the opponent must respect. Technically, you could loop into this until you run out of meter, similar to Killer Frost. On block you can make either option safe by canceling into a MB Kick, which will build back meter while dealing heavy chip.

An example of all this would be: j2, b1u3, j2, 223 MB Puppet, j22 (resets), b21 MB Kicks, b3, j3 Dive Kick. If they guess wrong after the reset you've taken nearly an entire lifebar away from them for only 2 bars. The dive kick puts them far away, so you can begin a zoning game with trait, throw out a MB flame, teleport in after a connected ring toss, etc.

Ya her vortex is great. Not as good as batgirls imo but real easy to loop. I've just been resetting with J2 do you find the added standing 2 gives you more advantage? I'm lead to believe the frame data is wrong on some of zatannas moves

 

[GTInfection]

Does anyone else have more difficulty doing b23, j2, 223 on normal size male characters (Joker, Green Arrow, Batman, etc) than smaller female characters. I was in the lab using Catwoman as a dummy and that string just felt so much easier, then I used Joker as a dummy and the timing felt more strict. I can still do the combo but not as consistently.

 

[1man3letters]

Can you give a concrete example of a tech roll that will punish this?

How many frames does the move after the tech roll have to be to catch her before she teleports?

Id understand if maybe the Flash could tech then get a lightning dash punish, but I have some doubts a good portion of the cast cannot.

if any character tech rolls they can punish you.
doesnt have to be a wakeup, just tech roll into normal/string

 

[xWildx]

Ya her vortex is great. Not as good as batgirls imo but real easy to loop. I've just been resetting with J2 do you find the added standing 2 gives you more advantage? I'm lead to believe the frame data is wrong on some of zatannas moves

I haven't tested it too much, but according to the frame data it does and it's been working for me so far.

 

[Tony at Home]

if any character tech rolls they can punish you.
doesnt have to be a wakeup, just tech roll into normal/string

Still, have you tested that? After a tech, the normal string is not gonna hit you if they just throw it out there. If they try dialing it in as soon as they get up from the roll, the tele behind will catch them hitting air.

If they wait untill after you tele, they still have to deal with not knowing what direction is back or forwards relative to you. An option would be to throw out normals that arent direction dependent, immediately after your tele, but you also have the option of an in place tele, they'll throw out normals thay wont hit you, and you can punish that whiff easily.

Its a guessing game, but still in your favor

 

[1man3letters]

Still, have you tested that? After a tech, the normal string is not gonna hit you if they just throw it out there. If they try dialing it in as soon as they get up from the roll, the tele behind will catch them hitting air.

If they wait untill after you tele, they still have to deal with not knowing what direction is back or forwards relative to you. An option would be to throw out normals that arent direction dependent, immediately after your tele, but you also have the option of an in place tele, they'll throw out normals thay wont hit you, and you can punish that whiff easily.

Its a guessing game, but still in your favor

yea ive tested,
if u tech roll you are recovered before zatanna recovers from smoke and mirrors, u dont have to "wake up" with a string,
you can visually see if tele happens or not and the sides dont matter because u are recovered your string will auto correct to the tele

in no way in this a guessing game in zatannas favor, im sorry but its not

 

[Ratchet-Fabulous]

Does anyone know if they've hotfixed her Trance Move for online?

Or do we actually need to wait for a full update?

 

[1man3letters]

Does anyone know if they've hotfixed her Trance Move for online?

Or do we actually need to wait for a full update?

paulo said when the next gameplay patch happens it will be fixed

 

[Ratchet-Fabulous]

paulo said when the next gameplay patch happens it will be fixed

Omg that's in like forever.

They're so lazy.

 

[1man3letters]

Omg that's in like forever.

They're so lazy.

its not set when next balance patch will be so we dont know how soon or far away it is.

lazy? so much so goes in to any change in programming, they change 1 line of code wrong and it could fuck up something else.
they are far more hands on with the community than other FG compaines, dont be ungrateful dude.
we have it good with NRS

 

[Ratchet-Fabulous]

its not set when next balance patch will be so we dont know how soon or far away it is.

lazy? so much so goes in to any change in programming, they change 1 line of code wrong and it could fuck up something else.
they are far more hands on with the community than other FG compaines, dont be ungrateful dude.
we have it good with NRS

Well the balance patch obviously isn't coming out within the next few days.

I will call them lazy, because that's what they are. With MK9 to some parts of Injustice, some other companies do it better. I'm not being ungrateful, I'm just pointing out the obvious.

Gosh it seems as if most people on TYM nowadays are overly-sensitive.

 

[Monster Blood]

I haven't tested it too much, but according to the frame data it does and it's been working for me so far.

i dont understand how you're doing that. after the ji2 2, b21/b23 still works but if i use b1u3 low starter either the b1 whiffs or the opponet is too far to connect j2 after b1u3

 

[xXstealthflameXx]

No they can't. I said levitate after the fireball for a reason. Levitate high enough so your above most projectiles, because once they see the fireball and know they can't rush you down, they're going to start throwing things at you like crazy. So teleporting after levitate has both the benefit of dodging those projectiles and hitting overhead when you are behind them.

I completely missed the levitate part somehow... lol oops.

 

[Tony at Home]

yea ive tested,
if u tech roll you are recovered before zatanna recovers from smoke and mirrors, u dont have to "wake up" with a string,
you can visually see if tele happens or not and the sides dont matter because u are recovered your string will auto correct to the tele

in no way in this a guessing game in zatannas favor, im sorry but its not

Thanks for testing that.

I'll see if I can tweak it up a bit to get better results

 

[1man3letters]

Thanks for testing that.

I'll see if I can tweak it up a bit to get better results

no problem
yea hope u can, we need some S&M setups on the go

 

[Pan1cMode]

i dont understand how you're doing that. after the ji2 2, b21/b23 still works but if i use b1u3 low starter either the b1 whiffs or the opponet is too far to connect j2 after b1u3

This.

Her best metered vortex options are:

b23, ji2, 223~bf3 (MB), ji2 (29%)
b1u3, ji3, 112~bf3 (MB), ji2 (30%)

Anything else causes the jump in from the b1u3 string to whiff.

In the corner however, you can end your strings with ji2, etativel cancel 2, 2 for like an extra 4%. However, in the corner she has a meterless vortex so you should prolly use that instead.