What Does MKX Benefit From Having A Block Button?

[Treadmill]

Remember when nrs made a back to block game? Injustice: ambiguous cross ups among us? I don't want that in mk.

 

[RTM2004]

Block button is made for good defense fundamentals. Yes it does eliminate the cross up attempts and teleport nonsense.

The disadvantage of holding block is you open yourself up to chip damage from opponent offense, if you let go of the block button you end up taking damage for not holding it, and if you hold it too long then expose yourself to throws. I'm glad block button stayed, no more dealing with Batman J2 ambiguous that the Batman player doesn't know it will hit or not and even the opponent guessing to block correctly. Actually there is no guess, if it hits it will hit and if it doesn't then congratulations for blocking its ambiguous properties.

That's just me, MK + Block button = Life!

 

[RiBBz22]

Think of the teleports and some of the other crazy moves in MK that can quickly cross up. Having a block button in those scenarios make those types of things much less powerful.

 

[The_Furax]

Having a block button means crossups aren't a problem at all and I think MK would be cool holding back to block. This would surely be a huge change.

 

[quandaghost]

Having a block button means crossups aren't a problem at all and I think MK would be cool holding back to block. This would surely be a huge change.

You would think it's cool to play a game where fully invisible characters can cross you up, and create situations where they can easily do it over and over again for free with no consequence

 

[M.D.]

I'll just repost this..just in case...

 

[@MylesWright_]

Back to block: when having to guess high or low just isn't good enough

 

[Big Pampering]

Honestly, the block button is there just to keep the MK community in the basement.

One could also make the argument that people keep themeselves in the basement of back to block. Anyway I explained many times already what makes a block button different. So if people don't want to listen there is also no need for me to explain.

 

[Big Pampering]

I honestly not sure why I keep hearing certain things.

1. "Cross up teleports" as a reason for BB...
MK was using button long before those existed. Raiden's TP was much slower back then too, plus it requires to attack after that. Not an issue.
Moves are the way they are because of button, not vica versa.
My theory is that devs made most TPs to cross up because they couldn't be arsed to put projectile invincibility into the game. But that besides the point.

2. "Smoke's TP"
Again, it was designed with BB in mind, not vica versa. But let's imagine we put him in b2b game...
Fullscreen there's no mixup as Smoke cloud isn't fast enough (and if it's semi-b2b like IGAU where low block can't be crossed up, you don't even need to react). Blocking againt TP walks Smoke into the corner in the process btw. Up close you are getting b2/TP mixup, but the latter option doesn't lead to damage and is super unsafe. Not even close to unfair. It really boils down to "reset" glitch which makes another option decent.
Two hits of said TP? As if we can't train to block Earthshaker. Smoke's TP is a lot slower than that.

3. "IGAU Scorp was OP"...
I don't even want to comment on this one. He literally wasn't allowed to live, and what came out then is easily bottom 1 character by far, albeit for unrelated reasons. We don't know shit.
This character is what makes me want to petition TYM mods and ask them to tempban anyone who cries OP before a couple of months past MKX release.

4. B2b forces you to give distance.
Yeah, that's one thing I don't like about b2b. Ability to catch spacing out with long normal in MK is nice too. Good or bad, it's MK-specific.
That said, do you really think MK1 was designed with block button because of balance implication of giving distance on b2b? I don't, and honestly, the reasons behind MK having block button were explained by Boon - tradition and "fans want it". That's pretty much it. We just have to adapt to particular system.

Not everything in a fighting game was deigned with all the outcomes already in mind. The block button works the way it does and not even neccessarily because the developer wanted it to work that way.

 

[The_Furax]

You would think it's cool to play a game where fully invisible characters can cross you up, and create situations where they can easily do it over and over again for free with no consequence

A character who has a fully invisibility move would surely be back to his/her visible state with a single touch. With this being said, you have many options to avoid this, unless you are not playing it right.

 

[AnaboliChris]

I'll just repost this..just in case...

IMO thats what made Injustice fun. In fact I made a video with which characters and which button could cross up on wake up when the game first came out.

I had no trouble whats so ever with cross ups or those ambiguous setups with the game. You guys should try playing games like Xrd, UMvC3, ect., where setups are 100% more ambiguous than Injustice.

Edit: Before someone says that "I wouldnt understand because I only play non MK games," well my first fighting games were MK1-2 and my first ever tournament was with MK3. I branched into non MK games during MK4.

 

[Barrogh]

You would think it's cool to play a game where fully invisible characters can cross you up, and create situations where they can easily do it over and over again for free with no consequence

Several teleports. Triple jump. Wall sticking. Pulsating invisibility. Not even top tier (although really good).

Spoiler

It all depends on what kind of game we are talking about and how much bullshit other characters have. And NRS can make a lot of bullshit when they want to.
In the end, mixup is a mixup. You sure won't like being hit low/OH all day more just because somebody presses particular buttons instead of using particular timing. Well, maybe you will, but it won't change much.
Standing block and no option selects on retreat is a bigger deal. I wonder if there's a game that uses [blk+direction] to avoid those problems at once

 

[quandaghost]

Several teleports. Triple jump. Wall sticking. Pulsating invisibility. Not even top tier (although really good).

Spoiler

It all depends on what kind of game we are talking about and how much bullshit other characters have. And NRS can make a lot of bullshit when they want to.

I cant even see what that is

 

[Barrogh]

I cant even see what that is

I fixed my post and edited some more thoughts in. I apologize.

 

[Wetdoba]

Block button and true unblockable grabs in MKX means grappler advantage

 

[Kitana Prime]

Because casuals. A dedicated block button simplifies things.

Thats it.

 

[Sage Leviathan]

Removes crossup mixups entirely, keeps zoning in check, prevents input errors, etc.

 

[quandaghost]

So from what I know about GG which isn't a lot I do know you have more options than what are available in MK defensively. you cannot instant block for frame advantage, you cant green block to be pushed away, but we do have burst. My argument isn't that certain characters can do these things. It the lack of defensive options to keep the things other characters are doing in check. While still having to deal with people chipping 20% of your life away. Not to mention you not being rewarded for even guessing right or bursting because you cannot do anything defensively against it. GG has defensive options that make such play possible. Btw I have played Guilty Gear R+ ( I havent played xrd. I dont lhave a playstation) and though I haven't spent a lot of time with it the people around me have placed high in majors for it, and have shown me it's a more well rounded game in terms of everyone having something to be able to deal with everyone else. You have characters like scorpion in MK9 who can't even apply pressure to people because a universal low is -7 on hit where it's +3 for everyone else.

 

[Colares]

Scanning through, I see people mentioning that you always have to move back when you block. Or rather, moving from one side of the screen through projectiles requires you to walk backwards.

Couldn't you just crouch block? Seems like I'm missing something here.

When you crouch block your hitbox gets wider making you easier to be hit but not giving any advantage(range related)
on footsies that you want the opponent to whiff not hit in your block because they are probably plus on block;
Block button allow more speed on footsies just look at one of the first VF the game is fast 3 buttons only one for block;
Another different example is on Bloody Roar 3 you can do either, cross ups are no existant even with back to block in the game, if you hold block you stand your ground while holding back you give a bit because there isn't preblock that stucks you in place so sometimes is good to walk back a bit and block button to make the last hit of moves on frame traps to whiff; The game go even farther and has a light block if you're on neutral;
Hope that helps

 

[champdee]

mk w/o a block button just wouldn't be MK... but ya basically for the fast teleports, stuff like that... (ie: scropion in injustice)

 

[Colares]

So from what I know about GG which isn't a lot I do know you have more options than what are available in MK defensively. you cannot instant block for frame advantage, you cant green block to be pushed away, but we do have burst. My argument isn't that certain characters can do these things. It the lack of defensive options to keep the things other characters are doing in check. While still having to deal with people chipping 20% of your life away. Not to mention you not being rewarded for even guessing right or bursting because you cannot do anything defensively against it. GG has defensive options that make such play possible. Btw I have played Guilty Gear R+ ( I havent played xrd. I dont lhave a playstation) and though I haven't spent a lot of time with it the people around me have placed high in majors for it, and have shown me it's a more well rounded game in terms of everyone having something to be able to deal with everyone else. You have characters like scorpion in MK9 who can't even apply pressure to people because a universal low is -7 on hit where it's +3 for everyone else.

GG is one of the most beautiful games out there there's a Sirlin blog post that explains what is called balancing defensively so you allow the offense to go as crazy and creative as possible;
KI does it to a certain extent with it's combo system more clear on Combo breakers and counter breakers

 

[Under_The_Mayo]

I despise crossups. I see nothing "cool" about a glitchy mechanic that can cause you to be blocking in the opposite way that you think you are. I´m glad this doesn´t happen in MK. Also, a block button lets you block for overheads without causing you to walk back by accident if they don´t attack.

 

[Biggs]

Having a block button removes left right unblockables or 1 frame blockables (which in actuality no one will block 97% of the time)

 

[DanCock]

i like the block button

1 ~ it allows me to stand still to block
2 ~ it permits me to block when i want too
3 ~ it allows me to buffer special moves easier
4 ~ i dont have to deal with ambiguous cross ups

technically a bunch of others already explained the benefits of it, game play wise in this thread.

 

[SCK ERR0R MACR0]

I think the block button makes the neutral game more important, as long as there aren't other mechanics that overpower everything (such as crazy high damage combos, or resets o'plenty). For example, SFIV:AE was disliked because of all of the setups on hard knockdown--this was all related to cross up. I think it's generally accepted that USFIV is a much better game by having delayed wake up. With that, the point is that knockdown cross-up guesses dominated AE and most like USFIV because it took a good bit of those guaranteed setups away.

The block button makes you fish for openings in different ways, and in my opinion, those openings will come from the neutral game (again, as long as there aren't tons of resets). Someone mentioned back to block stopping you from moving backwards, however, I think this is more a product of proximity blocking. Auto blocking is another thing that sometimes makes its way into back to block games (most notably SF). This allows the opponent to mash DPs when blocking pressure and if the pressure isn't a true blockstring, it will DP, and if it is a true block string, it will block for you while you mash buttons.

Button to block kind of addresses all of these small things. This is just my take, but I understand why some don't like it for removing the crossup mechanic.