Question - Kenshi What changes Kenshi deserves if there is a new patch?

[ismael4790]

Well... ex rising karma is glitched.. if you absorb with armor then kenshi also absorbs the block stun preventing the player from extending combos
Try it out, do a normal ex rising karma run cancel 4,3 Teleflurry. Then do ex rising karma on someone's string (scorpions 2,1,4) then you won't be able to run cancel

I also agree that ex rising karma should be negative, but.. -17? I'd say only -12.

I'm not sure what you are refering to.
After doing ex rising karma through the 214 gap Kenshi can do run into standing 1, 43~Teleflurry without problems.

Anyway, -17 is too negative, yes, imo it should be -15 or maybe -14. When done at point blank range it should remain punishable of course.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

What the fuck, minus 17 is fine for a fast armored launcher

 

[DDutchguy]

What if is EX df 4 special was a overhead lancher ? that way , he would have db4 hitting low and df 4 overhead to compensate his lack of overhead and shity normals . i feel haters coming lol

Safe 50/50s boys!

 

[ismael4790]

What the fuck, minus 17 is fine for a fast armored launcher

It's 14 startup and -17 on block. For example Sub's frost bomb is 15 startup and -10 on block, which vs many characters gets away unpunished. And cryo can get close to 40% from it with another bar iirc.

I'm not asking for that, ex rising karma should be punishable at point blank and also when done slightly separated from the opponent. But now it is "kick my ass please" punishable, even vs many characters is full combo punishable in the range where kenshi can't get more than 19% off it in case it hits.

Nevertheless, EX rising karma current state is the least of Balanced's problems.

 

[DDutchguy]

It's 14 startup and -17 on block. For example Sub's frost bomb is 15 startup and -10 on block, which vs many characters gets away unpunished. And cryo can get past 40% from it with another bar iirc.

I'm not asking for that, ex rising karma should be punishable at point blank and also when done slightly separated from the opponent. But now it is "kick my ass please" punishable, even vs many characters is full combo punishable in the range where kenshi can't get more than 19% off it in case it hits.

Nevertheless, EX rising karma current state is the least of Balanced's problems.

Not a good comparison, midscreen Sub-Zero gets barely any damage off of EX-burst outside of Cryomancer (and even then it can be difficult to combo off of depending on the distance) and the move often outright whiffs when an opponent crosses over and is at their peak height. Balanced's EX rising karma will pretty much always net you an easy 28% damage, stops and all attempts at jumping, hits twice and puts the opponent full screen at the end of a combo. What do you mean about the 19% damage thing though?

EX rising karma is good the way it is now and should not be changed whatsoever. You already have a safe armored wakeup option/reversal when you need one.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

It's 14 startup and -17 on block. For example Sub's frost bomb is 15 startup and -10 on block, which vs many characters gets away unpunished. And cryo can get close to 40% from it with another bar iirc.

I'm not asking for that, ex rising karma should be punishable at point blank and also when done slightly separated from the opponent. But now it is "kick my ass please" punishable, even vs many characters is full combo punishable in the range where kenshi can't get more than 19% off it in case it hits.

Nevertheless, EX rising karma current state is the least of Balanced's problems.

40% 2 bar isn't abnormal and Sub as a whole is a low damage character outside of Cryo and shatters, one of Balanced's only strengths is great raw damage. Sub gets 19% at any range outside of Cryomancer.

Comparing 2 very different character's very different moves shouldn't really be done either.

For the record, Frost Bomb should be consistently full combo punishable too. Safe armor launchers shouldn't exist. Except arguably Tremor because he would be complete ass without it.

Also you already have safe armor, so if you want to get greedy and launch, you have to risk.

 

[ismael4790]

Not a good comparison, midscreen Sub-Zero gets barely any damage off of EX-burst outside of Cryomancer (and even then it can be difficult to combo off of depending on the distance) and the move often outright whiffs when an opponent crosses over and is at their peak height. Balanced's EX rising karma will pretty much always net you an easy 28% damage, stops and all attempts at jumping, hits twice and puts the opponent full screen at the end of a combo. What do you mean about the 19% damage thing though?

EX rising karma is good the way it is now and should not be changed whatsoever. You already have a safe armored wakeup option/reversal when you need one.

I'm thinking about cryo, yes. I compared both moves because they are armor launchers of similar startup and they are both great antiairs for jumpins also.

19% damage comes from Ex rising karma into just teleflurry, which is the option you should choose if the move hitted the opponent while being too far. Because trying to connect 43 or 1 in that situation will most likely whiff. In that range, some characters can also punish you specially if the first spirit whiffs.
I think shaving 2 or 3 frames of the block recovery of the move would be quite appropiate.

But as I said, I don't care at all if the move stays as it is, if some of his other specials get help.
Push on block sucks, overhead slash should be less minus on block and now it sucks on hit, with ex version pointless, ex push should be plus 4-6, and not even gonna mention teleflurry...

 

[ismael4790]

Playing a full auto Jacqui yesterday I came up with an idea for Kenshi.

Balanced could get some kind of MB teleflurry, (similar to Jacqui's MB DF2 that shoots a mid rocket after the machinegun) that made some kind of spirit attack (mid or overhead) come out no matter if teleflurry whiffs or is blocked. It shouldn't be high damaging of course, but would put fear into the opponent's mind if Kenshi had meter from fullscreen, and would allow Kenshi to reduce the deadly effects of a whiffed teleflurry at the cost of spending a bar.

 

[x-azeez]

Playing a full auto Jacqui yesterday I came up with an idea for Kenshi.

Balanced could get some kind of MB teleflurry, (similar to Jacqui's MB DF2 that shoots a mid rocket after the machinegun) that made some kind of spirit attack (mid or overhead) come out no matter if teleflurry whiffs or is blocked. It shouldn't be high damaging of course, but would put fear into the opponent's mind if Kenshi had meter from fullscreen, and would allow Kenshi to reduce the deadly effects of a whiffed teleflurry at the cost of spending a bar.

This idea is Genius

 

[snort]

Give Kenshi a buff where he has a new set of players maining him.

 

[Kenshi-Keanu-Kool]

Playing a full auto Jacqui yesterday I came up with an idea for Kenshi.

Balanced could get some kind of MB teleflurry, (similar to Jacqui's MB DF2 that shoots a mid rocket after the machinegun) that made some kind of spirit attack (mid or overhead) come out no matter if teleflurry whiffs or is blocked. It shouldn't be high damaging of course, but would put fear into the opponent's mind if Kenshi had meter from fullscreen, and would allow Kenshi to reduce the deadly effects of a whiffed teleflurry at the cost of spending a bar.

Something to be safer lol its a good idea , but , at a cost of meter ?! its still a bit harsh , being is normals and pressure so bad , he kinda needs that meter ...!!! But il get anything at this point .....

 

[LaidbackOne]

Safe Spirit charge , Ex rising karma should be plus , an overhead of course , and a 11 poke like cage and im good .

Plus launching armored special. GTFO

 

[ismael4790]

Something to be safer lol its a good idea , but , at a cost of meter ?! its still a bit harsh , being is normals and pressure so bad , he kinda needs that meter ...!!! But il get anything at this point .....

It would be a tool to work with, not to abuse, because Kenshi lives by meter.
But just the fact that he could do it would be a threat. The opponent would doubt a bit if run or not after ducking a teleflurry due to the fear of the MB, same as happens with Jacqui DF2 MB. This would add a mind game to whiffed teleflurry when Kenshi had meter available, that would make the move on whiff safer in some sense.

 

[Kenshi-Keanu-Kool]

Playing a full auto Jacqui yesterday I came up with an idea for Kenshi.

Balanced could get some kind of MB teleflurry, (similar to Jacqui's MB DF2 that shoots a mid rocket after the machinegun) that made some kind of spirit attack (mid or overhead) come out no matter if teleflurry whiffs or is blocked. It shouldn't be high damaging of course, but would put fear into the opponent's mind if Kenshi had meter from fullscreen, and would allow Kenshi to reduce the deadly effects of a whiffed teleflurry at the cost of spending a bar.

You mean like EX SP in MK9 ? His BF2 had armor and than the sword would come out and push the opponent back ?? is that it ?? EXSP woul be better than Teleflurry , EXSP is better for spacing and defense , IF ,EXSP was like in mk9 . Teleflurry is a cheap move already , so , it should be punish .

 

[ismael4790]

You mean like EX SP in MK9 ? His BF2 had armor and than the sword would come out and push the opponent back ?? is that it ?? EXSP woul be better than Teleflurry , EXSP is better for spacing and defense , IF ,EXSP was like in mk9 . Teleflurry is a cheap move already , so , it should be punish .

No, i mean this:

Imagine you do a bf3 and the opponent neutral crouches it. In the current state of the move, even at long range, you can get full combo punished for doing a 9% move.
Now with this MB, you see teleflurry whiff and for a moment you have the chance to press r2, spend a meter, and a second spirit attack (a mid, or a high with better recovery than bf3, I don't know) would come out, so if the opponent planned to immediately run or teleport after the whiffed teleflurry to punish you, he gets hit.

It doesn't matter if this move send the opponent fullscreen or not. It's about making teleflurry safe on whiff paying the price of a bar. Kenshi's zoning with meter would be more effective if this was a reality.

 

[Kenshi-Keanu-Kool]

It would be a tool to work with, not to abuse, because Kenshi lives by meter.
But just the fact that he could do it would be a threat. The opponent would doubt a bit if run or not after ducking a teleflurry due to the fear of the MB, same as happens with Jacqui DF2 MB. This would add a mind game to whiffed teleflurry when Kenshi had meter available, that would make the move on whiff safer in some sense.

i understand . its simple , but still , i rather have SC being safe on block , it would press without having to lose meter , and buidl meter at the same time . just my opinion ..

 

[ismael4790]

i understand . its simple , but still , i rather have SC being safe on block , it would press without having to lose meter , and buidl meter at the same time . just my opinion ..

About soul charge, regular one for Balanced should be similar to possessed charge with less blockstun. Ex version is -2, and it should be like between +4 and +6.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Have you ever fought a good KUNG LAO ?? lol They kill you with cheap damage on block , kenshi has no tools to get out . Plus , dont forget , kenshis normals are baaaaaad bro .He has to have something to make up . All a kung lao player needs to do after taking me like , 20% or more in block damage , is bait out a EXRK , IF he blocks , its goodbye IRENE . Of course , you can say , dont do EXRK , but ...Have you ever played that MU ?!!! But ok , if not EXRK , at least EXSP should be safe

You don't have to take the chip now. He does half the chip as pre patch, and you don't have to respect anything after ex hat. He doesn't get D4 guaranteed anymore, so you can armor.

 

[Error404]

A better backdash. That's it.

 

[Tweedy]

Have you ever fought a good KUNG LAO ?? lol They kill you with cheap damage on block , kenshi has no tools to get out . Plus , dont forget , kenshis normals are baaaaaad bro .He has to have something to make up . All a kung lao player needs to do after taking me like , 20% or more in block damage , is bait out a EXRK , IF he blocks , its goodbye IRENE . Of course , you can say , dont do EXRK , but ...Have you ever played that MU ?!!! But ok , if not EXRK , at least EXSP should be safe

Amirite I mean why do people think Sonya's bombs are cheap. Safe 50/50s? Please. It's all about that Kung Lao chip damage breh. I mean breh each hit of 11 does .4% chip, and HE PLUS. How da fuck. Bruh dats like a block infinite. You add in da 212 and he gone do about 1/100 of your lifebar and be -3. So cheap bruh so muhfuckin cheap.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Amirite I mean why do people think Sonya's bombs are cheap. Safe 50/50s? Please. It's all about that Kung Lao chip damage breh. I mean breh each hit of 11 does .4% chip, and HE PLUS. How da fuck. Bruh dats like a block infinite. You add in da 212 and he gone do about 1/100 of your lifebar and be -3. So cheap bruh so muhfuckin cheap.

Bruh why are people bitchin about cage meterless jailing when Lao doesn't jail with a bar. Lao is broke bruh.

 

[Tweedy]

Bruh why are people bitchin about cage meterless jailing when Lao doesn't jail with a bar. Lao is broke bruh.

People just don't understand cuz. Who wants all that meterless plus sheet when you got a move to spend a bar on that makes you plus. Kenshi is so slow man I swear. It doesn't matter that they gave him a faster button than Kung Lao, he HAS TO EX RK to get out. I just bait dat shit den go to town nah mean cuz. They need to make it -5 so if Kung Lao's cheap, doin 1/100 of a lifebar ass baits it, Kenshi is safe.

That armored move that doesn't launch and hits twice, with a reasonable start up? Make that shit hella plus. Leave the 40%+ damage for a bar, make EX overhead slash a safe launcher, make EX teleflurry have 3 MID hits on block and be plus, and don't forget to give his jump 1 better frames on block and hit, and make it 6 frames.

Maybe then he can compensate for Kung Lao's chip damage. MAYBE

 

[Colest]

I refuse to belive the variation is so bad like Dualist, Hatrick, MoS, Fisticuffs and Ancestral. Someone needs to prove me wrong.

Play it. Hell you don't even have to do that much. Just look at his frame data.

 

[SaltShaker]

Playing a full auto Jacqui yesterday I came up with an idea for Kenshi.

Balanced could get some kind of MB teleflurry, (similar to Jacqui's MB DF2 that shoots a mid rocket after the machinegun) that made some kind of spirit attack (mid or overhead) come out no matter if teleflurry whiffs or is blocked. It shouldn't be high damaging of course, but would put fear into the opponent's mind if Kenshi had meter from fullscreen, and would allow Kenshi to reduce the deadly effects of a whiffed teleflurry at the cost of spending a bar.

Balancing-wise, this is probably one of the best and fairest suggestions I've ever heard.

I can't think of a single reason why anyone would be against this.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

People just don't understand cuz. Who wants all that meterless plus sheet when you got a move to spend a bar on that makes you plus. Kenshi is so slow man I swear. It doesn't matter that they gave him a faster button than Kung Lao, he HAS TO EX RK to get out. I just bait dat shit den go to town nah mean cuz. They need to make it -5 so if Kung Lao's cheap, doin 1/100 of a lifebar ass baits it, Kenshi is safe.

That armored move that doesn't launch and hits twice, with a reasonable start up? Make that shit hella plus. Leave the 40%+ damage for a bar, make EX overhead slash a safe launcher, make EX teleflurry have 3 MID hits on block and be plus, and don't forget to give his jump 1 better frames on block and hit, and make it 6 frames.

Maybe then he can compensate for Kung Lao's chip damage. MAYBE

Man, my safe armor doesn't launch, why can't my armored launcher be safe?