Discussion Variation Tier List (Post Patch)

[D7X]

I completely agree I wasn't trying to make it sound like its all about combos, im js if you want to use it as pressure you have to ex it, but I also dont think mind games makes someone top tier, but I see what youre saying completely, smoke can do the same thing with his phase and his b21, if they are trying to zone you can full punish off his b21 and that leads into a guessing game. But other than that I mostly agree with your list, thanks for sharing dude RATE:8

I didnt imply it was strictly mind games, but his are through the roof. Making the opponent scared to poke happens a lot. Even meterless, his far teleport can add pressure with F4 and it is plus. F12B2 very easy to hit confirm

 

[FOREVER EL1TE]

i could have sworn i put it there oops. where would you place him?

High A tier by your meaning

 

[Rolling_Toaster]

Wait....... For real?

no lmao what? "For the Lin Kuei!"

 

[D7X]

no lmao what? "For the Lin Kuei!"

Lmao, you never know

 

[Snake Sound 222]

@OTHER PEOPLE WHO MAIN THE REST OF THE OTHER CHARACTERS

I agree with this list on Acidic Alien and Slasher Jason. I need to play some more HQT Predator, but I think I will agree with you on him being low S tier.

 

[Wigy]

I refuse to accept GM sub isnt top 5.

Arguably two of his worst MU's got nerfed into the ground, universal buffs helped him and he got buffs on top of that.

He absolutely rapes some of the cast. He had polarising matchups prepatch, but now hes lost most of the really bad ones.

 

[RevetLeafing]

Too high: DN Tanya, High Tech, Warrior, Kenjutsu/Balanced Kenshi, Displacer Raiden, Ethereal Mileena
Too low: CT and Commando Kano, Mournful Kitana, Ronin, GM Scrubzero, Summoner/Sorcerer Quan, Master of Souls

Excuse me sir, Dragon Naginata too high? Are you lost? Confused? I can help you out

 

[Yer_Da]

Fair play for taking the time to collate a tier list, it's always good to have a topical, friendly discussion.

Couple things I have to ask, firstly, is regarding the formatting. You specified what each tier represents (S, A+, A, etc) but then you have High A+, Low A+, High A and Low A. What does that actually mean? If GM Sub is A+ tier then how can Unbreakable also be A+ tier but Lower A+? If GM is better than Unbreakable then it has to be a higher tier. It makes no sense to me.

The second thing I have to ask, and anyone can feel free to answer, is how in the hell is Sektor better than Smoke? Looking at what excels in this game - footsies, safe armour, mixups, zoning, counter zoning, mobility and a safe special - Smoke is top 3 to 5 in all but one category and absolutely shits all over Sektor or am I missing something?

 

[YoloRoll1stHit]

The second thing I have to ask, and anyone can feel free to answer, is how in the hell is Sektor better than Smoke? Looking at what excels in this game - footsies, safe armour, mixups, zoning, counter zoning, mobility and a safe special - Smoke is top 3 to 5 in all but one category and absolutely shits all over Sektor or am I missing something?

Sektor does way better than Smoke in some matchups. Like GM lol. I don't thing comparing tools is a good way to judge tier placement. And obviously Sektor zone/counterzone better than Smoke, can combo off meterless teleport, can stay kinda safe after it and does more damage off everything

 

[ragnar0kz28]

I will throw in my tier list, the original one in this post is pretty accurated, but I will make mine just with less tiers.


S Tier: Ermac (Mystic), Jason (Relentless/Unstoppable), Triborg (Sektor/Smoke), Raiden (Displacer), Predator (HQT), Sub Zero(GM/Cryomancer),
Shinnok (Bone Shaper/Impostor), Sonya (Demolition), Kitana (Assassin/Royal Storm)

A+ Tier: Mileena(Ravenous/Ethereal/Piercing), Tremor (Crystalline/Aftershock), Liu Kang (Flame Fist), Quan Chi (Summoner/Sorcerer),
Takeda (Shirai Ryu/Lasher/Ronin), Jacqui (Full Auto), Cassie (Hollywood)

A Tier: Jacqui (Shotgun), Liu Kang (Dragon Fire), Kung Lao (Buzz Saw/Hat Trick/Tempest), Ermac (Spectral/MOS), Reptile (Nimble/Noxious/Deceptive),
Goro (Dragon Fangs/Tigra Fury), Kano (Cybernetic/Cutthroat), Alien (Acidic/Tarkatan/Konjurer), Tanya (Pyromancer/Kobujutsu),
Sonya (Covert Ops/Special Forces), Shinnok (Necromancer), Kitana (Mournful), Raiden (Master of Storms), Ferra/Torr (Ruthless), Scorpion (Hellfire/Ninjitsu),
Sub Zero (Unbreakable), Cassie (Brawler/Spec Ops), Jason (Slasher), Predator (Hunter), Kenshi (Possessed), Johnny Cage (Stunt Double)

B Tier: Leatherface (Killer), Raiden (Thunder God), Quan Chi (Warlock), Dvorah (Brood Mother/Swarm Queen), Johnny Cage (A-list), Liu Kang (Dualist),
Kano (Commando), Tremor (Metallic), Triborg (Cyber Sub), Kotal Kahn (War God/Sun God/Blood God), Erron Black (Gunslinger), KungJin (Shaolin/Bojutsu),
Predator (Warrior), Jax (Pumped Up), Ferra/Torr (Vicious), Borraicho (Dragon Breath/Bartitsu), Scorpion (Inferno), Goro (Kuatan Warrior), Tanya (Dragon Naginata)

C Tier: Johnny Cage (Fisticufs), Leatherface (Butcher/Pretty Lady), Erron Black (Marksman/Outlaw), Jacqui (High Tech), Kung Jin (Ancestral), Triborg (Cyrax),
Ferra/Torr (Lackey), Dvorah (Venomous), Borraicho (Drunken Master), Kenshi (Balanced/Kenjutsu), Jax (Heavy Weapons/Wrestler)

 

[D7X]

Fair play for taking the time to collate a tier list, it's always good to have a topical, friendly discussion.

Couple things I have to ask, firstly, is regarding the formatting. You specified what each tier represents (S, A+, A, etc) but then you have High A+, Low A+, High A and Low A. What does that actually mean? Surely, if you feel GM Sub is A+ tier then how can Unbreakable also be A+ tier but Lower A+? If GM is better than Unbreakable then it has to be a higher tier. It makes no sense to me.

The second thing I have to ask, and anyone can feel free to answer, is how in the hell is Sektor better than Smoke? Looking at what excels in this game - footsies, safe armour, mixups, zoning, counter zoning, mobility and a safe special - Smoke is top 3 to 5 in all but one category and absolutely shits all over Sektor or am I missing something?

I have to edit that to S A B C etc.

 

[Matix218]

Scorpion lower than Jacqui? No...

 

[AGRxShiroKuma]

I think unbreakable is definitely a solid A.

 

[Yer_Da]

Sektor does way better than Smoke in some matchups. Like GM lol. I don't thing comparing tools is a good way to judge tier placement. And obviously Sektor zone/counterzone better than Smoke, can combo off meterless teleport, can stay kinda safe after it and does more damage off everything

That just tells me that Sektor is a good secondary for Smoke, everyone has at least one bad matchup.

While I agree that comparing tools isn't the be all and end all, it has to be the most important element of judging a character, with matchups taken into heavy consideration. With that in mind, I look at both of their tools and matchups and I don't see how Sektor can be considered better. To each their own, I guess.

 

[Zionix]

I will throw in my tier list, the original one in this post is pretty accurated, but I will make mine just with less tiers.


S Tier: Ermac (Mystic), Jason (Relentless/Unstoppable), Triborg (Sektor/Smoke), Raiden (Displacer), Predator (HQT), Sub Zero(GM/Cryomancer),
Shinnok (Bone Shaper/Impostor), Sonya (Demolition), Kitana (Assassin/Royal Storm)

A+ Tier: Mileena(Ravenous/Ethereal/Piercing), Tremor (Crystalline/Aftershock), Liu Kang (Flame Fist), Quan Chi (Summoner/Sorcerer),
Takeda (Shirai Ryu/Lasher/Ronin), Jacqui (Full Auto), Cassie (Hollywood)

A Tier: Jacqui (Shotgun), Liu Kang (Dragon Fire), Kung Lao (Buzz Saw/Hat Trick/Tempest), Ermac (Spectral/MOS), Reptile (Nimble/Noxious/Deceptive),
Goro (Dragon Fangs/Kuatan Warrior), Kano (Cybernetic/Cutthroat), Alien (Acidic/Tarkatan/Konjurer), Tanya (Pyromancer/Kobujutsu),
Sonya (Covert Ops/Special Forces), Shinnok (Necromancer), Kitana (Mournful), Raiden (Master of Storms), Ferra/Torr (Ruthless), Scorpion (Hellfire/Ninjitsu),
Sub Zero (Unbreakable), Cassie (Brawler/Spec Ops), Jason (Slasher), Predator (Hunter), Kenshi (Possessed), Johnny Cage (Stunt Double)

B Tier: Leatherface (Killer), Raiden (Thunder God), Quan Chi (Warlock), Dvorah (Brood Mother/Swarm Queen), Johnny Cage (A-list), Liu Kang (Dualist),
Kano (Commando), Tremor (Metallic), Triborg (Cyber Sub), Kotal Kahn (War God/Sun God/Blood God), Erron Black (Gunslinger), KungJin (Shaolin/Bojutsu),
Predator (Warrior), Jax (Pumped Up), Ferra/Torr (Vicious), Borraicho (Dragon Breath/Bartitsu), Scorpion (Inferno), Goro (Tigra Fury), Tanya (Dragon Naginata)

C Tier: Johnny Cage (Fisticufs), Leatherface (Butcher/Pretty Lady), Erron Black (Marksman/Outlaw), Jacqui (High Tech), Kung Jin (Ancestral), Triborg (Cyrax),
Ferra/Torr (Lackey), Dvorah (Venomous), Borraicho (Drunken Master), Kenshi (Balanced/Kenjutsu), Jax (Heavy Weapons/Wrestler)

ok.

Pyromancer A+
Metallic A
Vicous A
Sun God A
Fisticuffs B
Cyrax A
Ancestral B
Wrestler B
Outlaw B
Warrior C
Dualist A
Stunt double B
Master of storms B
Spec ops B
Kuatan warrior B
Tigrar fury A
Killer A
Butcher B
Piercing A
Kobu B
Slasher B
Reptile A+ (all)
Konjurer C
Pretty lady B.
Gunslinger A
Hat-trick B
Tempest A+
Shaolin A
Hellfire A+

Done.

There are very few C tier characters in this game and a lot of A tier.

 

[ragnar0kz28]

ok.

Pyromancer A+
Metallic A
Vicous A
Sun God A
Fisticuffs B
Cyrax A
Ancestral B
Wrestler B
Outlaw B
Warrior C
Dualist A
Stunt double B
Master of storms B
Spec ops B
Kuatan warrior B
Tigrar fury A
Killer A
Butcher B
Piercing A
Kobu B
Slasher B
Reptile A+ (all)
Konjurer C
Pretty lady B.
Gunslinger A
Hat-trick B
Tempest A+
Shaolin A
Hellfire A+

Done.

There are very few C tier characters in this game and a lot of A tier.

You probably havnt played any good stunt doubles latelly it is Cages best variation in this version, also that Reptile overating, wow, when will it stop, Slasher is not B Kobu is not B, Hellfire is not A+, actually Ninjitus is hes best variation, Metallic could be better, as what I put him in Tigra Fury is Goros worst variation, Mileena in general is very good,

 

[T-box88]

A good raiden has many options around it. He does extremely well against zoners. I personally don't think he needs another mid with his teleports that can send him a close range. You can make the opponent afraid to poke due to the F4 after far teleport, and the plus frames from ex teleport

not to mention when pressuring with ex teleport some of his shit jails. no need for a mid when your plus a million lol.

 

[T-box88]

I feel like takeda (shirai ryu) should be higher placed. Really the only thing he lost was his booku plus frames after ex kunai. Just makes it so that we have to mix in tele cancels, low kunai, and throws a bit more often (and not brainlessly ex kunai info block string people anymore lol, and it can still be used for dirty set ups), hes very safe when pressuring with teleport cancels, and even though low kunai doesnt jail into anything anymore, its not like our opponents are getting much out of armoring the gaps anyway with the universal removal of launching armor, and f12 stagger is still really good. the trade we got for losing our huge plus frames was much better defense. Hes one of the few characters that still has launching armor (which by the way, is 2 HITS OF ARMOR) f1 is a decent mid, kunai has always been a decent projectile across the map, and hes still one of the most mobile characters in the game with insta air tele. This character is still REALLY solid in my opinion and has a lot of tools. I personally think he transitioned well into the current game.

 

[Wigy]

What bad mus does liu kang have.

I dont know how dragon fire isnt as least top 8

 

[Dankster Morgan]

You probably havnt played any good stunt doubles latelly it is Cages best variation in this version, also that Reptile overating, wow, when will it stop, Slasher is not B Kobu is not B, Hellfire is not A+, actually Ninjitus is hes best variation, Metallic could be better, as what I put him in Tigra Fury is Goros worst variation, Mileena in general is very good,

Stunt Double sucks, Hellfire is definitely A+, Reptile is very good, Tigrar is miles better than Kuatan.

 

[tatterbug4]

I think possessed deserves A or A+

 

[T-box88]

can someone please explain to me what makes displacer raiden so great all of a sudden, not saying the lists are wrong, Im just excited to know why.

 

[T-box88]

cuz i might play him, ive always been interested in him

 

[Espio]

Stunt Double sucks, Hellfire is definitely A+, Reptile is very good, Tigrar is miles better than Kuatan.

People just don't know, but insist they do huehuehue. People that think Reptile is overrated I feel like don't fight the legit Reptiles like THTB etc that really understand the character. Tigrar Fury is in the same time boat.

 

[Yer_Da]

can someone please explain to me what makes displacer raiden so great all of a sudden, not saying the lists are wrong, Im just excited to know why.

Insane mobility, plus frames everywhere, huge mixup potential, huge damage, good zoning, amazing counter zoning and one of the best corner games in the game.