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General/Other - Tremor Tremor General Discussion Thread

I've always felt Liu Kang can beat Tremor in the fireball war just based off of their recovery. Hundreds of matchups the best I can say is that it has to be played very carefully. Otherwise Tremor just gets bullied by the block strings.
 

GrimJack

Rock paper scissor specialist
From all of the match ups that I have played, Dragon's Fire Liu Kang is the most difficult one. You have to understand how the pressure works and your options.

f+2,1,3 xx FBC, f+2,1,3 xx FBC, f+2,1,3 xx FBC is just like pre-patch Scorpion's 2,1,4 xx FBC. If you block the first hit, you are blocking three loops of the same string.

EX flying kick is +2 on block. f+1 (10F) beats f+2 but trades with b+1 (9F). f+1 loses to f+1 (6F) and d+3 (12F low, +1 on block). Backward flash parry (i.e., EX d,b+2 canceled into a backdash) avoids all of the aforementioned options mid screen, including b+1. You cannot waste too much meter on backward flash parries so you must establish f+1 as a primary defensive option. You have no choice. You will otherwise be chipped to death. Because Tremor is able to get 40%+ of damage after f+1,2 with one bar of meter, trying to poke with f+1 is worth the risk. Force the Liu Kang player to use b+1, f+1, and d+3 after EX flying kick. Unlike f+2,1,3, b+1 xx FBC and f+1 xx FBC only give minor advantages on block.

Liu Kang has good zoning too, but the name of the game is Mortal Kombat X so he is far less of a threat far away than he is up close. Approach the zoning carefully. Do not foolishly run into d+3 and f+2,1,3.

Aside from EX flying kick and b+2, he is not very strong at mid range. f+2 and f+4 are fast moves, but they only hit if you are close to Liu Kang.
But it seem like the risk is much higher than the reward.
 

M2Dave

Zoning Master
But it seem like the risk is much higher than the reward.
I have played King Jr., Master D., and Murk and from my experience the risk is worth the reward. f+1,2 leads to 40%+ of damage with one of super meter.

Liu Kang's b+1 is overshadowed by the absurdity of f+2,1,3 xx FBC. If b+1 only hit once, this match would probably be 5:5.
 

ShArp

Dedicated Broly main
Latelly I have been practicing Liu Kang's MU agaist really great liu player on steam @Zeuss and I can def agree that it's one of the hardest (if not) mu for Tremor. When you let liu in you are pretty much option-less from upclose as he is simply on + frames most of the time and will break ALL your armored movies infront of your face.

However my tactic, before I let Liu in to go crazy, is to take the offense by myself. Which basically means waiting while Liu is about to run at you to start the pressure - that's when 7frames startup of F1 becomes your best friend. They run at you expecting you to block, but instead (the last moment) they eat F1 in their face before they can even touch you. You get full combo/free pressure or force them to break and loose their stamina.

I also noticed Liu players loves to jump over you to when they are out of stamina (allways check their stamina) to refill it and continue block strings. So allways be prepared to that jump and anti-air his ass.
 
It may be myself, or the online environment. I'm finding Deceptive Reptile to be a bit of a nuisance against all 3 of Tremor's variations. The most success I had was in Metallic. A bit of looking and it felt as though Tremor was incapable of using armor to escape Reptile's F412 xxx MB DD3 ~ F412 string like some other characters can. Coupled with Reptile's fast D3 with it's short recovery made it especially annoying to deal with.
 

Alakai

Noob
A set up I'm playing around with is ending a combo in f12xxdb2, where the f12 hits when the jugled opponent is at about tremor's head lvel. This would cause the knockdown to be closer to you when compared to a max height f12xxdb2. After that I do ex rolling stone and run up f121. You whiff the f1 so that the f12 is what reaches the oppenent when they get up. If they don't tech roll then it could stuff Cassie's flip kick after she blocks the rolling stone getting up. If they do tech roll the f12 jails after the rolling stone is blocked. Finally if they delay wu then the f12 will hit meaty. The only way to beat this is by waking up with armour but even that sometimes gets beaten depending on which wu it is thanks to how quick the rolling.
 
In effort to try and place a rough number on the Advantage/Disadvantage of Tremor's Shatter Cancels I've taken a character whose pokes are similar in speed to Tremor, Liu Kang; whose D1 is currently measured at a startup of 9 frames (Same as Tremor) The rest goes as follows:
Liu Kang:
D1- 9 Frames
B1 - 9 Frames
F2 - 10 Frames
F4 - 10 Frames
D3 - 12 Frames
D4 - 12 Frames

Below are the various strings Tremor will SC from and my findings for each. While I'm confident in my ability to perform SC's perfectly, I am leaving a margin of error for both executing the cancel as well as the punishment.

I may be off base with this method of testing, but there doesn't seem to be any concrete numbers and only estimations. If I've done something incorrect, then please let me know.


Tremor:
F121 xxx SC D1
Loses To: D1/B1/F2
Trades with: Just Frame (Perfect Timed) D3
Theory: After F121 Tremor is at -3. Given that his D1 is 9 frames and will trade with a perfect D3 from Liu Kang.
-------------------------------------------------
B32 xxx SC D1
Loses To: D1/B1/F2/D3/D4
Beats: BF2 (13 frames) B2 (14 Frames)
Theory: While it loses cleanly to D3 (12 frames) It completely stuffs BF2 (13 frames) Numerical value not established. Perhaps -4?
---------------------------------------------------
B1D4U4 xxx SC D1
Loses To: D1/B1/F2/ As well as D3/4 if timed perfectly
Theory: -4
----------------------------------------------------
21 xxx SC D1
Loses To: D1/B1/F2
Beats: D3
Theory: -2
------------------------------------------------------
21D4U4 xxx SC1
Loses To: D1/B1/F2
Beats: D3
Theory: -2
 
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1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
In effort to try and place a rough number on the Advantage/Disadvantage of Tremor's Shatter Cancels I've taken a character whose pokes are similar in speed to Tremor, Liu Kang; whose D1 is currently measured at a startup of 9 frames (Same as Tremor) The rest goes as follows:
Liu Kang:
D1- 9 Frames
B1 - 9 Frames
F2 - 10 Frames
F4 - 10 Frames
D3 - 12 Frames
D4 - 12 Frames

Below are the various strings Tremor will SC from and my findings for each. While I'm confident in my ability to perform SC's perfectly, I am leaving a margin of error for both executing the cancel as well as the punishment.

I may be off base with this method of testing, but there doesn't seem to be any concrete numbers and only estimations. If I've done something incorrect, then please let me know.


Tremor:
F121 xxx SC D1
Loses To: D1/B1/F2
Trades with: Just Frame (Perfect Timed) D3
Theory: After F121 Tremor is at -3. Given that his D1 is 9 frames and will trade with a perfect D3 from Liu Kang.
-------------------------------------------------
B32 xxx SC D1
Loses To: D1/B1/F2/D3/D4
Beats: BF2 (13 frames) B2 (14 Frames)
Theory: While it loses cleanly to D3 (12 frames) It completely stuffs BF2 (13 frames) Numerical value not established. Perhaps -4?
---------------------------------------------------
B1D4U4 xxx SC D1
Loses To: D1/B1/F2/ As well as D3/4 if timed perfectly
Theory: -4
----------------------------------------------------
21 xxx SC D1
Loses To: D1/B1/F2
Beats: D3
Theory: -2
------------------------------------------------------
21D4U4 xxx SC1
Loses To: D1/B1/F2
Beats: D3
Theory: -2
yea man i think your not doing it fast enough,
f121 shatter cancel couldnt be -3 if a follow up f1 will crush lao's reversal spin/trade with cassies flip kick.
i also just tried it with your method of trying to use normals instead of reversal specials and with f121 shatter cancel to d1 i could beat kangs d1 clean
 

GrimJack

Rock paper scissor specialist
yea man i think your not doing it fast enough,
f121 shatter cancel couldnt be -3 if a follow up f1 will crush lao's reversal spin/trade with cassies flip kick.
i also just tried it with your method of trying to use normals instead of reversal specials and with f121 shatter cancel to d1 i could beat kangs d1 clean
This can be caused by he using Crystalline as the start up of shatter is 4-5 frames slower
 

GrimJack

Rock paper scissor specialist
yea man i think your not doing it fast enough,
f121 shatter cancel couldnt be -3 if a follow up f1 will crush lao's reversal spin/trade with cassies flip kick.
i also just tried it with your method of trying to use normals instead of reversal specials and with f121 shatter cancel to d1 i could beat kangs d1 clean
This can be caused by he using Crystalline as the start up of shatter is 4-5 frames slower
 

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
This can be caused by he using Crystalline as the start up of shatter is 4-5 frames slower
no it wouldnt, i was using crystalline.
crystalline shatter is 5 frames slower than aftershock/metallic till it becomes a active hitbox but they still cancel on the same frames
 
I'll try it again when I get home then. Should I be using After Shock or Metallic?

It could also be skewed because this was done on a television as opposed to my monitor.
 

GrimJack

Rock paper scissor specialist
im cant say 100% to be honest, where did u get 11 from?
From the lastest patch I think. They nerf all cancel involve the dd annotation. I think that they said you have to hold it for 11 frames b4 you could cancel it. Not sure if that is true though
 
Admittedly my Tremor is not where I want him to be. This clip shows a small collection of matches I played against a fellow RM. This match up I've heard is in my favor, yet between 3 variations and even my Co-main in Ermac I could not make a dent in GM or Cryomancer. So feedback is appreciated.

I went with After Shock in the beginning since I've got a fairly decent grasp on IAQ's but it wasn't enough, I was simply outplayed.

 

Marinjuana

Up rock incoming, ETA 5 minutes
You look like a better player then me but I* will say I really don't like Metallic vs GM. He can kind of kill you with those ice balls and EX ones and the clone eats everything. I know you said you tried it but IMO Aftershock is the best equipped to deal with the clone and ice balls in the zoning game. I don't know if he's the best in the corner but those AQ give him another option in the corner to defend against clones. I'll take the corner when I get it but I've started to try to keep this fight in the midscreen. Not a perfect option with that corner carry but he can win the zoning war and GM's damage is mediocre midscreen.
 
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It seems difficult. If he's behind the clone nothing but Rock Shower or DD4 will break the clone or get to Sub Zero. The one time I attempted to armor through it, the clone took the hit leaving Ree free to whiff punish. Other matches I would block a JI1 but couldn't poke out of the B2 follow up, which I'm assuming is as listed 16 frame start up. That may have just been online.

Nevertheless, it seems once in the corner Tremor has very few if any options to counter clone setups. Even a Flash Parry would only work if the Sub Zero player opts to not soak the armor with a D3 or D4.
 
And when im in the corner with the clone in my face i usually just wait for the right moment and air quake or D4 meter burned rock punched to be safe. You could always pick Crystalline and use shatter to destroy the ice balls and attempt to zone.
 

marietta1200

Best Coast
Okay I got to admit LLL Taco mopped my shit for like an hour straight the other day when the ESL dudes were out here, but with that said, D4 xx DB2 is a decent corner tool when sub's aggressive, as is ex DB2. But the matchup is still brutal in the corner against a good gm. You basically cannot jump at all so even iaq becomes risky.
 

The Highlander

There can be only one
Admittedly my Tremor is not where I want him to be. This clip shows a small collection of matches I played against a fellow RM. This match up I've heard is in my favor, yet between 3 variations and even my Co-main in Ermac I could not make a dent in GM or Cryomancer. So feedback is appreciated.

I went with After Shock in the beginning since I've got a fairly decent grasp on IAQ's but it wasn't enough, I was simply outplayed.

Nice, I wish more people would record. I love watching other Tremors. You, for instance, reminded me that regular dd4 is a move that I should definitely be using in this match-up. My constructive criticism would be work on anti-airs, since in the matches I watched I saw him jumping at you quite a lot. Easier said than done though.
 

marietta1200

Best Coast
It seems difficult. If he's behind the clone nothing but Rock Shower or DD4 will break the clone or get to Sub Zero. The one time I attempted to armor through it, the clone took the hit leaving Ree free to whiff punish. Other matches I would block a JI1 but couldn't poke out of the B2 follow up, which I'm assuming is as listed 16 frame start up. That may have just been online.

Nevertheless, it seems once in the corner Tremor has very few if any options to counter clone setups. Even a Flash Parry would only work if the Sub Zero player opts to not soak the armor with a D3 or D4.
Finally watched the whole set. Good stuff!

I think at one point you did rock drop into B1D4 out of the corner? He was probably conditioned but still--that was great. Also always JI3 over the clone. It actually touches him. DO NOT USE 1 OR 2 haha. 1 might work, rarely. 2 never. Always gotta watch your spacing on less than 3/4 screen projectiles too, sub punishes a ton of stuff if it's risky spacing. Bait the hell out of slide if you can get him cornered.
 

smokey

EX Ovi should launch
Can anyone let me know how many and which moves of Tremors are armoured (all variations) and if there are any gaps in his strings to backdash or armour? Updating mkxframedata and noticed that Tremor has nothing noted here.