Strategy "There Is No Justice!" - Scorpion Oki & Mixups thread

[Jaku2011]

Ok so I tried it in a match and I was able to hit the cross up j1 of course it was Aquaman and he trailed up after but I did hit it, will try it out some more. I am intrigued

 

[1man3letters]

Ok so I tried it in a match and I was able to hit the cross up j1 of course it was Aquaman and he trailed up after but I did hit it, will try it out some more. I am intrigued

you say that like you thought it wouldnt work lol (joke)
by the way if your using j1 make sure not to press 1 until your over the opponent, you can press j1 earlier than j2 and it will still cross up that the move has so many active frames but doing the j1 early causes the wakeups to auto correct

 

[Jaku2011]

No I just thought it would be more complicated like when you said you have to walk back with small characters. Seemed too much for my puny mind.

 

[1man3letters]

No I just thought it would be more complicated like when you said you have to walk back with small characters. Seemed too much for my puny mind.

yea its pretty simple when u find the timing were to press the j1/j2.
yea the walk back thing is a minor annoyance vs the smaller characters alright and thats only if u want to empty jump and still land in front but still thought id mention it to avoid later confusion.

 

[OBS|KH Rattlehead]

Wow this is some good info. Will hit the lab and get used to this then practice it with matchups. Even though Scorp has so little reward, I still want to main him and push him to his limits.

 

[PANDA]

Ya, knew about this already and have been experimenting with it.
However, I find that his standing vortex yields better results as it does not give them a chance of a wake-up attack therefore being stuck in the vortex.
I only use this when I want to stuff their wake-up with MB B3.

 

[1man3letters]

Ya, knew about this already and have been experimenting with it.
However, I find that his standing vortex yields better results as it does not give them a chance of a wake-up attack therefore being stuck in the vortex.
I only use this when I want to stuff their wake-up with MB B3.

wish ya had of posted it then, the scorpion forum above all others can not afford for people to be sitting on/hiding tech

real talk, scorpions standing vortex is clown shoes man,
16 frame low and 25 frame overhead? EASILY fuzzy guarded, compare that to kf and batgirls frame data on there 50/50s, yea, clown shoes.

as ive stated in OP the option of a wakeup attack is very much not in there favor for certain characters, leading to full punish.
for example superman,cyborg or green lantern try waking up out of this? ggs health bar

 

[PANDA]

wish ya had of posted it then, the scorpion forum above all others can not afford for people to be sitting on/hiding tech

real talk, scorpions standing vortex is clown shoes man,
16 frame low and 25 frame overhead? EASILY fuzzy guarded, compare that to kf and batgirls frame data on there 50/50s, yea, clown shoes.

as ive stated in OP the option of a wakeup attack is very much not in there favor for certain characters, leading to full punish.
for example superman,cyborg or green lantern try waking up out of this? ggs health bar

Wasn't trying to hide it at all. Just thought it wasn't that useful (no offense)
but i'll give it another go and see what i can further develop with this...

 

[1man3letters]

Wasn't trying to hide it at all. Just thought it wasn't that useful (no offense)
but i'll give it another go and see what i can further develop with this...

none taken

 

[Jaku2011]

It's bad versus character like MM or SHAZAM but it's been working pretty well at least for me.

 

[1man3letters]

It's bad versus character like MM or SHAZAM but it's been working pretty well at least for me.

yea MMH's push gets out of it, even though it 14 frame but the setup can safe jump GL's 10 frame lift.
its either from the animation of the push or the frame data is wrong, havnt tested to confirm yet. it doesnt work, thats all i need to know for now lol.
lex gets out of it aswell pretty handy, for some reason if charge goes other way it still hits scorpion.
maybe i should add a list to the op of what gets out of it? watcha think?

with shazam, yea theres no oki on him with any character,not just hanzo

 

[Jaku2011]

Good idea maybe a list of the characters that you need to step back for too so far I've got catwomen, Harley, Killer Frost, and maybe Green Arrow, not too sure on him.

 

[AssassiN]

Sounds good, but is it a good replacement for leaving them standing with 112~Teleport?
If you could hit them with F22D3 midscreen without the use of meter then I would start using this.

 

[1man3letters]

Good idea maybe a list of the characters that you need to step back for too so far I've got catwomen, Harley, Killer Frost, and maybe Green Arrow, not too sure on him.

with the step back thing i think its only for the girls but ill double check later.

Sounds good, but is it a good replacement for leaving them standing with 112~Teleport?
If you could hit them with F22D3 midscreen without the use of meter then I would start using this.

its not a replacement of 112~telepunch, just another option.

well found out other day certain trait combos give the same spacing as if there was a j2 with just f22d3 after the trait to give the crossup setup if you don't fancy using meter

 

[AssassiN]

its not a replacement of 112~telepunch, just another option.

well found out other day certain trait combos give the same spacing as if there was a j2 with just f22d3 after the trait to give the crossup setup if you don't fancy using meter

Oh k, thought it was a better option to use.

Everyone plays the character their way, I like to always end my combo's in 212.
I prefer to keep my meter for Teleport MB, I'll use MB if I catch someone with a naked spear or do Hellfire MB to get some extra damage but I never reset my combo with Spear MB.

I don't play the character a lot nor do I spend time with him in the lab. So I won't get too technical with him in the character forums, could be that I'm not playing the character right.

 

[1man3letters]

Oh k, thought it was a better option to use.

Everyone plays the character their way, I like to always end my combo's in 212.
I prefer to keep my meter for Teleport MB, I'll use MB if I catch someone with a naked spear or do Hellfire MB to get some extra damage but I never reset my combo with Spear MB.

I don't play the character a lot nor do I spend time with him in the lab. So I won't get too technical with him in the character forums, could be that I'm not playing the character right.

i end my combos in a few different ways, good to mix it up i feel.
use 212 at times aswell from when ya mentioned it as a combo ender in the hellfire thread.
yea most of my meter is used on MB hellfire and MB telepunch but still do use MB spear a fair bit.

 

[Jaku2011]

You don't need to with Wonder Woman, but I guess with that face is she really a girl?

 

[1man3letters]

im so happy i can use the 2u3/2~mb telepunch mixup on the whole cast now,
sure just like 212/21~mb telepunch one its fuzzy guardable but 21 whiffs on some characters unless you jail them with a blocked j2 were as 2u3 works vs full cast all the time.

 

[BoricuaHeat]

21 is going to be essential to scorpions frame trap/mix up game since it is the one of the strings he has that leaves him at plus frames on block. Leading to mix ups like 21 or just 2 into mb teleport for a quick cross up, 21 into a 2u3 overhead frame trap, or 21 and go for a b1 into trait to be safe. 2u3 on block allows you to go for a flip kick for free chip, and a sneaky d3 to catch them pressing buttons (haven't tested df3 should work tho).

11 should be possible after 21(+5) if the in game frame data is correct which would lead to another mix up situation.

Also j1 at max jump height buffered into standing 3 will trade with 6 frame moves, and buffered into 21 will jail most characters.

 

[1man3letters]

21 is going to be essential to scorpions frame trap/mix up game since it is the one of the strings he has that leaves him at plus frames on block. Leading to mix ups like 21 or just 2 into mb teleport for a quick cross up, 21 into a 2u3 overhead frame trap, or 21 and go for a b1 into trait to be safe. 2u3 on block allows you to go for a flip kick for free chip, and a sneaky d3 to catch them pressing buttons (haven't tested df3 should work tho).

11 should be possible after 21(+5) if the in game frame data is correct which would lead to another mix up situation.

Also j1 at max jump height buffered into standing 3 will trade with 6 frame moves, and buffered into 21 will jail most characters.

21 has too much pushback to use a follow up 1, it will whiff. d3,df3,f2,b1 only normals with enough range to reach.
also about 21 i updated the whiff data thread just there with the characters 2nd hit of 21 whiffs on, its not as many as b12 but still good to know

 

[BoricuaHeat]

21 has too much pushback to use a follow up 1, it will whiff. d3,df3,f2,b1 only normals with enough range to reach.
also about 21 i updated the whiff data thread just there with the characters 2nd hit of 21 whiffs on, its not as many as b12 but still good to know

After some testing (on the Flash) yeah, 11 is not a good option, however, 2 will reach after a face to face 21 leaving you at just the right range to go for 2u3 (character specific yeah, but once they respect the other options, start using this one), f1, and flip kick. Which will lead into solid mix ups like 2 into mb teleport or just raw 2u3. And after some testing, the only legitimate frame trap after 2u3 is mb teleport to catch a back dash.

F22 into trait catches people pressing buttons which opens up even more options now like f22u3 into teleport cross up or trait to catch people expecting the teleport. I am loving this character!

 

[1man3letters]

After some testing (on the Flash) yeah, 11 is not a good option, however, 2 will reach after a face to face 21 leaving you at just the right range to go for 2u3, f1, and flip kick. Which will lead into solid mix ups like 2 into mb teleport or just raw 2u3. And after some testing, the only legitimate frame trap after 2u3 is mb teleport to catch a back dash.

F22 into trait catches people pressing buttons which opens up even more options now like f22u3 into teleport cross up or trait to catch people expecting the teleport. I am loving this character!

in the two main places your going to get chance to get off 21 of in real match, from a jump in & after telepunch you cant get 2 after 21.
even if u dash up and 21 you have to be at a perfect touching distance for it to work or it will whiff and you will be punished.

with f22~trait, what your thinking behind that?
i dont see any reasons for the opponent to press buttons that the u3 in 22u3 cant be interupted, could see 22u3 into flipkick/telepunch catching people pressing buttons more so than f22~trait

glad you loving scorpion also, more talk around here the better

 

[BoricuaHeat]

in the two main places your going to get chance to get off 21 of in real match, from a jump in & after telepunch you cant get 2 after 21.
even if u dash up and 21 you have to be at a perfect touching distance for it to work or it will whiff and you will be punished.

with f22~trait, what your thinking behind that?
i dont see any reasons for the opponent to press buttons that the u3 in 22u3 cant be interupted, could see 22u3 into flipkick/telepunch catching people pressing buttons more so than f22~trait

glad you loving scorpion also, more talk around here the better

My scorp just loves jumping. Jump 1 into 21 puts you in the perfect distance for at least a 2 connecting after 21.

F22 trait is just me learning some of scorps pressure game, since it has the most cancel advantage of the f2 strings while staying at -4, the wide hit box of the trait makes it decent for pressure, they get scared to even press buttons allowing for a teleport check or any attack you got with range. f22u3 is good too, haven't tested much on this.

Scorpion does have a lot of holes in his game that have to be covered with the mb teleport or just the fear of it. Great nether realms meter management is key in with this guy.

 

[1man3letters]

My scorp just loves jumping. Jump 1 into 21 puts you in the perfect distance for at least a 2 connecting after 21.

it shouldnt, like mentioned in post above after a jump in or after telepunch in a vortex combo if your opponent blocks 21, follow up 2 will whiff.
just tested there on flash to be 200% sure and theres too much pushback off both j1,21 & j2,21 to get 2 after

 

[BoricuaHeat]

it shouldnt, like mentioned in post above after a jump in or after telepunch in a vortex combo if your opponent blocks 21, follow up 2 will whiff.
just tested there on flash to be 200% sure and theres too much pushback off both j1,21 & j2,21 to get 2 after

Hmm weird, even did human testing to stay sure before posting. But turns out 2 will whiff sad day, well just one less option after a blocked 21 won't hurt.