The official buffs/nerfs discussion thread.

[Hitoshura]

Theres nothing wrng w/ kano. damage isnt everythng. Mk9 is mainly about setups like 4 ex: johnny cage can knock u down or set up a reset w/ nut punch. same for kabal.

kano lacks damage but w/e his main bnb is can also be used for great pressure seeing how it gives u plus on block and u can setup off of it with choke or upball. choke is also good for pressure. he can jump & ball to avoid projectiles. hes has 1 rlly good frame trap tht rlly practical. u cnt combo into x-ray but he can setup some shit for mind games and catch u. whn ur in the corner its hard 2 escape b/c u can upball or stop jumps w his d+1 (i thnk) if u lay on the ground he can otg u....i can keep going if u wnt. Kano is very solid & shouldnt b touched.

Dn't make me get d.barret in here and yell then he will get banned 4 a week again for makn every1 look dumb XD

 

[MagicMan357]

Theres nothing wrng w/ kano. damage isnt everythng. Mk9 is mainly about setups like 4 ex: johnny cage can knock u down or set up a reset w/ nut punch. same for kabal.

kano lacks damage but w/e his main bnb is can also be used for great pressure seeing how it gives u plus on block and u can setup off of it with choke or upball. choke is also good for pressure. he can jump & ball to avoid projectiles. hes has 1 rlly good frame trap tht rlly practical. u cnt combo into x-ray but he can setup some shit for mind games and catch u. whn ur in the corner its hard 2 escape b/c u can upball or stop jumps w his d+1 (i thnk) if u lay on the ground he can otg u....i can keep going if u wnt. Kano is very solid & shouldnt b touched.

Dn't make me get d.barret in here and yell then he will get banned 4 a week again for makn every1 look dumb XD

Im tired of this "he has tools" excuse

Thats BS, why is it that SF has power characters with tools yet still do serious damage? Its because their character philosophy is on point and makes sense.

If this was anyone else everybody would be crying

b1,1,2-2,1,2-f1,2-upball 32%
b1,1,2-2,1,2-f1,1-upball 32%

REALLY?

 

[Abudabi]

MAIN: Rain
BUFF: Freddy
NERF: Kung Lao
EXPLANATION: Remove Kung Lao's spin and give it to Freddy. And then ban freddy from tournaments. Yup.

 

[Reedoms]

If this was anyone else everybody would be crying

b1,1,2-2,1,2-f1,2-upball 32%
b1,1,2-2,1,2-f1,1-upball 32%

REALLY?

Noob can barely get those numbers in the corner without EX. Big damage combos aren't all you need in this game.

 

[MagicMan357]

Noob can barely get those numbers in the corner without EX. Big damage combos aren't all you need in this game.

yet noob has ridiculous zoning and resets and plentiful mindgames

I know i sound like a hypocrite but people over exaggerate kano is what im saying

72% reset ftw

noob is a mindgame king

btw noob can get a 40% midscreen, just takes precision but atleast its able to be done unlike kano's

 

[Reedoms]

yet noob has ridiculous zoning and resets and plentiful mindgames

Kano can zone better than Noob can believe it or not. Knives recover faster than shadows.

 

[MagicMan357]

Kano can zone better than Noob can believe it or not. Knives recover faster than shadows.

True but what happens when you duck them?

Now kano has to kome to you

noob has high,med,low clones and can punish as soon as someone throws a projectile

noob isa damn G

 

[Dark_Rob]

I dont think NRS ever should have nerfed Kano's knives. The upball madness I understand. But the knives werent that bad. I dont know how you can take Kano's fast knives away from him and then give Skarlett one thats twice as fast and pushes back. I mean compared to some of the other projectiles in this game, were Kano's knives prepatch really THAT bad? I dont think so.

 

[sleepykyo]

Main: Kung Lao, Mileena, Kitana, Cage, Skarlett or basically undecided

Buffs: Sheeva and Striker
Nerfs: None until the dlc characters have been at a couple of tourneys

Explanation: Outside of Sheeva and Striker every character has seen some usage, Evo top 8 was fairly diverse. Also it seems like any cross section of the community tends to be pretty divided on nerfs and buffs anyway.

 

[twostep]

If you wanna nerf cyraxs damage they should make 3 3 a low starter.

 

[imblackjames]

Main: Jax
Buff: Jax, Sheeva, Baraka, Mileena
Nerf: Cyrax, Raiden, Sheeva, Mileena

Explination:
Jax: he needs to have either f4, 1, 3 OR 2, f2, b1 be a true launcher and make it so you can string 1, 2, 3 with a special move without needing the opponent to be in the air in the corner if they made it mid screen itd be great.

Sheeva: Make her f3 quicker and make her f3, b1 cancel into a special move make her ex low grab have more reach. (nerf) slow down her recovery on her telestomp just a little bit

Baraka: his Ex blade spin should be like kung laos and pop them up also his blade charge should go further.

Cyrax: all of those resets are ridiculosus i say either get rid of them or scale the bombs damage down a ton

Raiden: Superman when blocked should either keep them in air longer or make it so they spin closer to you

Mileena: Make her rolling ball hit low medium when enhanced, (nerf) low pokes and when her teleport is blocked have the her spin off

 

[Lyuben]

MAIN: Sub-Zero and Cyber
BUFF: Sub-Zero, Sheeva, Stryker, Baraka
NERF: Kung Lao
EXPLANATION: Buff Sub to fix his broken match ups. Sheeva stryker and baraka are both very low tier and just need to be better to compete. Kung Lao needs to be slower, his chip damage on 21212 needs to really change, I would make all his normals and specials slower than they are now. Cyrax and Freddy do not need nerfs, they need fixing. The resets and damage scaling are not intended and need to be made normal.

 

[ELC]

Main - Scorpion
Buff - Sheeva, Baraka, Stryker
Nerf - Kung Lao, Cyrax, Freddy

Logical Song - Scorpion reminds me of a mash-up of Ky and Order-Sol from Guilty Gear, my two mains there (not so much individually: that'd be Sindel and Mileena). Sheeva, to paraphrase someone either here or on GameFAQs, "Dies if you just watch what she's doing." Meaning she could use a speed boost, or at least less obvious animations. Baraka has the same problem. Stryker just need a good knockback reversal: his zoning/tele-baiting game with gun-charge-cancel is pretty good in terms of zoning, but up close he is just . . . blah. Kung Lao has way too many good tools (reversal, teleport, projectile) at his disposal. And Cyrax and Freddy need damage scaling/reset issues fixed.

 

[Maxter]

psl dotn buff jax he is killing even my cyrax

main:cyrax, sektor, subzero, noob saibot, reptile, kung Lao, cyber Sub zero, Sindel, Jade, coming up. freddy krueger
buff: low skillful players, who complaints about something such as d-4, d-1, low hats, cyrax damage. these pokes can be blocked and jump back, hit boxes on them defend these characters against jumping whores who just want to combo, use your kicks goddamn it, why kung laos spin dont get nerfed so i can jump freely back and forth and combo him? also you can get out of any pokes by just blocking and jumping back, dont jump foward to sub zero d-4 or you will ask for it or clone to go, out zone cyrax and build meters or make him use his so u dont get combos.
nerf: high skillful players so they dont make lowbies complaint about something so simple to avoid
remove breakers so i can do my 80 percent damage with cyrax so it paid off to chase after meter builders, who break my combos when i catch up

omg i saw someone asking for jax to be buffed? jesus christ ground pound is so op canceling and tricking people to jump, damage on it is ridiculous, he got a block infinite frame trap cd jr and i found about, he is kicking my ass, pls buff jax players skills so they dont ask for buffs, his hit boxes are twice bigger than him, you cant outzone him with goddamn flash like dash punch and he builds meters like no one else, he can even use jabs '1' as an anti air to hit even kicks, i having nightmares with jax, his hits all have priority over the rest of the cast, can only beat him with cyrax when he waste his meters dashing punch i do high damage combos, if i get lucky touching that black tower, if he takes me to the the corner im dead, please dont buff him, i wont ask for nerfs but learn how to play jax he is easily top 3 the way he is, people will cry at summer jam cd jr's jax.

buff subzero ice ball freezing time and recovery and ground freeze speed, iceball is useless at mid ranged and if you are not behind a clone u dead, armored slider will suck at long ranged since it will wiff or people will trick you to do it to land a 50% combo. with faster ice blast and longer freezing time people wont abuse their projectiles to kill the poor iceblock.

don't nerf kitana damage or low pokes no need too, or mileena d-4 hit box, no need too, learn how to kick or poke back goddamn it.

 

[CptXecution]

True but what happens when you duck them?

Now kano has to kome to you

noob has high,med,low clones and can punish as soon as someone throws a projectile

noob isa damn G

Are you really still crying for a damage buff for Kano? Unbelievable...you clearly are not playing him right. A damage buff for Kano would make him damn near OP with all the tools he has. YES TOOLS!! USE THEM. Just because a character didn't make top 8 at EVO doesn't make him a bad character.

 

[Massive Kano]

Are you really still crying for a damage buff for Kano? Unbelievable...you clearly are not playing him right.

Care to explain how to do it right? Here are the most useful tools I'm seeing: A decent projectile (on the fast side and good damage but no low/air options, comboability or other "fancy" stuff that would make this aspect of his game epic), a good anti-air, a pseudo dive kick with an annoying input and seemingly endless recovery on block, a good sweep, jump kick into air throw, high and low starters for his arguably worst in the entire game combos. This is not truly a bad lot, but it doesn't compare to the Kung Laos, Skarlets, Freddys, Reptiles, Cyber Subs, etc. All-in-all, I'd put him just a little tiny bit south of what should be average in this game. But he's close. Very close.

I'd either add about 5% onto all his longer combos or make blocked airball recovery work like Sonya or Cyber Sub's blocked dive kicks. Not both, though.

 

[danymort]

Main: Mileena, Ermac, Cyrax, Kitana

Buffs: Mileena
Nerfs: Cyrax, Kung Lao, Kano

Explanation:

Mileena is freaking fast and stuff, but damage scaling makes her last combo hits do nearly 0-1% damage, bit increase of that please.

Agree with Cyrax reset is unfair, but also agree with 3 3 should be a low starter, Cyrax has no combos starting as low while KL mix mid low high.

Kano's ball should have more frames when fail, its hardly unpunishable.

 

[PND OmegaK]

Mains: Reptile and Shang
Buffs: Baraka, Stryker, Sheeva, Sindel
Nerfs: Kitana, Kabal, Reptile, Cyrax, Kung Lao.

Kitana smells
Kabal gets guarenteed buzzsaw
Reptile's invisiblity is OP, how can kung lao cope?
Cyrax has a tiny net. Oh and ridiculous resets.
Kung Lao is Kung Lao.

 

[kabelfritz]

main: jade, sub-zero, raiden
buff: stryker, sub (needs something on his slide against chars who can simply run away from him like mileena)
nerf: raiden (yes please nerf my main (teleport), i feel fucking retarded playing him), kung lao (just a tiny bit more and he will be ok), kitana (no more unbreakable 50%s), reptile (more recovery on blocked dash or slower startup or both), cyrax (less stun after command grab, get rid of that overhead bomb popup or whatever it is), freddy (scaling broken)

 

[Sasuga]

 

[Zerosoulreaver]

Main: Sindel
Buffs: Sindel
Nerfs: Freddy, Cyrax

Sindel has only a few combo options, almost all of her meaty combos stem from back 3 forward 2. Her enhanced scream is useless, it's the same as regular scream just slightly faster and slightly more range. Her levitate is still worthless and most of her moves are easily beaten out.

Freddy needs fixing badly in terms of scaling dmg and projectiles going through...as said many times before.
Cyrax has a bit too many options to hit insane combos. It needs to be scaled down.

 

[Juggs]

Hope they do "nerf" Cyrax again. Last time they nerfed Cyrax... he got better.

Nerf away!

 

[Hitoshura]

Im tired of this "he has tools" excuse

Thats BS, why is it that SF has power characters with tools yet still do serious damage? Its because their character philosophy is on point and makes sense.

If this was anyone else everybody would be crying

b1,1,2-2,1,2-f1,2-upball 32%
b1,1,2-2,1,2-f1,1-upball 32%

REALLY?

That damage is pretty damn fair considering how he can get in ur face well enough than most ppl can. Reason why sf charcters have high damage and tools is b/c its sf...not mk9. You just want ur character to be super good. Oh abd by the way noob cant get tht high damage mid screen unless u use resets. noob has some of the worst combo damage midscreen w/o the use of resets. Stryker and naraka do more damage than he does, yet im not complaining. I knw what makes noob good and what he needs.

Your just mad b/c you probably can't abuse kano's tools right and u want more damage 2 make up for it. All I have to say is step your game up.

 

[Shadowclaimer]

See below post.

 

[Shadowclaimer]

Main: Ermac
Buffs: Sindel, Kano, Jax, Stryker, Sheeva, Baraka
Nerfs: Raiden, Kung Lao
Changes: Ermac, Cyrax

Sindel: See above points, she's good, she just lacks a lot of tools necessary to be great.

Kano: His X-ray is uncomboable (which it should be, its easily avoidable), if it takes a damage nerf to make it comboable so be it. Same applies to Jax. Change his input of his ball from half-circle forward to something else (Back forward Triangle?) and give him a little bit more combo damage. Maybe add in his eye laser as a move to extend his combos more? I'd also be willing to sacrifice projectile strength for other gains.

Jax: Lacks combo-ability in proper situations, really fun character, fun design, lacking in some areas. I don't play him too much so I can't provide exact specifics on what needs to be changed, just overall he feels lacking.

Stryker: Needs something, he's awesome and fun to play, he just isn't competitive. Some new moves or changes to his current moves would be necessary to improve him. Anything he can do, someone else can do better.

Sheeva: Heavy and slow, noticeable what move she's using with plenty of time to prepare. Needs cancelability or something to improve her and make her useable competitively.

Baraka: Fun at lower tier gameplay, but as soon as shit gets serious he gets stomped by any of the upper tier characters. Another "he just lacks tools" kinda character. Some of the other posters have had some great suggestions for him.

Raiden: Teleport.. so.. fast.. that's really my main issue with him. I love him as a character, I play the crap out of him, but my God that teleport. I'm sure other people can point out other things wrong with him. (as Ermac I have no issues with punishing Superman on block with TKL, but others probably have issues).

Kung Lao: This is where the other character's lacking tools have ended up. I'd say make his recovery on his spin better (not worse) and make him not push you away when blocked would be a huge fix. Lower spin's back hitbox some (its kinda ridiculous to try to punish it from behind and randomly get hit by it miles away)

Ermac: As he is my main, I'd just like to see his bad matchups addressed, I don't want him buffed specifically (if it can be avoided) I just want him to have fair matchups across the board.

Cyrax: Remove resets, give him whatever people above me were wanting for him to compensate. I'd take that trade any day.

Also all resets should be addressed properly.. if the character has to rely on them the character isn't designed well to begin with and needs to be reimbursed for the loss of them, but no one should ever rely on resets. This includes Noob, Subzero, and Cyrax and whoever else has them. Just compensate those who lose them and need them (IE: Noob) and remove them.