The "Let's Be Serious Here" Podcast Episode 6, featuring DarthArma and Playing To Win

[deathblooms2k4]

you mean to tell me a friend of mine in his 30s who has no interest in playing VGs will watch DOTA over DC Fighter???
Nope

You want to choose age demographics? As somebody in that age demographic who knows plenty of people there, the majority of the time the person will be interested in neither. super hero fighting games are just as niche as mobas and somebody not interested in either will not enjoy watching them. I have friends who will yell D4 randomly to patronize me for the times they were forced to watch mileena on stream while Ninj and I were watching your pre kenshi days, they had no idea what D4 means or what they were watching and without any understanding I'm sure they'll concede it was boring to watch. If you want to argue popularity I don't have to speculate I can look up the numbers for you, it's no contest. The FGC pales in comparison. Evo the super bowl of fighting games pales in comparisons to those of SC2, Dota2 and LoL. The crowds for those games are enormous, people travel from around the world and don't need to have fundraisers held for them to travel because they get paid enough to do it on their own. Let alone the prize pools are insane in comparison. 20k vs. over 2 million. Just based on the numbers it's illogical to say otherwise.

It's not like the big mobas run commercials on TV. The FGC is afforded the same social media and streaming opportunities and yet it greatly pales in comparison. I mean does it not speak volumes that on any given day select players from certain pro teams can randomly stream their pub matches and gain more viewers than fighting game grand finals?

The numbers speak for themselves. 200k viewers watching dota2 and lol right now 1.6k watching SF4.

As somebody who enjoys playing and watching both I don't approach this with any sort of bias, just saying how it is. I find them both entertaining in the end.

 

[cR WoundCowboy]

No one lied... in the span of a weekend you became one of the whiniest and classes players. I hope you do well going forward, I'd hate to see how much worse this can get. I've never not been a supporter of you.. You kicked and KICKED me when you THOUGHT i was down for the count and i STILL dont hold it against you.

lol i've heard what you have been saying behind my back. Quit trying to pretend like you are humble and passive. And no I have not discredited the people who beat me, good shit to them. I am allowed to say that I don't think my character is good without discrediting others. You have also CONSTANTLY lied about the extreme disrespect you have shown to other players and you always distort the things that I say in order to suit your purpose. Stop talking about me unless I am there.

 

[Tom Brady]

lol i've heard what you have been saying behind my back. Quit trying to pretend like you are humble and passive. And no I have not discredited the people who beat me, good shit to them. I am allowed to say that I don't think my character is good without discrediting others. You have also CONSTANTLY lied about the extreme disrespect you have shown to other players and you always distort the things that I say in order to suit your purpose. Stop talking about me unless I am there.

I have admitted that I have allowed what ppl say to get to me and that it led to me being a classless individual (among other things). HOWEVER, over the last 2 months this has not been the case. I have insulted no one nor have I shown anyone any disrespect. I will never allow what ppl say to influence what I do, say, how I feel, or how I view/talk about others. At one time I was disrespectful, and it was most likely out of some childish insecurity that I felt because something that others said. Never again...

You however bring up things from before this as if I denied it. Your issue with me now seems to be the nicer I am, the more it pisses off you and others like you. You are either stuck in the past or stuck on this notion that its just a show for the camera. Unfortunate that you feel this way, even more unfortunate to see you heading down the same road that I did starting back in MK 2011..

Dwell on the past if you must though, but while you dwell on it, make sure you dont fall down that path I did at one time.

 

[YOMI MITYEAP]

@deathblooms2k4, honestly u are not lying. Fighting games are light years behind strategy games in prize pots and etc. If only ppl stopped being so scared and the fgc just let mlg help us out. Until then, the evo champ for sf will get only like 5k nd etc. Strategy stepped up, fighting games should as well for real, REAL TALK

 

[CrimsonShadow]

I think everyone missed what @AK Pig Of The Hut is saying.

MOBA events are popular because there are so many players. But Pig isn't talking about advertising to the players. He's saying that an average person has a much better chance of being able to understand watching a fighting game than they will watching LoL.

Sure they might not get all the minute details (just like real sports), but Batman beating up Martian Manhunter is fairly straigtforward to process.

Yes LoL is popular, because it's players watching their own game. If I showed LoL to my Uncle he wouldn't have a clue what's going on. It's like watching Chess if you had no idea how the pieces move.

 

[YOMI MITYEAP]

I think everyone missed what @AK Pig Of The Hut is saying.

MOBA events are popular because there are so many players. But Pig isn't talking about advertising to the players. He's saying that an average person has a much better chance of being able to understand watching a fighting game than they will watching LoL.

Sure they might not get all the minute details (just like real sports), but Batman beating up Martian Manhunter is fairly straigtforward to process.

Yes LoL is popular, because it's because it's players watching their own game. If I showed LoL to my Uncle he wouldn't have a clue what's going on. It's like watching Chess if you had no idea how the pieces move.

oh yeah, I and others get what pig wants, I think deathbloom was just stating facts about strategy games vs fighting games when it comes to prize pots and stuff. I'm sure ppl would love watching dc heroes, this is America, we love our heroes

 

[F4tal]

Any podcast P2W is on pretty much turns into him bitching about NRS the whole time and talking about how the TYM shouldn't be allowed to talk about high level play.

 

[Zoidberg747]

I think everyone missed what @AK Pig Of The Hut is saying.

MOBA events are popular because there are so many players. But Pig isn't talking about advertising to the players. He's saying that an average person has a much better chance of being able to understand watching a fighting game than they will watching LoL.

Sure they might not get all the minute details (just like real sports), but Batman beating up Martian Manhunter is fairly straigtforward to process.

Yes LoL is popular, because it's players watching their own game. If I showed LoL to my Uncle he wouldn't have a clue what's going on. It's like watching Chess if you had no idea how the pieces move.

So what are you implying we do? Sure some non FG player might find two comic characters entertaining for like 10 minutes but the only way they will stick with it is if they have SOME knowledge of whats going on.

If people wanted to get FGs on the map this way I would think Marvel would be better because of how much crazy stuff is happening constantly.

 

[Eric The Scruffy]

So what are you implying we do? Sure some non FG player might find two comic characters entertaining for like 10 minutes but the only way they will stick with it is if they have SOME knowledge of whats going on.

If people wanted to get FGs on the map this way I would think Marvel would be better because of how much crazy stuff is happening constantly.

I don't disagree, but Marvel doesn't have the personalities the NRS community does, and that's the real hook Pig has been hitting on. You can showcase the matches and highlights as a major part of the show and even explain "tech", and the aspect of superheroes fighting is a selling point, but the *real* hook is the personalities.

LNSOCH guys: we are, each and every one of us, pretty goddamn weird to one extent or another. Normal people do not invest hours upon hours counting frames and learning the subtle intricacies of a game like this. Normal people do not spend money to fly all over the country and huddle up in hotel rooms to play a videogame for hours upon hours and have a contest to find "the best" that we all get emotionally invested in to the point of tears in complete disregard for what the payout and/or prestige is that comes with it.
If I try to explain to most people the in depth specifics of the Superman Batman matchup their eyes will probably start to glaze over before I can finish saying "Furward Too Tre", but I can show *anyone* that clip of KDZ smashing his fightstick against the ground and they'll understand it (and in point of fact I have). My mother has never seen a single match of injustice and she probably knows it mostly as "that thing my son makes cute clothing for on the side", but I can show her a 16 bit popoff and she'll have a laugh. We all like to hate on P2W for good reason...but he *is* a pretty unique character.

 

[The PantyChrist]

I think to the average viewer they would wonder how superman could lose to anyone..

 

[Icy Black Deep]

I would think Marvel would be better because of how much crazy stuff is happening constantly.

I got an FPS-playing friend of mine to watch Evo one year and he really got into watching Street Fighter, but when Marvel came on he was like "so is this basically about who doesn't drop their combo?" Even Marvel comentators are like "ok, movie time."

I watch Starcraft even though I don't play the game, and part of what makes it so watchable is a bit of intuitiveness of unit positioning, but a big factor is high-quality commentary. I don't need to know what it means if a player builds a forge 2 minutes in or what kinds of units a player should build to counter his opponent; the commentators are filling me in.
I can't watch LoL. I don't know what's going on--I know the basic mechanics but not heros abilities--and I've never found the commentary particularly helpful.

 

[pherleece]

@AK Pig Of The Hut I could definitely help you out with the project if it ever happens

 

[GGA Jeremiah]

Listening to this PL seems like a very relate-able host. I could feel his struggles as he was arguing with m2dave and playing to win. Very entertaining. Also M2dave is also very likable. I like him when he goes pure heel though, but on this show he seems like a tweener.

Also question. Is there anyone that trains in Ohio that is humble?