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Tekken 7 General Discussion Thread - OP Updated With All Tekken Info

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
So what's the early consensus on Geese? I know "good" and "bad" are different in Tekken, but I hear people saying he's broken in one stream or Discord and then saying he's shit and super weak in another.

I have a general understanding of Tekken and can look at tools and understand relative strengths and such, but Geese just works differently, I can't place him myself.
 

Smoke_Of_Finland

Believe in the hop kick
Geese is unsafe in a way similar to Erron Black, you have to take guesses on his command normals and special cancels and if you guess right you can blow him up severely but in actual matches it's hard to quess correctly because he has multiple options in how he wants to build his custom strings and he can just opt to use his jab and df1 only as well. The risk/reward is stacked against him but due to the amount of options the risks are mitigated to some extent.

After watching Fergus and Anakin play Geese I must say it seems most people haven't labbed Geese at all. He is getting away with a lot of bullshit atm.
 

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
Geese is unsafe in a way similar to Erron Black, you have to take guesses on his command normals and special cancels and if you guess right you can blow him up severely but in actual matches it's hard to quess correctly because he has multiple options in how he wants to build his custom strings and he can just opt to use his jab and df1 only as well. The risk/reward is stacked against him but due to the amount of options the risks are mitigated to some extent.

After watching Fergus and Anakin play Geese I must say it seems most people haven't labbed Geese at all. He is getting away with a lot of bullshit atm.
See, I was a little worried about that too.. I don't know the game well of course, but I keep seeing some of his unsafe stuff just work.. or go unpunished and I wondered about that. He has some nice mids and s decent handful of safe stuff, on top of being able to cancel certain normals into MAX mode and effectively making them + on block, so I guess I didn't really think of him as super super unsafe, ill have to look at that.

His damage is.. weird? I guess. I feel like he's one of those characters that doesn't do much combo damage but can still delete a health bar QUICK because though he doesn't do 65+ damage off every launch like a lot of characters, he does get chunky damage off everything. His ground throw tacks damage on to all kinds of stuff, including his 50/50, which I THINK is +ob in Max mode isn't it? I think.. I mean yeah, he def can hit super hard off some really basic shit, at the wall for a bar he can turn out 60+ damage off like 11/12f punishes, and if you spend the bar and go all out, he can do solid damage but that's throwing your resources down the drain - and he NEEDS those resources.

All in all I really like what im seeing so far, he has a compact tool kit that's not terribly large, but it's thorough, and all the little interactions and extra damage pickups and his weird wall bounce and all his other stuff make him more complex than he might seem at first (imo)..

His game plan is an odd ball to me as well.. he has a lot of distance eating stuff, numerous ways to hit you from a good way out while putting himself back in, but his frame data and moveset in general dont scream rushdown.. he can get +ob off damn near anything with MAX mode but that's a big resource expenditure, not often there and of course,tricky to use. He has a WR 1 or 2 I forget which, that screams IM PLUS ON BLOCK, but it's not and it's a weird tool to use to charge in just to make your turn go away. Then he has some decent ch tools and of course he has a "zoning" game - in that he has fireballs. These are relevant in some MUs from what I've seen. He has his 50/50..then let's not forget his parry's - which I don't use used nearly as much as I thought I would.

I guess he's meant to play slow and defensive at the start of things, playing back and carefully, then as you build meter and get more confident in your reads you move in, threatening some negative stuff with the ability to MAX cancel and collect a CH, but the parrys confuse me, I swear I read they are like i15-16 or something, which makes them kinda hard to use I'd think? For a tool that was supposed to be integral to his design. I may be totally wrong here though, haven't looked into his parrys much but it seems like you need a very very hard read to make them work.. usually parrys exist to make the poking game vs you more dangerous or to cover gaps in your frames and make potential punishment riskier, in not sure how his slot into this yet.

But all that said, I still think he's good. I want to see how his MAX and party meta evolve, but imo he has the potential to be very very strong.

Strongly considering playing him as my character, alongside a traditional Tekken character of some kind. If I could solve the mystery of my left side electrics, Jin or DJin would be in the running too.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
Still too early to tell imo.

I think Goose its going to reward more in the future people who knows and understand where to use his tools the most.
His Atemis are insane, his pressure game is insane, goose with meter is insane.

But his damage output without meter, even some of his pressure falls off a bit, don't think he should be buffed currently, he is fine where he is.

Ppl telling Goose is trash are ppl who never played Jin before, they mobility its kinda the same, Goose also can't randomly throw shits in the screen, and his panic moves are pretty much his parries, so you can't exactly maul him relentlessly without being afraid of some shit he can do.
 

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
He's definitely fun.

Easy combos too. I remember when he released and during combo vids and such that I was watching people saying how hard his combos were and to just stick with it! Etc etc, so when I sat down to try him out I was envisioning this really difficult grind.. and I pretty much hit them all without any issue after a few minutes practice.. then I remembered that cancels and circle motions are super rare in Tekken. I'm not patting myself on the back or anything it was just funny, coming from the mixed FG background that I do all that was second nature, lol.

Today I choose a main. I have my list and nothing left to look into except a little more info on Katarina, then ill make my decision. My GF is really rooting for Lucky Chloe... Asked her to help me and she say Chloe and refused to even look at anyone else.

Also, totally random.. does Jin look.. strangely proportioned to anyone else? I know.. this is stupid, but I picked him in customize mode and noticed while his model was on screen that something just looked off. It looks like his upper body is too big for his legs or something. I dunno.. but once I saw it, I can't un-see it now, I had my GF look and she swears im seeing things BUT I CANT UN-SEE IT. it's like his legs are built to a slightly smaller scale. Not skinny, he didn't skip leg day, but.. damn.
 
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EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
I gotta say, leaning towards Katarina.. mobile, fast, good range on some of her kicks and such, great poke game, easy and fun combo routes, decent lows, good + frames and safety in her poking game with some high risk/high reward game play to spice things up.

I keep reading that she's this risky high reward character, but I guess I don't see how she's defined as that, not that she isnt - she has launch punishable lows that lead into strong damage in many situations, but she seems to gave decent range and safety on a lot of things.. Including a safe, mid, low crushing, high range launcher, 444 string, and a couple lows that aren't safe exactly but don't lead to launch punish either. Seems like she's only as unsafe as you want her to be.. but then, no dangerous low that's not launch punishable, so I guess vs a strong player that just turtles up and tanks out the small damage lows, you'd have to take risks, I guess that's where the reputation comes from?
 

Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
I gotta say, leaning towards Katarina.. mobile, fast, good range on some of her kicks and such, great poke game, easy and fun combo routes, decent lows, good + frames and safety in her poking game with some high risk/high reward game play to spice things up.

I keep reading that she's this risky high reward character, but I guess I don't see how she's defined as that, not that she isnt - she has launch punishable lows that lead into strong damage in many situations, but she seems to gave decent range and safety on a lot of things.. Including a safe, mid, low crushing, high range launcher, 444 string, and a couple lows that aren't safe exactly but don't lead to launch punish either. Seems like she's only as unsafe as you want her to be.. but then, no dangerous low that's not launch punishable, so I guess vs a strong player that just turtles up and tanks out the small damage lows, you'd have to take risks, I guess that's where the reputation comes from?
The reason they hate her is her fast kicks. She's my main along with Eddy. She has the easy B(I think)3+4, which is an armored distancing kick. It's a good move punishing any move. The hard part is to land a good combo, and it's kind of confusing, because some of her moves are special canceable into her forward dash (F3) into one of her charging attacks (even her Rage Drive).

Once I get my fightstick painted, I plan to train with her to find a good and powerful combo that I can easily use.
 

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
The reason they hate her is her fast kicks. She's my main along with Eddy. She has the easy B(I think)3+4, which is an armored distancing kick. It's a good move punishing any move. The hard part is to land a good combo, and it's kind of confusing, because some of her moves are special canceable into her forward dash (F3) into one of her charging attacks (even her Rage Drive).

Once I get my fightstick painted, I plan to train with her to find a good and powerful combo that I can easily use.
Yeah, you shouldn't have much trouble finding strong combos, she got some mean ones. I'm on mobile atm so I can't remember the notation off the top.of my head but its something like

Launcher d2 df1 (can't remember spin) s! Deep run up df1 d2~f~3 , something to that effect. I'll double check when I can. It's 65 damage if I remember right. There is a version with less will carry and more damage that's like

Launch d2 df1 b22 (or 22, can't remember) s! Dash up 444~f~3. It's easier to me, and looks swaggier (style matters on Kat lol) but the two or three extra damage isn't worth the lack of wall carry, especially with her idiot wall game options.

Don't take the notations as written in stone though, when I get home I'll post the correct ones, that's just the general idea.

Fortunately or unfortunately depending on how you look at it I guess, her harrier stance (the forward dash) isn't all that great, and by extension isn't all that complex lol. Outside combos it's ok heavily used, but I can see some applications for it here and there. Har1 and uf3 being the most useful with that low.. 4?.being nice to check a bitch, but at higher levels I could see that low losing games, unless.its a surprise option to close an important round.
 

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
Good news, Im making a blog. So I'll transfer my random walls of bullshit and pointless ramblings there. It still feels like I'm "talking" to someone, only there's no one to annoy, so it's a win all around.

In the meantime... I'm pretty sure I've got it. Katarina and Miguel.

So, I was leaning heavily on Gigas and Geese.. and thinking of adding a 3rd character. Geese is attractive because his small moveset is very focused, it's easy to see what it's meant for most of the time. Gigas is attractive because his punish game is VERY basic, but at 10-11fs, hell even are 12 and 13 (though less so) it's massively powerful, and his moveset is smaller and pretty straight forward with great great pokes, a couple quite passable lows, and his range adds an element of safety. Throw in golem stance cancels to make things a little safer, and his goliath mix.. very cool character that I can understand.

But I decided against them. Gigas.. I know what will happen with Gigas. I'm never comfortable on big, slow characters, and when I play him I'll always feel a little off. And Geese, Geese was a harder choice to un-make, but ultimately, why I decided against him were the reasons I originally decided for him.. I'm used to circle motions, and cancels, and jumping offense and meter management... But the whole point of Tekken is something different. Sticking to just what I already know doesn't feel like the right idea. The familiarity is great, but at the same time, I want to do something different, and I LOVE that Tekken doesn't require meter. I don't mind meter exactly but it's such a cool feeling to know all of your character is there, and you can let loose with everything you have every chance that comes up. No need to worry about conservation or if you have it, or.havr enough, blah blah. Your character is your character. I really like that, and it's liberating, especially after playing Inj2 for so long, where meter is required for everything. You have to shadowbox in your living room for 45 seconds to build up a bar of meter to use to open the damn game.

So. Miguel was recommended to me here by @buyacushun , and I had looked at him somewhat previously but really glossed him over.. on that recommendation I went back and did some more research, and TheFrameWhisperer has some great Miguel resources and vids, and that's fantastic.. so after some deeper digging , he looks good. He's got everything with an emphasis on pokes and pressure and that's something I want in a character. His stance and general setup mean he's as deep as you want him to be, but he has a basic straight up gameplan that will work while I build on him. Hes also a badass and I love how his moves look, how he looks and his mobility is actually really good. Amazing backdash and he's speedy, which you wouldn't expect from a big guy like that.

Katarina was next. She's just damn fun. Super straight forward, pressure, mobility, easy and simple execution, nice lows, good range.. she just feels fast and fluid and fun to play. Her conversions are simple and easy to do, her CH game is easy to understand. I didn't even have her on my list initially, but researched her anyway, and just REALLY enjoyed how she feels. (There's a joke in there somewhere)

And yeah, I shouldn't play two characters. But I know myself well enough that if I don't, I'll feel pigeon holed in, and I'll start second guessing myself and it will lead to the main character loop i get stuck in so often. Pretty damn happy and confident in my choices. Gonna take a day or two to lab and get some basic combos down, then head online and see how things work out.
 

Smoke_Of_Finland

Believe in the hop kick
I found some nice oki tech with Heihachi. If you finish the usual EWGF - EWGF - f2,3 - bf2,3 S! combo with f2,3 on an infinite stage, you can dash into d3 and if you time it properly you get to force it on block on back roll and tech rolls in both directions. All wakeup attacks get stuffed/CH'd by the d3 except that Bruce Lee getup (hold f for the duration of a combo to have it come out) d3 whiffs on it and Heihachi gets punished for 4 points of damage. Most importantly, the 3+4 handspring gets stuffed and if they stay on the ground they eat the d3 as well.
 

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
PC is still faster.

Wow. I wish the PC playerbase was larger.. when I go to Discords looking for sets there is always a ton of activity in the PS4 section and little to none in Pc.

Oh well , if I like the game enough and decide to stick with it I'll just have to get used to ranked, and I'll pick it up on PS4 anyways.
 

Smoke_Of_Finland

Believe in the hop kick
Wow. I wish the PC playerbase was larger.. when I go to Discords looking for sets there is always a ton of activity in the PS4 section and little to none in Pc.

Oh well , if I like the game enough and decide to stick with it I'll just have to get used to ranked, and I'll pick it up on PS4 anyways.
we could play now if you are on
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
They're almost the same, i mean when was the last time we had a game with a low end 4f of input lag since SF4 and MK9?

The diference isn't really a big number anymore, from 120ms to 80ms is a fucking lot that was taken away.
 

JBeezYBabY

Mr. Righteous
HOLY SHIT BALLS! I TOTALLY FORGOT I HAD AN UPDATE YESTERDAY! So they finally fixed the lag. THANK YA JEEBUS! I'm gonna have to get my "Son Of Prince" Eddy Gordo back in this gig!
 

villainous monk

Terrible times breed terrible things, my lord.
Ok. The infamous lag patch is out. Rejoice and celebrate:D

Tell me please.

Is there STILL (key word here) a difference in the lag input ranked by order of:

PC>Xbox>PS4

Has anyone tested it yet. Or seen a post online.

Also...

Notes from patch 1.10
  • Reduced Input Delay on PS4 & XB1: improved controller input responsiveness.
  • Improvement of overall game stability on PS4, XB1 and PC: increased game performance stability during battle and character customization.
 
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JBeezYBabY

Mr. Righteous
Ok. The infamous lag patch is out.

Tell me.

Is there STILL (key words here) a difference in:

PC>Xbox>PS4

Has anyone tested it yet.

Notes from patch 1.10
  • Reduced Input Delay on PS4 & XB1: improved controller input responsiveness.
  • Improvement of overall game stability on PS4, XB1 and PC: increased game performance stability during battle and character customization.
I haven't tested it out but I have been checking on Tekken's Twitter of people's responses. And overall it seems EVERYBODY is happy with the patch. So basically its completely fixed and everybody is going back to their consoles for online matches :)
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
Ok. The infamous lag patch is out. Rejoice and celebrate:D

Tell me please.

Is there STILL (key word here) a difference in the lag input ranked by order of:

PC>Xbox>PS4

Has anyone tested it yet. Or seen a post online.

Also...

Notes from patch 1.10
  • Reduced Input Delay on PS4 & XB1: improved controller input responsiveness.
  • Improvement of overall game stability on PS4, XB1 and PC: increased game performance stability during battle and character customization.
Its almost the same, the change is so massive that you will notice right away.
It was 7.7, they brought it to 4.8 on PS4, ever since the patch came out my EWHF rate has increased, my drop factor of Jin infamous 100$ combo as reduced a bunch, i'm able to land combos and do moves it was much dificult to do before, like can-can kicks into EWHF, ff3 into ssr EWHF pick ups, 5x EWGF in a row, Kazuya's PEWGF, pretty sure i did Bryan taunt into b4 a few times, the only reason why i wasn't able to do it much often it was because i never practiced that move before.

Still on the goal list to do is taunt jet upper, if i get that, the lag reduction was successful.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
Ok. The infamous lag patch is out. Rejoice and celebrate:D

Tell me please.

Is there STILL (key word here) a difference in the lag input ranked by order of:

PC>Xbox>PS4

Has anyone tested it yet. Or seen a post online.

Also...

Notes from patch 1.10
  • Reduced Input Delay on PS4 & XB1: improved controller input responsiveness.
  • Improvement of overall game stability on PS4, XB1 and PC: increased game performance stability during battle and character customization.
Its almost the same, the change is so massive that you will notice right away.
It was 7.7, they brought it to 4.8 on PS4, ever since the patch came out my EWHF rate has increased, my drop factor of Jin infamous 100$ combo as reduced a bunch, i'm able to land combos and do moves it was much dificult to do before, like can-can kicks into EWHF, ff3 into ssr EWHF pick ups, 5x EWGF in a row, Kazuya's PEWGF, pretty sure i did Bryan taunt into b4 a few times, the only reason why i wasn't able to do it much often it was because i never practiced that move before.

Still on the goal list to do is taunt jet upper, if i get that, the lag reduction was successful.
 

Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
Speaking of input lag and such, I have a question that only the experts would understand, so colour me a bit ignorant about this.

Why haven't they found a way to reduce the input lag to 1ms? That hard?
 

villainous monk

Terrible times breed terrible things, my lord.
Its almost the same, the change is so massive that you will notice right away.
It was 7.7, they brought it to 4.8 on PS4, ever since the patch came out my EWHF rate has increased, my drop factor of Jin infamous 100$ combo as reduced a bunch, i'm able to land combos and do moves it was much dificult to do before, like can-can kicks into EWHF, ff3 into ssr EWHF pick ups, 5x EWGF in a row, Kazuya's PEWGF, pretty sure i did Bryan taunt into b4 a few times, the only reason why i wasn't able to do it much often it was because i never practiced that move before.

Still on the goal list to do is taunt jet upper, if i get that, the lag reduction was successful.
Yeah I saw the numbers. This is massive. My friend is saying the same thing on his PS4. Already ranked up to usurper with Jin in a few short hours from vanguard. Phenomenal.

I'm still hunting down the numbers for Xbox though. I'm seriously hoping it's just as good because we didn't have the noticable lag difference as much so if it's better then before then I am seriously SERIOUSLY one HAPPY PLAYER!!!

More importantly I can finally take my bryan, heihachi, kazuya online and maybe... Just maybe....

Win a fair one.