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Video/Tutorial - Grandmaster Sub-Zero's Ice Clone doesn't work properly

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mattnin

Noob
Are we sure this is not an intended property of the move now? Aside from teleport characters what good is clone going away on block if you have no tools to consistently hit Sub without going through at least some tiny portion of the clone?
Exactly, great observation DR. Otherwise you could just keep popping clones in the corner and never need to block, the opponent will be trapped. I for one am grateful I can sometimes get through the clone with a poke. Blood God Kotal Kahn has no moves that could deal with a clone other than just wait it out.

The move is working as intended, just adapt and deal with it
 

SaJa

FH_FenriR
In the opposite, it's not normal seeing Ferra (as projectile) not destroying the clone while every projectile of the game can do so.
 

TheIrishFGCguy

Pew pew pew
Exactly, great observation DR. Otherwise you could just keep popping clones in the corner and never need to block, the opponent will be trapped. I for one am grateful I can sometimes get through the clone with a poke. Blood God Kotal Kahn has no moves that could deal with a clone other than just wait it out.

The move is working as intended, just adapt and deal with it
You think the klone is supposed to allow this? You can't be serious... What the hell would be the point of the klone if you could just poke through it lmfao
Don't tell other people to adapt and deal with it when you're talking like a complete idiot.
 

-narshkajke-

klone enthusiast
You think the klone is supposed to allow this? You can't be serious... What the hell would be the point of the klone if you could just poke through it lmfao
Don't tell other people to adapt and deal with it when you're talking like a complete idiot.
let him be man, either he's trolling or he's really afraid of the klone and don't want to level up
 

DoctorSexual

XBL: DoctorSexual PSN: Osh-Tek
Exactly, great observation DR. Otherwise you could just keep popping clones in the corner and never need to block, the opponent will be trapped. I for one am grateful I can sometimes get through the clone with a poke. Blood God Kotal Kahn has no moves that could deal with a clone other than just wait it out.

The move is working as intended, just adapt and deal with it
Yeah im a Kotal main as well
there's a thing called EX move, you do it by adding block button while performing the move,, try it, it's easy,,
Tell me what EX move a character like Blood God Kotal has?
 

mattnin

Noob
You think the klone is supposed to allow this? You can't be serious... What the hell would be the point of the klone if you could just poke through it lmfao
Don't tell other people to adapt and deal with it when you're talking like a complete idiot.
Why the hell would the clone crumble on block if they didn't give the opponent a way to get through it to force a block in the first place? You're a flippin child if you don't understand the logic in that. Go back and QQ and suck your thumb baby
 

TheIrishFGCguy

Pew pew pew
Why the hell would the clone crumble on block if they didn't give the opponent a way to get through it to force a block in the first place? You're a flippin child if you don't understand the logic in that. Go back and QQ and suck your thumb baby
Literally every character in the game can jump over the klone with an aerial attack and make it vanish at close range without getting frozen. Please stop arguing when you clearly don't play the character and have no idea how the klone actually works.

This is a blatant bug, and the fact that you can't see that speaks volumes about your knowledge on the klone.
 

ZeZe

The smart stuff!
Why have a clone if everybody could get rid of it for free?

Edit: NRS should really help us understand how they intended klone to work.
 

FoolishProphet

Still waiting for Jade :\
Exactly, great observation DR. Otherwise you could just keep popping clones in the corner and never need to block, the opponent will be trapped. I for one am grateful I can sometimes get through the clone with a poke. Blood God Kotal Kahn has no moves that could deal with a clone other than just wait it out.

The move is working as intended, just adapt and deal with it
I see where you're coming from,blood god kotal really doesn't have an answer to it.But he has war god that blows grandmaster up.I'm a day one kotal main and I know the struggle but I learned that you really need to pick your variation wisely against certain characters that you otherwise thought you had no advantage against.
 

DoctorSexual

XBL: DoctorSexual PSN: Osh-Tek
Why are people so defensive on these boards? All im doing is trying to present a possible explanation? I really dont have a personal opinion or emotional response either way. Maybe im just ignorant to NRS games but I cant imagine the developers intended for a character to have a single move that completely corner jails certain characters.

And about the jumping attack making clone disappear im pretty sure that in most cases the clone gets touched in the same way it does by standing pokes.
 
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-narshkajke-

klone enthusiast
Yeah im a Kotal main as well


Tell me what EX move a character like Blood God Kotal has?
to break through the klone? none. but you got a 2 sec cooldown, and you can always bait him up and force him to block, it's just the the way sub's play.
blood god kotal can buff his his damage or defense, so breaking through klone is not always the end all be all for going against klone.
 

DoctorSexual

XBL: DoctorSexual PSN: Osh-Tek
Why have a clone if everybody could get rid of it for free?

Edit: NRS should really help us understand how they intended klone to work.
In my opinion its because it was never intended to be used as a repeatable corner trap. There are plenty of other uses for the clone that dont involve requiring it to have a massive pixel perfect hitbox.
 
Nice job at catching that, I was kinda wondering the samething why i call out the clone then standing behide it while recovering and the opponent was in the air then still able to kick through it and hit me? I support this 100%
 

ZeZe

The smart stuff!
In my opinion its because it was never intended to be used as a repeatable corner trap.
It was like that in MK9. It was obvious klone will be mainly a corner trap tool in MKX again. And mind you, Sub0 sucked in MK9 big time. And he could place air clone there, too. People weren't impressed though.
Edit: plus in MK9 clone didn't disappear on block. Sub still sucked. ;)
 

mattnin

Noob
Literally every character in the game can jump over the klone with an aerial attack and make it vanish at close range without getting frozen. Please stop arguing when you clearly don't play the character and have no idea how the klone actually works.

This is a blatant bug, and the fact that you can't see that speaks volumes about your knowledge on the klone.
You're right, I don't play Sub Zero in MKX, but I can tell you I'm not some damn noob that just started playing fighting games. You talk like it's easy for someone to just hurdle the clone and attack Sub Zero. The only time jumping the clone works is on an aggressive jump in while clone is just being set up and the jumping attack happens to hit Sub Zero. When that happens, it's Sub Zero's fault, should've popped the clone sooner. By the way, the only time I am ever lucky enough to get a poke through the clone is when a GM Sub pops it in the corner attempting a trap. When that happens, a Blood God Kotal has very few options. Usually, it's a waiting game but if the range is just right, my S1 will maybe get through without getting frozen.

Like I said before, I'm glad I can sometimes get through the clone this way and attempt some offense while Sub Zero gets to decide if he should overhead into a full combo, throw me into the clone, or low hit me into a combo.
 

DoctorSexual

XBL: DoctorSexual PSN: Osh-Tek
Also.. And this will be my last argument for it working as intended.. How can you complain (In general, not talking about Tom here) about hitboxes not being accurate and getting hit behind the clone when Sub is LITERALLY clipping halfway though the clone when he gets hit?
 

-narshkajke-

klone enthusiast
Also.. And this will be my last argument for it working as intended.. How can you complain (In general, not talking about Tom here) about hitboxes not being accurate and getting hit behind the clone when Sub is LITERALLY clipping halfway though the clone when he gets hit?
halfway?

Nice video and thanks Tom for showing the problems that still exist with ice clone. How can anyone argue for limbs to go through the clone and not be frozen.

Here's a "frozen" snapshot to better illustrate the problem for everyone who doesn't see it.

 

STK

Beso de Muerte + Fantasía Oscura
i always thought ex clone was buggy. It has armor. and its faster than ex slide. so why cant you put out ex clone on block like you can ex slide? for example if you block Cassie b124 you can blow the 4 up with ex slide but not ex clone??
 

I GOT HANDS

Official Infrared Scorp wid gapless Wi-Fi pressure
Exactly, great observation DR. Otherwise you could just keep popping clones in the corner and never need to block, the opponent will be trapped. I for one am grateful I can sometimes get through the clone with a poke. Blood God Kotal Kahn has no moves that could deal with a clone other than just wait it out.

The move is working as intended, just adapt and deal with it
"Just adapt and deal with it, like we all did when we whinged nonstop till Sub was nerfed and the changes left his mechanics broken"

What you are saying is ironic, we are only asking for a bug fix, for a bug that is literally only relevant because of all the whinging from people like you who COULDNT adapt and level up.



So basically, you want ice clone buffed so you can trap people behind it so they can't have and offensive options whatsoever. Got it. Just play the game and quit whining about your already powerful character.
On a scale of one to "has-zero-awareness-and-accidently-runs-into-clone-everytime", how mad would you say you are right now about losing to a a lower tier character with zero impact on the competitive scene everytime you play against him?
There is an obvious explanation to why this is, you need to learn your match ups and level up, because your perspective on how he plays is only accurate for low level play
 
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SEV

Noob
Not a justification, but rather a possible explanation: maybe because it's a 3D fighter being played in a 2D layout; I don't know how the game is made but if hit/hurt boxes are in 3D, rather than 2D, the hurtboxes of the attacks might not be colliding with the hitboxes of the clone. Is that possible? If so is that by design? If not maybe they can alter the widths of the clones hitbox so fix it.
 

Jynks

some heroes are born, some made, some wondrous
dose anyone know if you do not block with sub zero.. if this "bug" still happens... maybe it is like blocking when ducking a fireball... no block.. it goes over your head.. with block.. it hits you.. Could be something like that? Perhaps if you do not block at all, they will not connect with your block hitbox or w/e (I'm to as techy guy)
 

DoctorSexual

XBL: DoctorSexual PSN: Osh-Tek
Im like 99% sure now that being able to poke through is an intended effect. Take a look at this. Im using Kotal here and my D4 hits. However my B4 gets frozen. Same exact animation for both moves, so you must assume same hitbox? D4 is a poke whereas B4 is a hard knockdown.

 
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