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EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
I think I have decided to start over in SFIV on Ryu. Back to basics. Hit me up on steam for IV games.

I also ha w to learn SF with a pad , lots of transitions to make
 
What makes you think Ryu is low tier can I ask? I peformed my best with him just playing the classic Shoto game. He doesn't quiet have the dirt some of the other characters have I'll admit, but he's like a rock I feel. Perhaps I didn't play as skilled players as you did but I had an 18 game win streak which I was pretty chuffed with lol.
Ryu has way too many bad match ups. In so many MUs Ryu just doesn't have the tools to counter stuff properly.
The 39 nerfs which Ryu has received over the last few betas => 38 of those nerfs were still here in phase 3.
Ryu's current vortex is jump in 2x st.mp => most good players will block this easily.
Empty jumps rarely work vs strong player and it's difficult to hit confirm into any combos.
This is just my experience so far.
Capcom needs to give him his cross up tatsu & some of his corner combos back, right now he won't be able to keep up on tournament lvl IMO.
 

EMPEROR PRYCE

WAR SEASON "THE WEAK EXPOSED!"
Ryu has way too many bad match ups. In so many MUs Ryu just doesn't have the tools to counter stuff properly.
The 39 nerfs which Ryu has received over the last few betas => 38 of those nerfs were still here in phase 3.
Ryu's current vortex is jump in 2x st.mp => most good players will block this easily.
Empty jumps rarely work vs strong player and it's difficult to hit confirm into any combos.
This is just my experience so far.
Capcom needs to give him his cross up tatsu & some of his corner combos back, right now he won't be able to keep up on tournament lvl IMO.
For the early weeks of the game maybe (commenting on your last comment). It's VERY hard to judge match ups during the beta of a game. Especially street fighter. We simply don't understand don't understand the meta of THIS game enough yet.

Have you been experimenting what normals and specials can be punished with v reversal and v skill? I think things like that and how you bait peoples v reversals out is going to play a VERY big part in the meta of this game.
 

RM_NINfan101

Nine Inch Nails fan from Metro Detroit, Michigan
Yeah I gotta agree with Pryce, I do think the meta is going to be evolved with V-Reversals and the meta will be more about who can deal with pressure and staggers with and without V-Reversals. SFV is already really heavy on stagger strings and block strings and so V-Reversals will play a key role. It's how I was able to deal with some pressure from characters like Nash and Necalli.
 

Scott The Scot

Where there is smoke, there is cancer.
Ryu has way too many bad match ups. In so many MUs Ryu just doesn't have the tools to counter stuff properly.
The 39 nerfs which Ryu has received over the last few betas => 38 of those nerfs were still here in phase 3.
Ryu's current vortex is jump in 2x st.mp => most good players will block this easily.
Empty jumps rarely work vs strong player and it's difficult to hit confirm into any combos.
This is just my experience so far.
Capcom needs to give him his cross up tatsu & some of his corner combos back, right now he won't be able to keep up on tournament lvl IMO.
That's fair enough then, thanks for the answer!
 

GAV

Resolution through knowledge and resolve.
Watching, Dhalsim looks so good. The only poking characters I have ever been able to play effectively have been Tam Tam (SS1and5) and Fei Long (SSF2). Everyone else, I have fallen flat with. Dhalsim looks so good though, so I'm going to try him first - but I'll probably end up playing someone else because I'm just not patient.
 

Gamer68

Fujin!

Read more about it here: https://www.reddit.com/r/StreetFighter/comments/3xtsct/beta_sfv_the_same_match_recorded_differently_from/

I will quote /u/Hatson here:


"Wow. This explains SO much. Of why the laggy rollback matches felt like I was getting CH'd all day and no matter what I tried to do I couldn't do anything as seemingly they were invinc and I was just a dummy set to CH.

People commenting here saying "this seems ok", you are clearly not looking at this in slow-motion properly. There are many things glaringly wrong in either players rollbacks here. Where one thing happens and then due to rollback, turns into an entirely different thing and PUNISHES the other player that happened to be on the wrong side of the rollback at that moment.

Nash's PoV was a lot more laggy than Karin's PoV. Countless situations were it seemed Karin blocked but Nash actually hit and he could have hit confirmed it but didn't because on his screen it didn't even register as a hit until way too late. And lots of moments where it shows him hitting, but then turns into a block and he gets CH'd for trying to go for the hit confirm...

This even caused the Nash player to get blown the fuck up first round due to several unfavorable rollbacks in a row, that were only unfair for him.

Look at the first round air resets and Nash's wakeups before he gets stunned. Put the video to 0.25 speed and you'll see what's really happening from Nash's PoV (right side). He is waking up with grabs a few times, where it looks like he grabbed Karin (you can see her teleporting for a few frames, as if the grab animation is starting up), but then his Grab turns into her CH him instead into a combo. Even though on his screen he won by Grab, but the rollback turned it into a CH combo instead for the Karin.

This happens 2 or 3 times on Nash's wakeup. Where he does in fact win her with a grab, even for quite a few frames towards the end of the round, but again it turns into a CH for the Karin.

Timestamps for BS rollback (put to 0.25 speed):

0:39 air reset turns Nash's meaty on block into a CH and a combo for Karin.

0:43 wakeup tech turns Nash's throw into a CH and combo for Karin.

0:53 wakeup tech turns Nash's throw (very far into Nash's grab animation) into a CH and victory for Karin.

1:20 Nash's blocked hit turns into a CH + combo for Karin.

1:26 Nash's wakeup jab hit turns into a CH for Karin

1:36 Nash's v-trigger startup get stuffed twice by Karin's pokes, even though that should drain Nash's meter for activating V-trigger. But the rollback makes it so as if Nash never even did V-trigger in the first place (look on Karin's PoV, he never even V-triggered from her PoV). The game turns his v-trigger activations into hits for Karin instead.


GG. Nash couldn't react or do shit as everything he tried to do ended up terrible for him due to rollback that was extremely laggy from his PoV. But from Karin's it was pretty smooth and easy victory for her. As if the Nash was just mashing buttons on wakeup. When in fact he was doing throw tech reads, that he even won, but the game turned it into a CH for Karin instead because what he saw on screen wasn't what was actually happening for real.

This doesn't seem fair at all. On his screen, Karin wasn't even doing a meaty at all, so he goes for the grab expecting her to grab, but even though he wins a grab on his screen, it just turns into a stupid rollback CH for her. What the fuck?

This happened way too many times to me online during the Beta. It's especially bad for characters with 0 reversals like Nash, it seems, because he has to commit to blocking or reading a tech grab situation. But in rollback it's impossible to even commit to teching, if this is what always happens instead. And blocking in rollback is just the worst thing ever, suddenly they've teleported into the air and you have no time to react, or you get rollbacked into a command grab.

Great. :I

Well, at least the GOOD connections were absolutely flawless with 0 rollback and 0 input delay. It felt like playing offline almost, very smooth experience. But the bad connections were just beyond awful, especially when TRYING to play defensive, which does fuck all for you in rollback where teching turns into CH combos on yourself, and blocking turns into teleporting jumps and command grabs.
"
 

TrulyAmiracle

Loud and Klear~
Yeah i had many instances that made no sense if the match has some lag, from people hitting me mid throw animation or DPing mid hitstun or magically teleporting to the other side of the screen. Hell at one point i was throwing fireballs and the opponent had no health and everytime it showed him being hit and killed then few frames later he's walking and doing shit.. Like wtf no.
When it was smooth the matches were good but the laggy ones were some of the worst I've played in any FG.
At least in SF4 or MK laggy matches what happens on screen makes sense instead of rollbacks and teleports that literally break the game.
 

RoboCop

The future of law enforcement.
Former Owner
Premium Supporter
I thought Laura seemed pretty good. Multi-hitting projectile that can be charged or released early for mind-games, solid oki setups, awesome damage, decent buttons, solid special pressure, etc.
 

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
It's a beta. It was specifically geared towards testing the netcode and other systems..

Bringing this to light is absolutely a good idea. That's the point of betas, to root out issues and correct them. I'm just cautioning people not to get too salty or worried, as I'm sure stuff like this will.be addressed.

That does.supsr suck and kinda explains a match I had.vs a Ryu that simply.made no sense. I was being comboed magically
 

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust

Read more about it here: https://www.reddit.com/r/StreetFighter/comments/3xtsct/beta_sfv_the_same_match_recorded_differently_from/

I will quote /u/Hatson here:


"Wow. This explains SO much. Of why the laggy rollback matches felt like I was getting CH'd all day and no matter what I tried to do I couldn't do anything as seemingly they were invinc and I was just a dummy set to CH.

People commenting here saying "this seems ok", you are clearly not looking at this in slow-motion properly. There are many things glaringly wrong in either players rollbacks here. Where one thing happens and then due to rollback, turns into an entirely different thing and PUNISHES the other player that happened to be on the wrong side of the rollback at that moment.

Nash's PoV was a lot more laggy than Karin's PoV. Countless situations were it seemed Karin blocked but Nash actually hit and he could have hit confirmed it but didn't because on his screen it didn't even register as a hit until way too late. And lots of moments where it shows him hitting, but then turns into a block and he gets CH'd for trying to go for the hit confirm...

This even caused the Nash player to get blown the fuck up first round due to several unfavorable rollbacks in a row, that were only unfair for him.

Look at the first round air resets and Nash's wakeups before he gets stunned. Put the video to 0.25 speed and you'll see what's really happening from Nash's PoV (right side). He is waking up with grabs a few times, where it looks like he grabbed Karin (you can see her teleporting for a few frames, as if the grab animation is starting up), but then his Grab turns into her CH him instead into a combo. Even though on his screen he won by Grab, but the rollback turned it into a CH combo instead for the Karin.

This happens 2 or 3 times on Nash's wakeup. Where he does in fact win her with a grab, even for quite a few frames towards the end of the round, but again it turns into a CH for the Karin.

Timestamps for BS rollback (put to 0.25 speed):

0:39 air reset turns Nash's meaty on block into a CH and a combo for Karin.

0:43 wakeup tech turns Nash's throw into a CH and combo for Karin.

0:53 wakeup tech turns Nash's throw (very far into Nash's grab animation) into a CH and victory for Karin.

1:20 Nash's blocked hit turns into a CH + combo for Karin.

1:26 Nash's wakeup jab hit turns into a CH for Karin

1:36 Nash's v-trigger startup get stuffed twice by Karin's pokes, even though that should drain Nash's meter for activating V-trigger. But the rollback makes it so as if Nash never even did V-trigger in the first place (look on Karin's PoV, he never even V-triggered from her PoV). The game turns his v-trigger activations into hits for Karin instead.


GG. Nash couldn't react or do shit as everything he tried to do ended up terrible for him due to rollback that was extremely laggy from his PoV. But from Karin's it was pretty smooth and easy victory for her. As if the Nash was just mashing buttons on wakeup. When in fact he was doing throw tech reads, that he even won, but the game turned it into a CH for Karin instead because what he saw on screen wasn't what was actually happening for real.

This doesn't seem fair at all. On his screen, Karin wasn't even doing a meaty at all, so he goes for the grab expecting her to grab, but even though he wins a grab on his screen, it just turns into a stupid rollback CH for her. What the fuck?

This happened way too many times to me online during the Beta. It's especially bad for characters with 0 reversals like Nash, it seems, because he has to commit to blocking or reading a tech grab situation. But in rollback it's impossible to even commit to teching, if this is what always happens instead. And blocking in rollback is just the worst thing ever, suddenly they've teleported into the air and you have no time to react, or you get rollbacked into a command grab.

Great. :I

Well, at least the GOOD connections were absolutely flawless with 0 rollback and 0 input delay. It felt like playing offline almost, very smooth experience. But the bad connections were just beyond awful, especially when TRYING to play defensive, which does fuck all for you in rollback where teching turns into CH combos on yourself, and blocking turns into teleporting jumps and command grabs.
"
So Starbucks wifi loses to fast wired connections? I have zero problem with that.
 

PunkMafia83

PSN: YaRnToNpUnKMAFIA
Hey guys. If you had to describe the combo system, what would you describe it as? Is it like sf 4 or maybe similar to a different game? Looking for a fighting game for 2016!

Thanks!
 

HeroesNZ

Baconlord's Billionaire Sugar Daddy
Hey guys. If you had to describe the combo system, what would you describe it as? Is it like sf 4 or maybe similar to a different game? Looking for a fighting game for 2016!

Thanks!
It's pretty much the same as SF4 with the whole 'linking' aspect, just with a few differences here and there such as instead of FADCs we have V-Triggers.
 

14K

Noob
This Confirms exactly point by point my post a few back in beta phase 1, that ppl can actually go back to the first few pages of this thread and read, to sume it up i said that on a couple instances that the netcode seemed to be a bit off, on those matchs and cases happened that i was just standing still blocking and took fireballs to the face, another case where a Chun li put me in a blockstring into her super and i got opened up mid way on the block string and was left there going like WTF!???... No one was reporting similar problems so i just took it as im crazy... But it seems i really wasnt lol.. Nice to know
 

mercureXI

Punching bag that throws fans !

Read more about it here: https://www.reddit.com/r/StreetFighter/comments/3xtsct/beta_sfv_the_same_match_recorded_differently_from/

I will quote /u/Hatson here:


"Wow. This explains SO much. Of why the laggy rollback matches felt like I was getting CH'd all day and no matter what I tried to do I couldn't do anything as seemingly they were invinc and I was just a dummy set to CH.

People commenting here saying "this seems ok", you are clearly not looking at this in slow-motion properly. There are many things glaringly wrong in either players rollbacks here. Where one thing happens and then due to rollback, turns into an entirely different thing and PUNISHES the other player that happened to be on the wrong side of the rollback at that moment.

Nash's PoV was a lot more laggy than Karin's PoV. Countless situations were it seemed Karin blocked but Nash actually hit and he could have hit confirmed it but didn't because on his screen it didn't even register as a hit until way too late. And lots of moments where it shows him hitting, but then turns into a block and he gets CH'd for trying to go for the hit confirm...

This even caused the Nash player to get blown the fuck up first round due to several unfavorable rollbacks in a row, that were only unfair for him.

Look at the first round air resets and Nash's wakeups before he gets stunned. Put the video to 0.25 speed and you'll see what's really happening from Nash's PoV (right side). He is waking up with grabs a few times, where it looks like he grabbed Karin (you can see her teleporting for a few frames, as if the grab animation is starting up), but then his Grab turns into her CH him instead into a combo. Even though on his screen he won by Grab, but the rollback turned it into a CH combo instead for the Karin.

This happens 2 or 3 times on Nash's wakeup. Where he does in fact win her with a grab, even for quite a few frames towards the end of the round, but again it turns into a CH for the Karin.

Timestamps for BS rollback (put to 0.25 speed):

0:39 air reset turns Nash's meaty on block into a CH and a combo for Karin.

0:43 wakeup tech turns Nash's throw into a CH and combo for Karin.

0:53 wakeup tech turns Nash's throw (very far into Nash's grab animation) into a CH and victory for Karin.

1:20 Nash's blocked hit turns into a CH + combo for Karin.

1:26 Nash's wakeup jab hit turns into a CH for Karin

1:36 Nash's v-trigger startup get stuffed twice by Karin's pokes, even though that should drain Nash's meter for activating V-trigger. But the rollback makes it so as if Nash never even did V-trigger in the first place (look on Karin's PoV, he never even V-triggered from her PoV). The game turns his v-trigger activations into hits for Karin instead.


GG. Nash couldn't react or do shit as everything he tried to do ended up terrible for him due to rollback that was extremely laggy from his PoV. But from Karin's it was pretty smooth and easy victory for her. As if the Nash was just mashing buttons on wakeup. When in fact he was doing throw tech reads, that he even won, but the game turned it into a CH for Karin instead because what he saw on screen wasn't what was actually happening for real.

This doesn't seem fair at all. On his screen, Karin wasn't even doing a meaty at all, so he goes for the grab expecting her to grab, but even though he wins a grab on his screen, it just turns into a stupid rollback CH for her. What the fuck?

This happened way too many times to me online during the Beta. It's especially bad for characters with 0 reversals like Nash, it seems, because he has to commit to blocking or reading a tech grab situation. But in rollback it's impossible to even commit to teching, if this is what always happens instead. And blocking in rollback is just the worst thing ever, suddenly they've teleported into the air and you have no time to react, or you get rollbacked into a command grab.

Great. :I

Well, at least the GOOD connections were absolutely flawless with 0 rollback and 0 input delay. It felt like playing offline almost, very smooth experience. But the bad connections were just beyond awful, especially when TRYING to play defensive, which does fuck all for you in rollback where teching turns into CH combos on yourself, and blocking turns into teleporting jumps and command grabs.
"

You can clearly see "teleport" frames, meaning connection is far from good.

Rollback won't fix people using WiFi as if it was a reliable way to play online or people watching streams / downloading their daily porn while playing SF5.

Interesting video though.
 

14K

Noob
I wonder if it has to do with desyncing like KI3 had issues with early on.
Dunno if you can call it desyncing or not but basicly what happens is this, take the ex: of me getting hit by fireballs while blocking, So your opponent in his screen tossed a fireball, naturally since youy are playing footsies you are constantly moving forward bit by bit and blocking if need be, but when you see the fireball you stop and block, if the netcode decides the diference in frames is to big between you and your opponent it will rollyou/him back to a timeframe where things where matching, so if that time frame was one where you where walking forward (not blocking) and him throwing a fireball thats when the game will put you, but remember the fireball is still coming but since the rollback hit you in that moment even tho it seems like you should be blocking, your actually not because you where rolled back to a frametime where you where doing something else. This is an extreme ex: just to explain a point, rollback can make this split frame pushbacks in just a couple frames, and if, by a major unluck you are caught in a rollback in the same instance a fireball would hit ( we are talking very small frame windows most of the time) you will take it in the face even tho you know perfectly well you should have blocked it... Hope this helps
 

14K

Noob
I totally understand how badly it sucks to see a beloved character get kicked in the shins, but Capcom has aggressively adjusted and then rolled back many of.those adjustments, on several characters so far. I REALLY, REALLY would not worry much yet, as I'm betting.the finished , shipped product is WAY different than what we have gotten in the betas
Yeah i believe that as well, Cammy saw the same threatment and she is absulutly fine now, more than fine might i say. Im a chilled guy i like to win just like the next guy but i mostly play videogames and fighting games to have fun and cool stuff, and Vega fits the bill for me, even tho i might have sounded a bit harsh on him, which is deserving but still, i will continue to main him have fun with him and thru hard work ill still win with him...

Heres a couple of my fights for those interested, i didnt have to much time with the beta since well friends birthdays and star wars and all that didnt leave me with alot of free time this weekend but with the small time i could play, it still faired well enouth even with the nerfs and me still figuring out what i could get away with or not, so, some cool matchs and some fun stuff...


@SaltShaker btw my friend, if your interested i have a MU with a Karin that i think you will appreciate considering she was doing a lot of the stuff i was telling you, you shouldnt do because you get punished and lose momentum... i didnt punish to hard considering i was still figuring out the character myself but you can clearly see why doing to much of those unsafe moves can lose you the match, which honestly she had the potential to take...

Anyway Cheers And all Hail the 1080p60Fps GOD ;)
 
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