REO discusses the potential banning of Jacqui in tournaments

[Javoo On Fire]

The whole reason I'm getting at the whole ban Jacqui thing from arn is that he is just doing it to get attention of nrs to stop favoring the character.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

What about God shang? And all of Russia

What about them? Jacqui obviously shouldn't be banned

 

[Zer0_h0ur]

She shouldn't be banned but her and Cassie need to stop being forced down our damn throats

The guy talking about baby wolverine nailed it

 

[NeonGroovyGator]

Historically in NRS games there have been characters twice as powerful as her and with much more bullshit in their kits and even they were nowhere near banworthy.
Also for people saying she should be banned because "NRS favors her" (when there have been many questionable balance decisions in every single NRS game)or because she "sucks as a character", you should never talk about balance or tournament rules again. Grow the fuck up maybe.

 

[Gamer68]

If Upgraded is as much of a problem as these people say (which I doubt it is though), then why not just ban that variation instead of the WHOLE character? First Round KO and Next Gen getting banned makes no sense.

"She's the most complained about character" isn't a good excuse.

 

[Javoo On Fire]

Historically in NRS games there have been characters twice as powerful as her and with much more bullshit in their kits and even they were nowhere near banworthy.
Also for people saying she should be banned because "NRS favors her" (when there have been many questionable balance decisions in every single NRS game)or because she "sucks as a character", you should never talk about balance or tournament rules again. Grow the fuck up maybe.

The only thing I have to say about historically we had broken as shit in the past doesn't mean that shit should fly by now, I don't think she is ban worthy, but if we were to have mk9 cyrax or kabal in a newer modern game should we let that shit fly?

 

[NeonGroovyGator]

The only thing I have to say about historically we had broken as shit in the past doesn't mean that shit should fly by now, I don't think she is ban worthy, but if we were to have mk9 cyrax or kabal in a newer modern game should we let that shit fly?

Those characters compared with the rest of MK11? Sure, they would be opressive af.
Back in the MK9 days, there were still other characters that could compete very reasonably well. It was an entirely different game.

 

[deathstroke187]

i dont think she need to be banned but she is dumb as fuck and the argument go and do well with her is non sense. first of all you dont have to be good to know when some shit is broke or dumb as fuck. Just like real sports some coach and trainers didnt do shit themself but made the greatest players of all time.

jacqui needs a real nerf so she gets to play the game like everyone els. but do not ban her. lets people exposing how dumb she is even more.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

If those posts were made on here they should have been deleted straight away and the posters banned. That sort of bull shit should never be tolerated.

It should have never been allowed not just now.

Part of the reason I brought it up is because yes, I've been cleaning up those posts for months. This is definitely not a recent thing.

 

[NeonGroovyGator]

Not to mention it's not uncommon in this community for people to say every single patch "character X is obviously number 1", "character Y will surely dominate the next major". I wonder how many times they've been right.

 

[Eji1700]

I agree that banning Jacqui would be stupid when characters like Kabal and Cyrax in MK9, Batgirl and Manhunter in INJ1 were allowed to rock, for example.

I don't think Kabal is the greatest example. For the record I'm against banning jaqui, but MK9 and MK11 are very different worlds.

In MK9 you weren't even playable if you couldn't do something damn near degenerate. Cyrax could OHKO you, Kenshi had zoning from hell, and in that world Kabal had EVERY tool. Maybe not the best ones, but still damn good ones, and all while not being meter hungry. I think a kabal ban could've gone either way (and I do wonder if it might have been more interesting if they'd done it), but either way he was degenerate bullshit in a world of degenerate bullshit.

MK11 is sooooo far from that. Fucking scorpion has to meter burn to even get a combo off spear these days. It's a different world. Having a monster like kabal who was good against everyone, but only a bit, isn't quite as bad when you still watch everyone else get to do crazy/fun/insane shit.

Jacqui and friends feel like such outliers because barely anyone else is even playing the same game. It's like a bunch of amateurs playing each other, but one team has a full on pro. It feels off.

If anything I think jacqui shows off (much like geras) how wonky the power level of this game is, and that they really should be buffing the weaker members to keep up rather than having to ban/nerf her.

 

[NeonGroovyGator]

I don't think Kabal is the greatest example. For the record I'm against banning jaqui, but MK9 and MK11 are very different worlds.

In MK9 you weren't even playable if you couldn't do something damn near degenerate. Cyrax could OHKO you, Kenshi had zoning from hell, and in that world Kabal had EVERY tool. Maybe not the best ones, but still damn good ones, and all while not being meter hungry. I think a kabal ban could've gone either way (and I do wonder if it might have been more interesting if they'd done it), but either way he was degenerate bullshit in a world of degenerate bullshit.

MK11 is sooooo far from that. Fucking scorpion has to meter burn to even get a combo off spear these days. It's a different world. Having a monster like kabal who was good against everyone, but only a bit, isn't quite as bad when you still watch everyone else get to do crazy/fun/insane shit.

Jacqui and friends feel like such outliers because barely anyone else is even playing the same game. It's like a bunch of amateurs playing each other, but one team has a full on pro. It feels off.

If anything I think jacqui shows off (much like geras) how wonky the power level of this game is, and that they really should be buffing the weaker members to keep up rather than having to ban/nerf her.

See, this is what I don't get. What's the criteria to say some characters "play a different game"?
Like, I don't see anyone needing to play Jacqui or Cassie to be able to compete, and it's not like the majors for MK11 have lacked in character diversity when compared to other NRS games either. There will always be high tier and low tier characters, but I legitimately don't see how MK11 is any worse than the average NRS game. In my opinion it's actually better than the rest in the sense that you can play stuff other than the top tiers.
In MK9 you were legitimately griefing yourself if you played anything outside of the top 7, maybe, being generous.

 

[Lt. Boxy Angelman]

Those characters compared with the rest of MK11? Sure, they would be opressive af.
Back in the MK9 days, there were still other characters that could compete very reasonably well. It was an entirely different game.

I miss the Rune Trap.

People would throw themselves into the fucking Abyss if they had to deal with the Rune Trap today.

 

[Eji1700]

See, this is what I don't get. What's the criteria to say some characters "play a different game"?
Like, I don't see anyone needing to play Jacqui or Cassie to be able to compete, and it's not like the majors for MK11 have lacked in character diversity when compared to other NRS games either. There will always be high tier and low tier characters, but I legitimately don't see how MK11 is any worse than the average NRS game. In my opinion it's actually better than the rest in the sense that you can play stuff other than the top tiers.
In MK9 you were legitimately griefing yourself if you played anything outside of the top 7, maybe, being generous.

I think you're misunderstanding/i'm not making my point well.

This isn't about tiers as much as it as about tools. Jacqui has a whole bunch of stuff she can setup/do. Her game feels like it's working.

Then you've got someone like noob who's fucking praying for mids/overheads/KB's.

Can you play him? Sure. The tiers aren't that far apart, but it just doesn't change the fact that it feels like half your kit wasn't designed to be used, while someone like jacqui or geras feels like they were given the full kit.

 

[Hara-Killer]

BAN JOKER and SHAO "KHOMBOS"






PS : Give us the option to Ban wifi " Warriors "

 

[Metin]

Still borings somehow.

 

[LaidbackOne]

I think you're misunderstanding/i'm not making my point well.

This isn't about tiers as much as it as about tools. Jacqui has a whole bunch of stuff she can setup/do. Her game feels like it's working.

Then you've got someone like noob who's fucking praying for mids/overheads/KB's.

Can you play him? Sure. The tiers aren't that far apart, but it just doesn't change the fact that it feels like half your kit wasn't designed to be used, while someone like jacqui or geras feels like they were given the full kit.

Lol @ noob praying for Kb's. What are you smoking?

 

[HeavyNorse]

So when did the NRS community decided to copy the Smash community.

I thought I smelled something stinky...

 

[Inzzane_79]

ArnKratos has no clue what he is talking about! Lost all respect I had for that guy after he postet that Jacqui breaks the game and is unbeatable lol

Banning a character..........stupid

 

[Roy Arkon]

ArnKratos has no clue what he is talking about! Lost all respect I had for that guy after he postet that Jacqui breaks the game and is unbeatable lol

Banning a character..........stupid

I feel ya, I myself am a big fan of his and I'm really disappointed by him. This Jacqui ban callout is fucking stupid indeed.

 

[BRAZILIAN SHEEP]

I play this game since day one, and I've seen tier lists from top players and all of them agree: She is completely stupid. I really think that right there....the line between "uow lets try to beat this unfair character on practice mode because good players get gooooadd", and just BS where she plays her game almost completely aside from MK11 and you have to guess and watch everything, is crossed.....I mean....

NRS is not balancing the game as they should, so....some are taking measures. I see that, at least.

The argument "there were broken chars in the past and they weren't banned" just makes no sense. Only because something was not done in the past obviously means that today we cant....what is this? Maybe doing that NRS starts to look at BS in the game more seriously.

Im gonna say something and I know Im gonna get some hate, but I really think that NRS players are in a another level on accepting BS in a competitive game and even supporting that.
You see what REO said....a guy that is talented and deserves all the respect, but....specially the old guys (except maybe for Tom), they competed in games like....just broken as fuck for passion, and when some nowadays try to do something against broken and unreasonable shit, they seem to bug.
MK11 comparing with MK9 and MKX yes, is more balanced...but still have a lot of BS, this is just truth....you are not a loser if you see the truth man.

Im not defending the ban....but this is a sign of people getting tired of BS.

 

[ismael4790]

I play this game since day one, and I've seen tier lists from top players and all of them agree: She is completely stupid. I really think that right there....the line between "uow lets try to beat this unfair character on practice mode because good players get gooooadd", and just BS where she plays her game almost completely aside from MK11 and you have to guess and watch everything, is crossed.....I mean....

NRS is not balancing the game as they should, so....some are taking measures. I see that, at least.

The argument "there were broken chars in the past and they weren't banned" just makes no sense. Only because something was not done in the past obviously means that today we cant....what is this? Maybe doing that NRS starts to look at BS in the game more seriously.

Im gonna say something and I know Im gonna get some hate, but I really think that NRS players are in a another level on accepting BS in a competitive game and even supporting that.
You see what REO said....a guy that is talented and deserves all the respect, but....specially the old guys (except maybe for Tom), they competed in games like....just broken as fuck for passion that some nowadays try to do something against broken and unreasonable shit that they bug.
MK11 comparing with MK9 and MKX yes, is more balanced...but still have a lot of BS, this is just truth....you are not a loser if you see the truth man.

Im not defending the ban....but this a sign of people getting tired of BS.

Besides all the arguments that have been brought to the table above to show that banning idea is stupid, I would like to add one more.

Agendas. Imagine that banning characters became a thing. Who decides which character is banned? Where would be the line? What would be the criteria to determine that a character is really banworthy?

Do you really think some players wouldn't push it to get certain characters that give them problems banned to make their life easier? There is money on the line. They would do it, the same way they lie when talking about tiers to their benefit. If a precedent is set, competitive environment would become more like a debate and propaganda arena to get your most hated character banned, instead of a training arena.

The games are what they are, and the changes in them happen through patches. If something looks wrong, propose realistic normalizations and probably nrs will listen at some point.

 

[BRAZILIAN SHEEP]

Besides all the arguments that have been brought to the table above to show that banning idea is stupid, I would like to add one more.

Agendas. Imagine that banning characters became a thing. Who decides which character is banned? Where would be the line? What would be the criteria to determine that a character is really banworthy?

Do you really think some players wouldn't push it to get certain characters that give them problems banned to make their life easier? There is money on the line. They would do it, the same way they lie when talking about tiers to their benefit. If a precedent is set, competitive environment would become more like a debate and propaganda arena to get your most hated character banned, instead of a training arena.

The games are what they are, and the changes in them happen through patches. If something looks wrong, propose realistic normalizations and probably nrs will listen at some point.

Yes it can happen, and it would be stupid. I agree.

 

[John Grizzly]

We didn’t even ban MK9 Cyrax or Kabal for fuck’s sake. Tell Reo’s washed up ass to shut the hell up.

Did you watch the two fucking minute video?

He doesn't agree with banning Jacqui.

 

[Zer0_h0ur]

LOL I haven't labbed Jacqui in months and I just got re-amazed at her insane mid buttons and stagger frames.

I believe this movement started in order to get NRS attention to nerf this OP absurd character. -2 on buttons, -2 on stagger strings, +2 on stagger strings, 9f mid that outranges pokes, 11f mid, 12f mid, 14f mid, fuck neutral safe on block move, meterless cancels into -2, low opener, OH normal, and FLYING MOVES foh. Balance this character.