General/Other Patch 1.03 Aquaman Nerf Discussion

[SimSim]

Okay so it's not that bad really. A lot of characters can punish it, but doesn't appear many will be able to significantly punish a blocked Trident Scoop.

Yea, no b3/f3 punish at least, but if you want to be ballsy with a b2 xx scoop you will always need to have you trait ready. Not that bad, but it does impact the "just do it" mindset that a lot of aquamen has, and that I too have adapted more than I would like to admit

 

[Tom Brady]

How - you think he is now on blocked scoop Tom Brady ? And how are we going to combo from B2 if we cant confirm it on scoop because the cancel window after the hit is ass ?

You can hit confirm B2, then follow up with B12~scoop.

 

[Clamper]

Yeah but this doesnt work at max range. Whats the point of having a big ranged overhead if it wont do you any good on max range ?

Superman now can punish us with super breath. Great.

If they're still making the adjustments how about finishing them all before releasing patches ? Im gonna play a tournament this weekend on v1.3 and i'll be at disadvantage because NRS tossed a coin and decided to nerf Aquaman first and oh, we'll deal with the rest later.

 

[mr.sagat]

Okay so it's not that bad really. A lot of characters can punish it, but doesn't appear many will be able to significantly punish a blocked Trident Scoop.

The recovery is way worse on block compared to what it used to be. Raven's soul crush used to blow it up on block pretty easily, but now I have about an extra 16 hundreths of a second extra to punish it. It went from Killer Frost not even being able to land her ice projectile on him to being able to easily block and punish with slide into mid 30's with no meter or resetting after a MB command grab.

To the people that "fish" around trying to land trident scoop in footsies this will mean they have to significantly change their game. To the players who hit confirm it, it's not a big deal...just another day playing Aquaman.

I see this change as something that will make a difference in some matchups since it can't be abused like it was before. In other matchups it's not going to make a difference, since some of the cast could already blow it up on block.

 

[Bildslash]

You can hit confirm B2, then follow up with B12~scoop.

From far, where it is safe-ish, this doesn't work. And upclose is full combo punishable if blocked.

 

[WarlordRenegade]

aquaman is my 2nd most played character, but unlike all the DS players im not going to bitch about them nerfing my characterc i think it is a fair nerf

 

[Ben Reed]

Trait nerf is barely a thing. 2 seconds is still MORE than enough time to protect you from the stuff trait is supposed to protect you from. Just watch Brady's matches in ECT top 8 if you need some ideas. The extra second on the cooldown is also trivial to offset given how strong Aquaman's defensive game is.

Scoop nerf gives me some pause but I have no doubt I'll adjust. Scoop will be riskier now against players actually capable of blocking it -- the players you SHOULD be training to beat with Aquaman -- but he still has one of the most dominant defenses in the game (if not THE most dominant). He has a trait that turns at least half the punishes into the game into pathetic single hits (AND potential punishes on those punishes, depending on what he gimped), and he has a tool most other characters would kill for -- the best anti-air in the entire game. In a game where punishing jumps typically relies on whiff punishes or spending bar to armored counterpoke, all Aquaman has to do is creep to sweep range or so and his opponent's jumping offense EVAPORATES. Early, late, crossup, with trivial reactions you kill them all. You lock off the air entirely and force them to play a rigged footsie game against the likes of b1, f1, d1, b2 and b3.

Don't let his unsafety on paper discourage you. This is a character who THRIVES on solid, fundamental play, and as Brady demonstrated at ECT, a MONSTER in the clutch. The only way he's falling out of top is if NRS removes d2 from the game (which, to be fair, they might do by accident when the next DLC character hits...shoutouts to Barbara Gordon and her poor-ass quality control).

 

[MrSoloLobo]

Ok I main Aquaman so here is my input. The db1 nerf doesn't really matter to me because I only use it in combos. Other AM mains should do the same. However, his trait needs to last longer imo. The cooldown is fine, I don't mind, but 2 seconds of it in use is a kind of a joke.

 

[Ben Reed]

2 seconds is MORE than enough for what his trait does, lol. Lemme explain it a little better.

The trick to using his trait is basically using it like an MK breaker/Guilty Gear burst that ONLY works on ground combos. If you do a move that you expect to get punished by a ground string (whether on block or whiff), you wait and watch to see if the opponent hits you with such a string, and when you see your character get hit, you IMMEDIATELY pop trait and start blocking. (DON'T hit trait BEFORE you see your character get hit. That's just plain inefficient.)

It only lasts 2 seconds, but you're only gonna be in hitstun for, like, 1 second NORMALLY. That's BEFORE you trait and gimp the HELL out of the hitstun your opponent can put on you. Even in the fastest-hitting 11 strings (and multi-hit specials such as Deathstroke's guns and Aquaman's Trident Rush), 2 seconds of highly reduced ground hitstun is MORE than enough time to block and avoid or SEVERELY reduce otherwise guaranteed damage. If you escape such a combo with trait and manage to block before getting launched, your trait has done its job. You ruined their punish, and depending on what you traited, you might even get a punish of your own.

The cooldown is minor as well because Aquaman is SUCH a strong character at neutral. If you escape a combo with trait, chances are good that your opponent is going to get very frustrated (because they didn't get their otherwise free punish), very predictable (they knew you were going to trait but they have some angle to try and beat your defense), or both. This all plays into Aquaman's EXTREMELY strong block-anti-air-and-whiff-punish game. If you are a solid player, it's EASY to defend yourself for 8 seconds before your trait comes back up. Most of the stuff that will break your guard as an Aquaman player can't be traited anyway (throws, for the most part).

If you need a visual example of the ways you can use his trait effectively to defend yourself, I highly, HIGHLY reccommend watching the stream archive of the ECT top 8 from this year. Tom Brady's Aquaman does a GREAT job of using trait to save himself in situations where he'd otherwise get blown up.

 

[SimSim]

Actually the trait has some weird properties when it comes to activation: It doesn't work instantly some times: It's like you have to take 1 hit before autoblock, so if you activate it during hitstun, you will take the hit from the next move before starting to block (I am not 100% sure about how this works). Also, to block out of a freeze animation you need to activate the trait before getting freezed: So if superman does one normal in to freeze, and you wait for the string to start and accidentally activate the trait too slow, after you get hit by freeze, Superman will get a free b3 combo on you.

2 sec is more than enough for most situations you want to use it, but having to wait for the punish will be too slow some times. Before nerf, I would recommend any Aquaman to activate it as soon as they confirm that an unsafe move has been blocked, but now I would give the same advice as you because it is more precious.. And that, in my opinion, is a significant nerf.